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in the clearing of all bush-valleys, is it not a fact that all creeks get enlarged after clearing ?—Yes; I suppose that is a natural law. Some of them become torrents and tear the land to pieces. 217. Taking all the way down the Pelorus, do you think there has been very much alteration in the Pelorus Eiver ? —That Ido not know. Until comparatively a few years ago I had not much knowledge of the Pelorus—not enough to remember and note its changes. I have passed down there a long time ago, but I am not able to speak with authority on the point. 218. Have you been on the Croixelles Saddle?— That is at the head of the Eonga. My visit was up to the head of the Eonga Valley, but not over the range into the Croixelles. 219. Have you no idea as to the height it was? —Yes, about 700 ft. or 800 ft., as far as I remember. 220. Mr. Gilfedder.] You could not bring the timber out of the valley across the range to the mills? —No, you could not. With reference to the information as to the comparative quantities of timber, as represented to me it was something like this: there would be about thirty years' timber in these two valleys at the present rate of cutting, whether with one mill or more ; while outside these two valleys it was represented to me that there would only be about six or seven years' cutting in the whole district, and this, I was told, would include all the milling timber in what is known as Bennie Gully, the Wakamarina and Valleys.

Friday, 29th July, 1898. Mr. C. W. Adams examined. 1. The Chairman.] I understand, Mr. Adams, that you wish to make a statement to the Committee —perhaps you might call it evidence—in reference to this Eai Valley petition and its counter-petition. You are Commissioner of Crown Lands, I understand ? —Yes ; Mr. Mills saw me and said he thought it would be advisable I should give what information I could. I have not read these two petitions. 2. I suppose you know about them ?—I know there have been two petitions, one from a few people from Nelson asking for a reserve, and I understand the other petition is that it should not be locked up. 3. Would you kindly state to the Committee what you and your Land Board know of the land mentioned in this petition?—l would simply say that I and two or three of the Land Board went up there to look at the valley ourselves. I had never seen it before. I had heard a great deal about it, and I certainly was very greatly surprised to see the large quantity of timber. In fact, I have been over a great deal of the bush country in Otago—a forest about twenty miles long and thirty miles wide:—and I do not think I have ever seen, in any part of New Zealand I have gone to, better forest or better timber, or more of it, than in the Eai Valley. I think it is a most valuable growth of timber, and in my opinion it should be utilised. I have not taken very much interest in the matter, because, if I may give my opinion, I may state that no matter what petition was sent in or what objection there was to withdraw this forest, I think no Government, of whatever opinion, would consent to lock up such a valuable asset. Of course, we are all very glad to preserve the scenery, but I think it would be paying too high a price to withhold that from use. I may say the opinion of the Board was pretty well stated in that report we wrote [Exhibit No. 2]. Going over it again, we have made the three following recommendations. The first is, " That all the tithes of royalties now charged for timber taken off Crown lands should be raised throughout the colony, instead of sacrificing such a valuable asset, as that would be the first step to encourage every owner to conserve whatever valuable timber he may have, instead of recklessly destroying it." I have a very strong opinion on that matter. For this reason : our timber is not at all the same as the commercial timbers of the southern countries of Europe. They are there continually replanting and selling their timber. I do not think it is possible to replant our timber; we may plant Californian timber. Ido not know about totara ; I think it might grow again. I think it is pretty regularly grown. Mr. Percy Smith, Surveyor-General, told me in Auckland the nursery-gardeners sell thousands of totara a year, and Ido not think it is slow-growing. I had a great deal to do in the Catlin's Forest, and I have seen the seeds of the totara-trees lying on the ground. It is a little fiery-red group. I thought it would be a fine chance to get seeds. I have tried always, but never could get a seed. It matures and grows. I have seen the young clusters growing up. I have never been able to get the totara in Auckland. 4. You can get totara in Auckland as well as in other places ?—I have tried, but cannot get them. Ido not think it is possible to replace the matai, kahikatea, or white-pine. That is one reason why we ought to take every care of the forests we have got, and I think we ought not to let them be consumed injudiciously. With regard to this Eai Forest, I think it would be advisable if we could see our way to opening it up. I think we should not run it out under fifty years, or something like that. With regard to conserving forests, I may hold some peculiar opinions about that. 5. That has nothing to do with our petition ?—lt has in this way : I say, in conserving forests, the very best way is to sell them. If it gets into private hands they take care it is not recklessly destroyed. I instance the forest on the Taieri Plain. If it had not been sold it would have been destroyed twenty years before it was. It was sold in small lots, and all utilised. Our second recommendation was, " That the Government should take immediate steps to purchase the Pelorus Tramway from the present owners, and supply the timber from the Crown lands at certain fixed rates, including haulage and royalties, or let the timber be removed from given areas of land under reasonable restrictions, the tithes to be fixed hereafter, and the sawmillers paying haulage." That is our second recommendation. The third recommendation was, " That, if the Government decide not to purchase the Pelorus Tramway at once, every reasonable facility by way of reduction