Important Meeting with Tawhiao.

Waikato Times, Volume XIX, Issue 1611, 31 October 1882, Page 2

Important Meeting with Tawhiao.

Yesterday. Mr Bryce arrived at, Alexandra, about noon tq-day, aud about tiyo o'clock proceeded to' Wliatiwhatihoe. - As t it was expected that Mr Bryce would, speak Uisi mind to Tawhiao,to-aay, /a,^considerable. number.ofEurbpeana were present. Bewj 'driven .on <to"'the r ' ground' by^Dr, , Bailer, Jac|sSO|j.^;, f i?^ah j |nuJ f^ vWere' a'lso'yDC6S6fit.' v i iXoe naplvesimni oej?-j

same place as on the previous day, and judging from the preparations which had been made, it was apparent that the natives expected this day ito be one of business. Mr Bryce and his interpreter, Mr Wilkinson, were seated on two chairs, and Tawhiao sat on a mat in front of them. Tawhiao, who was the first to speak, said : My word will go straight out from my breast, and not from one side or the other. Sir Donald McLean is dead, and I am still living. My words are still 'with me. Sir Donald McLeans are also with me. You have all heard them. I 4mve spoken straight out. My word is hearken all of you. My word is about the land of my ancestors. Theieforc, I say let me have the control of this person j (meaning the administration of his own j affairs). Consider wh.it I have to euy. Therefore, it is that I ask you to leave me the administration of my own land, and also the control of my tribe. It is the same as I have always said to generations back. I say, therefore, let Mangatawhiri bo the end. This is a definite word of mine (meaning Maugatawhiri). You are sufficiently clever to consider what I have said. I would speak with reference to the tow nships of Waikato. I do not quite approve of these townships. My word about these townships is that they are all with me. I do not interfere with what is yours, and I have the control of what is my own. Alexandra, Te Awamutu, Kihikihi, Ngaruawahia, and all the towns down as far as Mangatawhiri are mine. I am there. The management of all these places is with me. My word shall end here. When you have spoken I shall speak t again. Mr Bryce said, on Saturday he de1 clarcd he like plain speaking, and Tawhiao said the same. Tawhiao thought lie had a duty to do to lu3 tribe and to himself, and he presumed he had discharged that duty in lub own way; nevertheless he did not think there was a nun present who thought that his demands could possibly be complied with. Tawhiao refeired to what Sir D. McLean said to him, and to what he said to Sir Donald McLean. He had not referred to what lie said to MiGeorge Grey, and what Sir George Grey said to him. Nevertheless, that was on record. But, why should they go back into the past ? Rather let them cast their eyes into the future. Why sheuld they look back on a dark and stormy day, when the sun is sinning brightly as it is at present ? Rather let them look to the light that is shining, and work in that light. When this bridge was first spoken of Tawhiao named it. What did he name it ? That name was " Tawhara-Kai-Atua," which signified the giving of the first fruits to the gods. He was ready to begin at that name, If the first fruits had been offered, surely the main crop is open to the tribe. Before he sat down he wished to tell a story, an illustration. Once there was a calabash upon the ground, partly filled with food for the people. The opening of that calabash was not very large. A boy came and he put his hand in and took such a quantity of the food that he could not get his hand out of the vessel asaiu. Then the boy began to cry ; but a wise man was standing by, and slid, "My boy, take a moderate quantity in your fingers, and then your hand will 'come out." He would say, "Let the food for the people be brought out of that calabash. If my hand goes into it I shall be moderate ; I shall think of the boy". If Tawhiao and the other chiefs put their hands in let them also think of the boy, let them also be moderate. That was the best ad\ice lie could give to them now, even if he were their brother. He would wait for some further word from Tawhiao, and then say what he had to say. Tawhiao then said : I am now going to reply to what you said about the bridge. It was an expeiiment of mine, I said it should be put in another place, but Manga insisted that it should be here, so I gave in. Others have surveyed, and sold and leased, therefore, I said I should stop at the bridge. It was an experiment, and that was why it was called Tawhara-Kai-Atua (or the first fruits). The bridge was my first experience of a new line of administration. I find others have made surveys, leases and sales, therefore, I say mine shall stop at the bridge. Sir Donald McLean told me I should have the conducting of my own land, and had he been alive now I would have been gone (meaning he would have agreed with McLean). His words arc on record, I do not approve ot leases sales, or surveys. It is a good talk to consider it, and 1 think it is satisfactory that I have seen you. Even if we do not agree I have met you face to face. It was a small thing which caused Sir Geoigc Grey not to come to terms. It was caused by a European, whose name 1 have forgotten. Sir Geoige Grey's proposals were good, but they were frustrated by the other person. Man is man, timber is timber, but land is quite another thing. Sir Donald McLean said it (the land) should commence at the sea at Waikato, and go light up to Taheka, and I did not agree. He said that the land should come from the mouth of the Waikato river, following it light up to this, even to Manga- Moka, but I did not agree. When I met Sir George Grey he said the same thing. Do you consider this and we also will consider it. Mr Bryce then spoke : Tawhiao lias once more referred to Sir George Grey and Sir Donald McLean, and the replies he made to these gentlemen. He says he was disappointed that the offers did not continue although they were not accepted by him. That, I think, he must have known, because the offers were distinctly withdrawn. Now he says if Sir Donald McLean was alive to-day he would repeat and renew the offer. I do not think so. When once these things pass they can never be recalled. Ever since that time until now, and it will continue in the future, the flood has been rising. What do I mean by the flood ? I mean the flood of Enropern civilization and occupation. There is no use in saying that flood is bitter ; roll back its waters. Bitter or sweet, the u'aters are not waters if they roll back. If anyone, great or small, thhiks'that he could stay that tide of occupation, I'll tell him what to do. Let him go down to the sea beach when the tide is low and endeavour to keep that tide from rising. Then if the great ocean obeys him, let him try and stop European civilization and occupation. Therefore, do not let us go back to Sir Donald McLean or Sir George Grey. Let us make a canoe that will float on the top of the flood ; and if we ai'e going to build that canoe, let us see that we build it of durable wood, and not of perishable wood. That is our work, final though the sun is sinning just now, it is coming down to its setting. We must work at our canoe while our light shines, it order that we may float over the waters in safety. There are plenty of canoes, perhaps, but let us build a good oneone that will steer, and not merely drift. I ask yon, now, to let U 3 work while the sun shines, and begin afresh from to-day. Tawhiao again spoke, and stated that his reason for referring to what Sir Donald McLean had said, was becausejit was so satisfactory ; and although he was dead, he did not consider his proposals revoked. He understood from Sir Donald that he was to have the control of his. lands and, l»is, people, Tawhiao concluded by inviting Mr Bryoe to make his own proposals, aa those made by Sir Donald McLean and Sir George Grey had fallen through. Mr Bryoe again addressed the meeting as follows says that if I do not choose to* go back to the proposals of Sir George Grey and Sir Donald McLean, to make my owii proposals, It is, only fair that J e.hould,in(Jicate j.u some^degree what ,the, Qovejnu^ei^ij^rd'pl'ep^red^clo. rtliought tliat.ta^h^Q Jf,ou)4 Js«self ■have mad^propsal^ 't£-^jMj£s9s j? 8 , itKetoastA*^^4J^ ra l>

is, and what I consider Tawhiao's position to be, and the position of the Government. Perhaps Tawhiao may not agree with some things I may say. Perhaps he will agree with others. But it is better that I should tell what I think, and lot him consider, rather than tell wliat is pleasant to him and keep the rest hidden. Now, I'll spe.ik iii a general way. When we come to deal particularly, that must be done with the chiefs, for it cannot be done at a public meeting like this. Mr Bryce then gave illustrations of his meaning. He and Tawhiao would talk the matter over privately, when most likely they would come to an agreement. Tawhiao seemed principally to interest himself about the laud. There were in his mind, however, subjects of still greater importance to be talked over than this. First of all as to the question of sovreignty. He stood there that day as a Minister of the Queen, and he was bound to tell them, in the presence of all, that he did not think this laud was large i enough to support two authorities Chiefs might still have their authority among their own people, but the sovereignty of the Queen must extend over this inland from end to end. If he told them anything different from that ' he would be misleading them. The lawmight be bad in some respects, but they should endeavor to amend it, not resist it. After referring to the present mode by which the natives disposed of theii i land, which he characterised as unwise, he stated he was disposed to aid the : natives, and he wished Tawhiao to assist him. He thought permanent reserves should be secured to the descendants of the Maoris, and the remainder should be dealt with in such a way as would conduce to the welfare of the owners, and to the interests of the colony as a whole. * considerable portion of the money rea Used should be invested for the benefit of the natives. He was willing to raidoi his help to get all this done in a propei manner. It was vain for Tawhiao to -s.iy thatall land tranBactionsshonldsto|). The Government were prepared to recognise Tawhiao as a great chief, because lie w.i^ the chosen of many tribes, but he should be reasonable. .Speaking to the Ngat.imaniapotos, Mr Bryce counselled them to remember that they had assisted tin movement which ended so disastrously for Tiiwhiao, and that, there fore, the latter had claims on thi'in. He concluded by impressing upon the natives the fact that the Government in their dealings with the native race wm actuated by a desire for their welfare. He loft them with feelings of good-will, and promised to return, when they had had time to consider what he had said, to hear their reply. Mr Biyce having shaken hands with Tawhiao, left with Ins suite foi Alexandra.