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[W. H. SYME.

foundation to build on —no sense of truth, no sense of obligation. Ido think that the importance of physical labour should be borne in mind. I think that to allow girls simply to be employed at sewing and light work of that description does not answer the difficulty. I think, in the case of those who are distinctly morally degenerate, there should be regulated physical labour. 31. I want your opinion in regard to the question of hair-cutting as a form of punishment, or more probably as a deterrent? —I agree with what Dr. Moorhouse said. It is most harmless, and it is far better for the girl's health than shutting her up in a cell or anything like that. 32. You limit your approval of corporal punishment in the case of girls to eighteen years of age?— About that age. 33. As a matter of fact, you do not believe in corporal punishment much ?—I do not like it, but I consider it is necessary in certain cases. 34. What benefit do you imagine results from the infliction of the strap on the body of a young woman of eighteen ?—I would not do it to a young woman of eighteen. 35. That is what you advocate?—l think up to seventeen there might be certain cases, but they should be, no doubt, exceptional. I think, as you go down in age, your objection diminishes. 36. I suppose you have no doubt whatever as to the benefit that accrues in the majority of cases to the girls who are turned out of Te Oranga?.—Oh, no. 37. You think the treatment tends to make them good women?— Yes. 38. You are able to compare a girl as she goes in with her condition when she comes out?— It think it depends on the age at which they are admitted. I think it is a mistake to admit any girl to Te Oranga over the age of sixteen. I think, bringing the older girls into the place is bad for the younger girls. 39. It is only a question of classification and keeping them apart?—lt is mainly a question of classification. 40. What is your opinion in regard to the discharge from the control of the State of hopeless sexual degenerates at the age of twenty-one?—l have many times expressed the opinion in my reports that such should not be discharged. 41. You think there should be some method of indeterminate dealing with them?— Yes. 42. You have met with girls of that type?— Yes. 43. They simply become dangerous to the community after discharge?— Yes. 44. That is to say, the present system of treating them has failed? —Yes. I think some provision should be made for that class. 45. It is all a question of expense?— Yes. Thursday, 19th March, 1908. George King examined on oath. 1. Mr. Russell.] I think you are at present living in Nelson?— Yes. 2. But for thirty-odd years you were a resident of Christchurch?—Yes. 3. And for many years, and before this Home started, you were living at Horseshoe Lake, and had a large house and grounds there?— Yes. 4. I think you took a considerable interest in this Home after it started?— Yes, but not as much as I should like to have done. 5. And your wife also?— Yes. 6. Were you in the habit of coming to the Home occasionally?— Yes. 7. How many times per year, roughly? —Fairly often. I may say I was up and down past the place twice a day for all the years I was here, and generally I saw the inmates at their work. 8. When you came here, had you an opportunity of looking round and seeing for yourself how things were done here?— Yes. 9. Were you intimately acquainted with Mrs. Branting?—Yes. 10. Might I ask you to state, as far as you can from your visits here, what opinion you formed as to the general care of the children under the Matron? —Without any hesitation, I would say at once 1 thought the Matron managed the Home remarkably well. 11. Did you ever see any physical tasks imposed on the children out of proportion to their strength? —No; I thought they had too easy a time. I thought they would probably be more content had they had more to do. 12. Did you ever see the children in the class-rooms or in the buildings, as well as outside?— Yes. 13 And, generally, was there an air of contentment about the children?— Distinctly so. 14. Did they appear as though they were living under hard conditions here? —No; rather the reverse. They seemed to cling to the Matron as a kind of mother. 15. I think you occasionally had them down at your own place for a day under the Matron and staff? —Yes, and my wife and daughters and myself took part in all the enjoyment going on and in the usual games. 16. At any time did any of the children say anything to you to suggest they were unhappy here? —Quite the reverse. They seemed to vie with one another to get close to the Matron. In fact, I thought they were too familiar, if anything. 17. What inference did you draw from that as to the Matron's personal relations with the children? —I could not take but one view : they were not frightened of her. 18. Did you see anything at all when, visiting here that would enable you to suggest any improvement or alteration in the administration here for the benefit of the children,?—l have suggested to the Matron they should have more extensive grounds, so as to occupy the girls more.