HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES.

Thames Star, Volume X, Issue 3383, 25 October 1879, Page 2

HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES.

Afternoon Sitting.

The House met at 2.30.

The report of the Auckland Oity West Elections Committee was brought up and read—it finding that the petition was informal. On the motion of Mr Hislop the petition was withdrawn. MORTALITY AT PARIHAKA. Bepiying to Mr Seddon as to whether it was the intention of the Government to ascertain the nature of the epidemic raging amongst the natives at Parihaku, and if found contagious, will necessary precautions be taken to prevent it spreading, Mr Hall said the epidemic was of the nature of a low fever, generally known as camp fever, and it was not contagious. MATTER AFFECTING TEE LIBERTY OP THE SUBJECT. .Replying to Mr Hutchison's question, whether Government will be prepared to introduce a measure to de6ne with some precision what " Contempt of Court" means in law if its judicial interpretation shall be permitted to interfere with freedom of public discussion, whether it ahull or shall not be considered a penal offence, and if an offence whether it shall be competent for a judge to inflict punishment, in regard thereof summarily or only under the legal safeguards which protect the liberty of the subject. The Government said the whole question would be considered during the recess, with a view of framing such a measure. THE GOTEBHOR AND SIB GEOBGE GEEY. The Premier said that he had been asked to lay upon the table correspondence between the Governor and Sir George Grey. His Excellency was agreeable to the correspondence being produced, referring as it did to a conversation the accuracy of which they had been unable to agree about. His .Excellency desired to make an endorsement therein. Under these circumstances if Sir George Grey still desired it the correspondence would be produced. Sir George Grey still thought it would be desirable the correspondence should be produced, a course to which the Premier assented.

. At a later stage of the sitting Sir George Grey reTerted to the,subject. He said lie would consider such an endorsement a continuation of the correspondence, and it would only be fair that lie should be allowed to raalre any remark that might suggest itself to him therein. Mr Hal! thought Sir George Grey had no right to have the last word, after which the subject dropped. TAKING UP THE BUSINESS OF THE COUNTBY. Mr Hall mored that the House go into Committee of Supply. The Hon. member for Port Chalmers had a rote he intended to bring forward in connection with that moti n. "

Mr Macandrew said he desired to go on with the vote, and go to a division at once. He was willing that tho Supply should be granted et once, and that the noconfidence motion should be brought on immediately thereafter. Mr Hall said he was surprised at the statement just now made, but, however, he was prepared to meet the originally expressed wishes of the Opposition, and after obtaining supplies to move tbat all further business be postponed so that the motion might be disposed of at once. Mr Pyke said it had been rumored in the lobbies that a certain section of the House would then vote for a sum of money for public works purposes. He asked if there was any foundation for the ruuiors.

Mr Turnbnll thought that until an answer was given the supplies should be refused. Sir G. Grey moved as an amendment that all correspondence that had passed between the Auckland members and the Government relating to the' terms on which they would vote for the Government be laid before tha House, and if no more correspondence has passed that the state their own terms upon which their votes hare been promised. He said he was told that the Auckland members had agreed to vote with the Government in pursuance of an arrangement made with the Government, and these gentlemen had opposed any coalition until the confidence motion was disposed of. In these circumstances he thought the information asked should be afforded so that all parties might know how they stood. Mr Hall submitted that the amendment was not in order, it was not an official correspondence. They had had correspondence with a great many members as well as Auckland members.

The Speaker ruled that the amendment was in order. Mr Hall said they hoped to have the support of certain Auckland members; they expetfted nothing less since they had had timo to derelope their policy; that was all thft information they could j»i?e. Mr Pitt thought it would be derogatory to the House lo take notice of every idle rumour that might happen to be flying about the lobbies. Mr DeLatour asked them not to assume these rumours to be facts; it would be time cnouth when the division took place to draw such a harsh conclusion ; he for one would refuse to believe such a thing.

Messrs Seddon and J. JB. Fisher and Risiop spoke in similar terms. Mr Turnball suggested that if the Government had an assured majority, the no-confidence motion miijht be decided by the division nor about to take place. Mr Montgomery intimated that he would rote for the amendment. Mr Macandrow denied that anything had been Baid on his side about the diTiiiou of portfolio!. Their intentions

wore to have the vote decided before a word of that kind wa3 spoken. Mr Lnndon said tbat it was true that certain Auckland members had done what wbs imputed to them.

The amendment for the production.of the correspendence was carried, Ministers even voting for it, thereby defeating the intention of the mover, which was to find who were the deserters. The division waa—Ayefi, 31 ; Noes, 5*2.

ONE OF THE SECEDBBS. Mr Header Wood said he was one of | the-four Auckland members alluded to, and he was not in the least ashamed of the position. He had violated no engagement. On the contrary, he submitted he hud remained perfectly true to them. When he contested the Waitemata dis-. trict, he was particularly cautious in the pledges he gave. These pledges were to 'be found in his printed address. They were—'l hat he would support ths,Liberal measures set forth in the Governor's i speech, und that lie would accept Sir I George Grey as leader oF the party. When he came down here, lie did, as a matter of fact, support Sir G. Grey up to the point when he himself went into ! Opposition. He did "so both in public and in private, attending his caucus meetings and otherwise. He opposed the step that was taken in his retiring from the leadership of the party, and he said that was not their policy, and urged that he (Sir G. Grey) should be forced back to the leadership. That fact must be in the | memory of lion, members if they had any memory at all. Sir George himself and Mr Lundon would bear him out lin the point. He also supported another resolution brought for.yard at the caucus in question, a resolution which was moved and carried.-and that resolution was this, that there should be no coalition. The charge made against him was that he had broken his pledge, the pledge he had given was given-under one set of circumstances, however. Could it be called " breaking his pledge," when the circumstances became quite different. Surely it would not for a moment be contended that they were to be found as a party together under all circumstances and for all eternity. They were told that Sir George's retiring from the leadership of the party would bo followed by a large accession of members to its ranks ; the facts, however, werd thai nearly three weeks had elapsed, and they found themselves in the same position in which they then were. It was that which bad caused him to do what he had done. He knew tb-it he would b« branded as a traitor on the one hand, and he might expect to be lauded as a benefactor by the other; for his own part, he was alike indifferent to both expressions of opinion. They had heard a good deal about arrangements made, or proposed to be made, but he thought one* side had very little to say to the other on that subject. He would appeal to his lion, friend, Sir G. Grey as to whether he did not waft to make an arrangement with him. His friend will remember the occasion he sent for him to his office, and told him he had made up his miud to give up leadership of the party, and arranged with Macandr&w that he should be Colonial Treasurer. Now what was the reply he made: he said if ■ he (Sir George Grey) retired it would be contrary to his views/adding that he must, make no such bargain of tho kind with him. Mr Macandrew had told him that he thought it was a mistake to force the Premiership upon him, and proposed that he (Mr Wood) should take that office. He had turned these different circumstances over in his own mind, and the result was that he did not feel at all satisfied ; he felt that he would be occupying a false position, and that he could not expect to have any control over the House or the Government. Subsequently he went to the member for Port Chalmers, and told him so. That gentleman then repeated that he felt as if he was placed in a false position, and that he thought he (Mr Wood) would be a much better man for for it. .It came to this at last that he (Mr Wood) did not know whom he really was following;'he felt hei-wim a wandering sheep without any shepherd. Even if they succeeded in carrying the no-confi-dence vote he did not tee how a Govern- [ xnent was to be formed—a Government at all events that would command the confidence of the House, In those circumstances be went to Mr Swanson,.whom he knew to be an honest and an independent man ; a man who had not only the confidence of his own constituency, but likewise of the whole of the provincial ! district of Auckland. On broaching his I opinions to Mr Swanson, he (Swanson) at once endorsed them, and he said that he too could not see his way out of the difficulty. They then put their heads together, and along with Mr Hurst and Mr Colbeck made tip their minds to inform the Government that they were ready to open negotiations .with them; they saw one of the Ministers who told them that if they went over the Government would undertake to do certain things. The first was that there should be do change in the present educational system, tbat the measures they called the Liberal measures should be carried, and third that an account should be made out showing the expenditure on public works in tho different parts of the colony, and another account showing the expenditure of public works in Auckland, and that of their accounts showed that Auckland had not received a share equivalent to the other districts ; then in some way it should receive the balance shown to be due to it. There was no specific turn stipulated. They thought Auckland had been unfairly dealt by, and had not received a fair share as compared with the South. He would asked whether or hot, under these' Circumstances, whether .they had done right or, wrong. So far, therefore, as he was concerned, that was the position he had taken up in this business, and if horrible things were said of him, he had at. least the satisfaction of feeling in his own mind he had acted honestly and straightforwardly.

Sir George Grey said that he felt no anger at what hud been said; he would confess, however, that he felt a deep sorrow. He intended casting no reflections whatever on anyone; the last speaker and he belonged to the same party. They had conversed together as friends, and had otherwise conducted themselves on friendly and confidential terms. In pursuance thereof, he had told them that proposals were made that he should be made Colonial Treasurer. He made that proposition, That he (Mr Wood) had a natural talent for finance, and that he was better fitted to do good to the country in that way than other gentleman of the party, was a very different thing, however, from asking him to leave hit party and go orer to one holding different views. In Mr Wood's

cane it was one party speaking to a member of another parly : that was a very different thing indeed from the negotiations spoken of as having passed between him and the members of his own particular party. They had been told that when the fact became known that he {Mr Wood) was making terms with the Government, lie was told that he might have made equally good terms with them. The two canes wrro not by any liieens parallel, aud the Opposition were perfectly justified in making such a proposition to one of its members who had begun to show, symptoms of wavering. When they found that such negotiations were going on with the Government, it was only natural for the Opposition to say why did you not come to us at first. It was quite certain the Opposition had a majority of five or six members.; now the majority has gone over to the Government. Tlio conduct of these gentlemen would, he was sure give a great shock to the public feeling. In taking, the step he (Mr Wood) had not been actuated by honesty of motive, still it had been done, and it would do a very great deal of harm, more harm than any possible good it could do to the other side.

The debate was interrupted by the adjournment.