WAIRARAPA AND EAST COAST P. AND A. SOCIETY.

Wairarapa Daily Times, Volume VII, Issue 2087, 5 September 1885, Page 2

WAIRARAPA AND EAST COAST P. AND A. SOCIETY.

A meeting of the above Society was held at the Council Chambers,Carterton,yesterday Present—W, C. Buchanan, President, H. R. Bunny, Vice President, and W. Booth, Mathews, B, Kimberly, E. Dorset, J. Eeynolds, H.H, Beetham, N, Grace, H, Braithwaite, B. Boys, J, Donald, and J, Drummond

The minutes of the last meeting were read and confirmed.

The letter was read from the proposed Masterton Pastoral and Agricultural Society, and also the answer as written to them by Mr Booth, on behalf of the Committee appointed for the purpose. Tho President read the report in reference to the deputation, and the President stated that he was pretty sure that the Masterton people were not fully cognizant of. the real facts of the case when the Pastoral and Agricultural Society was formed in Carterton,

It was resolved to receive the deputation from Masterton.

The deputation consisting of Messrs M. Caselberg, T. Chamberlain, E. Meredith, R. S. Hawkins, B, P. Perry, and R, J. Fitton entered,

The President said before commencing the business he would briefly refer to the correspondence that had passed un this matter. Judging from the remarks in the papers,the letter sent to the Secretary of the Masterton Farmers' Olub was Mr Booth's, and not the Society's. Such was not the case. The Masterton letter was considered at a meeting of the Society, and a Committee appointed to reply to it, and the letter sent by Mr Booth was entirely in consonance with the views of the Committee. The President read the letter asking; the Society to receive the Masterton deputation, and he stated that knowing a meeting of the Show Committee was about to be held, lie arranged to receive the deputation on that day, and replied accordingly, Mr Hawkins said he presumed that the Show Committee considered they were in a position to receive the deputation, and deal with the matter, and ho concluded it was really a meeting of the Society through its Executive Committee. He trusted the Committee would disabuse their minds of anything that in the past may have caused any irritation, and not take notice of any reports that had been published, as of a necessity newspaper reports were extremely succinct, and did not always convey the impression the speakers were desirous to create. The real object and intention of the meeting the other day was the advancement of the pastoral and agricultural interests of the district, and to avoid any antagonism with the existing society. Since the site had besn fixed in Carterton as a central one, an entire alteration in the relative position of tho townships had taken place. The railway had reached Masterton, and beyond and around that town considerable Btrideß had been made in settlement, and he thought it could not be questioned that the main business centra was now in Masterton. There was no doubt, on the other hand they had to consider other main points. By a large consensus of. settlers, the show had been fixed at Carterton, and the main part of the stud stock wag in the lower, not upper part of the valley. When they asked these contributors to put themselves to some inconvenience they ought to be able to show some advantages to be derived by the change. The Society, in its present state was considerably cramped, it prosperity precarious, and it maintained itself under considerable difficulties. Now, as regarded the debt of the society, he spoke now as a pastoral settler in (he North County only. He felt he was undor a moral obligation as to that debt, which feeling was Bhown by other pastoral Bettlera, and if the debt alone stood in the way it was not an insuperable difficulty. Ho thought if they all joined in the matter it would be almost easy of arrangement. But he thought they could at Masterton put before stock owners advantages of-great value and importance, and that they would see it would be better to hold shows in that centre, One of tho first things to look at always waa the pate money. They could not, and ought not, to depend upon voluntary subscriptions, and they ought to look to the gate money as ona important item. He could not but express his belief that the difference in the gate money between the two townships would be considerable, Not only was it popuation, which is a consideration, but Masterton had attraction outside which would lead people to come from Wellington and other districts, and this would be an advantage to exhibitors. He did not want to introduce the town question, but they could not exclude it. The pastoral people had to look to their own interests, ond he thought it was their interests, from a business point of view, to consider the gate money and tho place in fixing the show. The movement of stock miirht make a serious consideration to some, and others it might makelittle or no difference t<.. If therefore it is assumed that Masterton from

its position svill.comrnand a large amount of support, and the debt could lie arranged, there was little between their deputation and their Association. Ho hoped that as little as possibly would be said about the proceedings of the past, it was unnecessary.to disouss them, and it might create soreness and differences of opinion which it was their wish to avoid, and he trusted they would look at it on its merits for the good of the agricultural and pastoral interests of the Counties, and not rake up the past. The President, in reply, said he would refer to what Mr Hawkins spoke of last —"raking up the past." He claimed this on behalf of himself and his committee, to avoid raking up unpleasantness, but that must not be taken in the sense in which it was put, that it would involve any unpleasantness. He (the speaker) had no ground of unpleasantness in relating the events that had lead up to the present position because a great many in Masterton, were not aware of what part Masterton took in the past. First the shows were held in Tauherenikau in 1876, Masterton 1877, and Carterton 1878. The old Sofiiety previous to 1877 fell to pieces, and a meeting was Mid in Carterton in order to start a fresh show for the whole galley, and a Committee wa3 appointed Yep.l'esentative of all parts of the Valley. ,iljis, ended in a new association being (formed, and resulted in the first show being held in Masterton. A meeting was "held in Carterton afterwards, and it was found to be a great loss and disadvantage in holding ponpatetie shows, A committee was appointed to consider the question of having one central show, and they recommended that a block be purchased from Booth & Co., and this report was adopted, provided that subscriptions to' the amount of £SOO be guaranteed. This was complied with, and on those grounds the show was finally fixed at Carterton, and permanent yards erected. To show that Masterton fully recognised the responsibility it took, the list of members contained upwards of one hundred names north of the VVaingawa. The debt on the land was allowed to Btand for a term at £3 per cent, but it was found that the expenditure was so large in clearing the grounds, &c., that it was necessary to raise asimilaramount of money forit. This was done by floating debentures to the amount of £6OO on the security of the property of the Association, and guaranteed by certain of its members, The President continued that he did not think the time altogether wasted in these remarks, as they would show how things stood and what led up to it, Now he would ask, What was it the deputation proposed they should do 1 To remove the site to Masterton. Mr Hawkins had pointed out that holding the show in a large centre would out-weigh all other disadvantages. If they wauted to shift the Show, did Mr. Hawkins for one moment imagine that after what had been done down there the consent of the people could be got ? It was quite out of the question for it to be done that year, if it was done later on. Then if the show was held in Masterton, what would happen? Mr Hawkins admitted that the majority of stud stock was in the Lower Valley, and he must also say they had not stock really for one good sliow in the Valley, and it would mean that the north would show in Masterton, and the centre and south in Carterton. In Masterton they would have a money advantage, but he would point out that the shows were for the education of the people in growing stock, and the towns were used as a means of getting the " sinews of war." Let them consider whether it would be better to hold two shows. It is impossible that Mr Hawkins can doubt the great amount of mischief that would be created between town and town if the show were shifted this year. He was certain that the deputation did not fully realise wlint they wero asking, He would ask who was it that was demanding the change ? Was it at the instance of stock-owners? (Mr Hawkins: I would ask you to exclude that element, and accept the fact that the deputation was in existence, as such remarks would tend to create a breeze, if one did not exist.) The President said the remarks of Mr Hawkins were made with the best of objects, but he would refer to his past history whether he had ever set party against party or individual against individual. He would ask (waxing warmer) whether his remarks tended that way, (Cries of No ! No!—Mr Hawkins : I don't say so—). All lie would say was that the demand was not nnde from the settlers, but on the part of the town. Ho was going to refer to the reports in the papers to prove that the demand had not been made by settlers, but to further the interests of the town. (Mr Hawkins: Not so!) Anyone taking the reports as stated in the papers would find that it was so, and he had come in contact with those who know the general feelings of the district, and from what they said, he was satisfied ho was right in the conclusion he had come to that there was no demand for the change amongst stockowners, Mr Hawkins had said that the question had reduced itself as to how the debt was to be disposed of, He thought it would have been well if Mr Hawkins had told them how he meant to dispose of it. The debt was £I2OO, including the £6OO debenture bonds, and they had several contributions to wipe off the debt, some conditional that the show remain there, and their land had depreciated in value'since it was purchased. However, to sum up, he should say that if the question was put to the settlers, they would in his opinion, say that it would be better to keep the show in Carterton for the next few years, and that Masterton should put its shoulder to the wheel and get the debt wiped off, They could bring forward the clans of Mastertori and then there would be no fear of disuniting the district, as such a premature movement an this threatened, Mr W. H. Beetham said there were few more interested than himself inMasterton and he was quite-aware of the advantages of a show in Masterton. It was pleasanter, • there would be more visitors, and more gate money would be taken, but he did not think the promoters of the present movement knew what thoy wished them to undertake in the removal of the yards toMastorton. The expenses would be very great, and land , costly, The gate money at Masterton would be very considerable, but a South-Easter did not stop at Carterton, Success depended on tlie~ : weather. ' The last two years therehad been bad weather in Carterton, but he did not think that should influence them to remove, He strongly urged that thing should be allowed to remain as they were at present, and believed that what the deputation wished would follow as & matter of course.

Mr Booth said-he was delayed by tho break-down of the train, and did nothea* Mr Hawkins 1 speech and the objects and views of the deputation, but he did not think there was any reason to take up much time after the remarks made by the Chairman and Mr Beetham, He would like to put himself right as to-the letter he had sent to Mr Fitton. There was nothing further from his mind than discourtesy or curtnesß; bnt there was so little ii) the letter containing the proposal from the Farmers' Club that it did not demand a fuller reply. Also, that he had not written the letter for himself, but on behalf of a substantial meeting of the Show Committee. He hoped they would accept the letter, not .as curt or discourteous, but as a fair reply from the Show Committee, He had looked through the papers to find any reason advanced why the show should

be taken to Masterton, but there was not even an attempt at a reaaon, beyond what Mr McCardle had stated as to the large number of stumps nt'Carterton, He had too much sense to attach any value to that, as it was simply a humorous expression, given because there was really no substantial reason why the show should be shifted. He had been credited with a good deal of zeal, and some indiscriminate zeal, for Carterton. In the days of the past he was a witness to the difficulties, and in favor of Unity, and their efforts then had resulted in the present Society, which, considering the difficulties they hud to contend with, had been fairly successful. No reason had been given why they should change—at any rate, nothing to their minds to warrant it, If there was any reasonable prospect of advantage or. finality, he would not stand in the way. He would look at it from two points—the stockowners' and'the gate money. The bulk of the support of the show would be from the centre and south, and it did not therefore follow that it would bo to their advantage to show in Masterton in preference to Carterton. As regarded the gatemoney, it had been urged that Masterton had a large population, and was the centre of trade. That was all very well on a fine day. The reasons advanced in favor of Masterton were unfortunate, because there was no substance in them. Mr Hawkins was sometimes inclined to act and think with energy, and he allowed it to lead him astray. He could inform Mr Hawkins that the whole of the district for the purposes of the show was practically available. It was much larger V lan Mr Hawkins or anyone else was aware. There, were n. great many , families living in;the bush and at the back, who looked forward to the show day as their annual holiday, and thousands flocked in when the weather was propitious. If Masterton would not lend its assistance, well, then they must do without it. If the weather was fine, Carterton, without doubt, was much the better centre of population,. He thought the people of Greytown and Featherston entitled to some consideration, and the Association was entitled to more consideration, The gentlemen who were agitating this matter had not studied the interests of those who had borne the heat and burden of the day, and the time for making the change would not come for years. He regretted that the judicious advice given by Mr Hawkins and others had not been taken at the recent meeting in Masterton, If the representative of one of the Masterton papers, the 'Star, 1 had been present, he should have had something to say about the statement that he for one had no desire to amalgamate with a bankrupt Society, The boot was 011 the other leg, and he was sorry that matters were not left completely open, so that the discussion could have taken place without any foreign matter being introduced, He concluded by stating that the reasons advanced were not satisfactory, As for Masterton being the largest centre for the purpose of obtaining the largest attendance at the Bhow, that was not tame out by facts. The habits and inclinations of the people for miles round the district made them heartily support the show at Carterton whenever the weather was not against them. Mr B, P. Perry referred to what led up to the formation of the present Society, He had objected to the land purchased at Carterton as excessive. He urged in the interests of the exhibitors that Masterton was the place to hold the show if they wished to make it a success, A deal of time had been wasted in useless discussion, and he would ask if they would accede to the request of the deputation, There was everything to start a show, and it was needed at Masterton,

Mr J. 0. Bidwill thought exhibitors, not population, ought to be considered. The travelling of stock was the most important, and from a stockowner's point of view, Featherston was just as important as Masterton, as they were the largest exhibitors of stock ; but at that end they were perfectly willing to waive their rights in favor of a central show. He did not consider Carterton altogether the most suitable for a show, but Masterton was altogether: out of it, as Mr Stuckey waß the only exhibitor. Messrs Beetham used to exhibit, but did not do so now. If Masterton agreed to wipe off the liabilities they might hold shows alternately at Masterton and Foathevston. Mr E. Meredith thought they had lost sight of the exact object of the meeting. They were all aware that a Farmers' Club had been formed, and that a meeting had been called to take into consideration the formation of an Agricultural Society for the northern portion of the district, and it could not be concealed that an exhibition would be held under any circumstances, There was a full determination to form a Society in the northern district. They were twitted for the course they had taken. but Messrs Beetham, Hawkins, and himself had advised moderation, and tho deputation was there to prevent that friction which would come about if two Societies existed in the district. The Society was formed and would go on, and they could not stop it. They would call aid and occupy a position superior to that of the present Socioty. He invited their cdfdial co-operation in making the new Society a success. He had not expected to meet a committee, but to find a general meeting of the Association there that day. Mr H. il. Bunny said it was a waste of time. They could not entertain the proposal. They ought to have struok on the legitimate course, worked up the present Society, paid off their debt, and then proposed to move the show. Instead of that they oam» with an ultimatum,

Mr Hawkins wanted to know what the amount of the debt really was. The President said £I2OO and Mr Booth £6OO.

The Chairman said it appeared as if Mr Hawkins doubted liis willingness to give tho information. Mr Hawkins: Not at all. . He would take the debt 'at £6OO. They had no right to ask how they were prepared to wipe it off. All the deputation asked was if they wiped off the debt would they consider the question of the removal of tho show to Masterton. (dries of No! No!) Was the meeting prepared to deal with the question, or would they consider the removal of the ihowto Masterton next year. If not, then the onus would rest entirely with thorn, If they were answered by this non possimus position they would have to go buck and go on with the new society. Mr Booth said they would not attempt that responsibility, If they had brought a preposition that commended itself to the good sense of the meeting, he would have bowed to the majority. In four or five years' timo things might tie completely changed, and not in the direction prophesied by the deputation, and the central and lower part had the largest right of consideration, whatever tho Farmers' Club might think, Messrs B, Boys, Oaselberg, and others spoke upon the question. The President replied that the matter would have to be considered by the whole Association. Mr Hawkins said he would hold the President responsible for not calling a general meeting, yet taking upon himself, as Chairman, to receive them. He thought after being invited to come, to turn round now and say that they had no right to give them an answer, put the deputation in a false position. He urged a final answer to the following question : —lf the debt is satisfactorily arranged, and preparations made in Masterton, will the Society be prepared to concur with the Masterton Association in holding the

allow in Masterton next- year ? that an answer be aent by next The meeting then adjourned.