PARLIAMENTARY.

Thames Star, Volume XII, Issue 3908, 8 July 1881, Page 2

PARLIAMENTARY.

(Pee Peess Association.)

HOUSE pF BEPEESENTATIYES. : Wellington, Thursday. : Evening Sitting, %•''">

NEW PLYMOUTH HAUBOUE BOABD.

Mr Wright moved the committee to inquire into the financial, position of the JS ew Plymouth Harbour Board, in respect of its present and future relations to the public creditor, and to report generally on the matter, the committee to consist of Messrs Barron, Fulton, Moss, Montgomery, Murray, Ormond, Pitt, Eichardson, Weston, and the mover. He traced the history of the works, from the passing of the Act authorising the Board to raise £200,000 on six per cent, debentures. The net proceeds of that loan were £185,854. The estimated cost of work was £928,700. It was in view of' these facts that he thought the inquiry was demanded. '

Mr Kelly thought the mover could have found a grievance demanding inquiry nearer his door in Cauterbury, instancing Timaru Harbour Board Works, which he described as works calculated to damage the colony at large. The operations of New Plymouth Board had. been inquired into over and over again, and he complained that their interference was injurious to the work in baud. It had done valuable work in the way of making preliminary arrangements for carrying on the work. He had no desire to oppose the motion, but would strongly urge that enquiry be confined to finance, and the progress of the work be not interfered with. The motion was carried.

DR POLLEN'S PENSION

The report ot the Public Accounts Committee on Dr Pollen's pension was considered.

Mr Speight moved that the House agree with the report, and is of opinion no further payments should be made to Dr Pollen until the House, by special Act, determined what amount, if any, was fair payment as pension to Dr Pollen. He reviewed the whole circumstances under which the pension was granted, and contended that Dr Pollen was not entitled to count his ministerial services or his. salary as Imperial Paymaster in calculating his pension.

Mr Saunders thought the motion and report did not go far enough. He considered this pension had been improperly obtained. Civil servants appeared to be very considerate to each other in estimating claims, to pensions, as shown in this case, Sir Wm. Fitzherbert's, and Mr Gisborne's. All these pensions should be enquired into; and he moved, as an amendment, that it was undesirable that a decision should be come to in this case until the circumstances under which the pensions were granted to Sir Wm. Fitzherbert and Mr Gisborne. were, also considered and reported upon by the Public Accounts Committee. .

Mr Wesfon said on:a)full revieivof the circumstances he agreed with the Attorney General, that Dr Pollen wks'eiMitled to the pension granted. Dr Pollen had rendered the services to the colony in the offices de facto,, if not de jure, and it would be excessively mean of the colony to attempt to take advantage of a technical loophole to avoid payment for. services rendered, and to make him a scapegoat. This was really hot censure on Government, and he, as an independent member, pledged to no party, felt glad he could speak in vindication of the Government in this matter. Looking to the legal advice given them, he did not think Ministers could have acted otherwise than they had done in regard to the pension. If any doubt existed, the question was one for a proper legal tribunal to decide Dr Pollen's right, rather than for that House. It was a question of construction of law. As it is, he should support the amendment.

Mr DeLautour thought it would probably burk the question for the session to send it back to the Committee, nor was the question one lor a court of law. The other pensions should each be dealt with on their merits. They were granted by Parliament and were no long r responsible to the House. Dr Polleu's pension was granted by the present Government, which was responsible, and on this the House should express an opinion. Mr McLean supported the /-nieudment. The committee could easily and promptly deal with these pension questions. He was opposed to pensions geucraMy, but as the law stood he thought Dr Pollen entitled to his pension, although Sir Julius Vogel, when Premier, had clearly exceeded his power in making "the promise he had.to Dr Pollen. It would be most unjust to punish Dr Pollen-* for this, however.

Mr Montgomery wished this case and each of the . others .to be. dealt with separately on their respective merits.

Later, Tins day. The House continued the debate on Pollen's Pension.

Mr Wood said their duty was to protect the revenue. In Pollen's case the money appeared to have been paid without the authority of the House, and it should be fully enquired iuto. He was surprised to find the Government attemptto throw the blame on Sir Julius Vogel, who was-absent, but whose conduct in the matter they had endorsed.

Mr motion

Moss stroHgly supported the

Mr Stewart thought the Government should not hare granted a pension of this sort without the direct authority of the House. Sir W. Fox supported the amendment, if the money had been paid improperly the Government was certainly responsible.

Mr Johnston contended that the Government had acted in a perfectly legal manner, and he wished to see all theae pension questions probed to the bottom. Mr Ballance admitted that Dr Pollen had large equitable claims, but his legal ones should be decided first. This had not been done.

Mr Leyestam thought the whole question of pensions should be looked into as well as other illegal payments, such as that of £300 to Mr Jiees.

Mr Kelly thought the question of Pollen's legal claims should be referred to the Judges of the Court of Appeal. The House divided on Mr Speight's original motion which was negatived by 38 to 31. J

Mr J. B. Fisher then moved an addition to Mr daunder's amendment, to the effect that uatii committee had reported on the other cases no further payment be made to Dr Pollen.

Mr Swanson suggested this should be made applicable to the pensions of Fitzkerbert, G-isborne, and Doniet.

Mr Hall agreed to this, and Mr Saundei-'s uwtiou as thus amended w«s

agreed to, the committee to report iv thre c weeks. The House rose at 12.50.

: The following is the division list on the motion re Pollen's pension—ayes, 31 ; noes, 38:—

Ayes— Andrews, Ballauce, Barron, Brown, DeLaulour, Fisher(Buller), Fisher (Heathcote). George, Grey, Harris, Hutchison, Jones, Kelly, Lundon, Maoandrew, MacDoiiald, Montgomery, Moss, lieeves, . Reid, Shephard, fcihrimski, Speight, (Steward, Swaason, Taiaroa, Tawhai, Thomson, Tole, Turnbull, Wood.

Noes—Allwright, Atkinson, Bain, Beetham, Bowen, Brandon, Bryce, Bunny, Colbeck, Collins, Dick, Fox, Fulton, Gibbs, Hall, Hirst (Wallace), Hursthouse, Johnston, Levestam, Levin, Mason, McCaughan, McLean, Murray, Oliver, Kolleston, Saunders, Seymour, Shanks, Stevens, Studholme, Sutton, Irimble, Wakefield, Weston, Whitaker, White, Wright. Pairs—Ayes : Pyke, Wallis, Seddon, Hatnlin, Te Wheoro. Noes: .Russell, llichardson, Pitt, Kenny, Tomoana.