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PASSAGE AT ARMS.

"• JEHE HON. J. B. HINE AND OPPOSITION LEADER. In the House •of Representatives on Friday the Hon. J. B. Hine said that he - favored nationalisation of the mines. Sir John Findlay's contribution to the debate had been largely visionary. There . had been no statement as to what the . remedies for the inflated currency and for the high cost of living were. Then the leader of the Opposition wanted to know when things were going to return to normal. For his part, he held that they would never return to normal —that .wages.must continue high because of the high cost of living. But the right lon. gentleman wanted them to return to normal. Sir Joseph Ward: I said they would not return to" normal for many, many jrears. Mr. Hine: You implied that the time .would come when they would return to 'normal. Sir Joseph Ward: I don't think it will; not in our time. Mr. Hine said that the right hon. member also stated in his manifesto that it was unwise to borrow out of the country; but now he proposed to borrow five millions at Home. Sir Joseph Ward: No, I said it was _-«nwise to borrow twenty-nine millions in ' Spue year now that the war is over. hear.) Tsfr. Hine: The right hon. member is will-o'-the-wisp. (Laughter.) i J9ir Joseph Ward: You are only there You - may be gone to-morrow. ■ [^Laughter.) • Mr. Hine 'said that in his opinion • strikes and lock-outs should be made illegal. He might be ahead of the times. .(Laughter.) Sir Joseph Ward: Oh, no! (Hear, hear and laughter.) Mr. Hine: I can understand you do not favor that. Sir Joseph Ward: I meant you are ' not 'ahead of the times. (Hear, hear.) A Reform member: What times? The New Zealand Times? (Laughter.) No section, declared Mr. Hine, should have power to hold up and paralyse the industry of the country. If he had his way he would deal with strike promoters Very heavily. They would get out of the country quick and lively. * Mr, H. E. Holland (Grey): Then you Would have to get rid of your own Government,.because it is responsible for she strikes. (Hear, hear and laughter.). Mr. R. McCallum (Wiirau): He iB tpiite beyond the times. (Laughter.) Criticising the statements of the Leader of the Opposition with reference to soldier settlement, Mr. Hine Baid that the right hon. member bad cavilled at (be expenditure on the soldiers.

UNTRUE." Sir Joseph Ward: That is absolutely totrne. Well, I withdraw that, Mr. Speaker, but I .say that the hon. gentleman has been making statements all the evening about tilings I did not say and then criticising them. It is an unknown thing- for a Minister to' do. A child would know better. (Hear, hear.) 1 objected to'spending all the money in one year, because the forcing of fourteen millions in the purchase of land in one year-would-put up values so high that the soldiers could not pay the taxes on it. ••

Mr. Hine said that they were putting soldiers on the land at a maximum of £3OO. including improvements, and the men would be taxed on the unimproved value only. How could that ruin them? Mr. C. H. Poole (Auckland West): He

has got to pay the taxation and pay for

the money too. (Hear, hear.) That i is where the land shark is going to get the benefit. (Hear, hear and laughter.) Mr. Hine repeated that the total . capital value per man would only be {£2500.

Mr. Poole: But the revaluations are coming along. (Hear, hear.) Mr. Hine added that the Leader of the Opposition had said that the landowners in Hawke's Bay had escaped taxation on (£9,000,000 in the last four years. The right hog. member was Minister for finance all that time, yet never once, •o far as. the speaker knew, was an attempt made, to impose taxation on time men. It was only six weeks since lie left the Government, but he came down.and assailed in this way the . - Government he left, the Government he ■' deserted. *" Sir Joseph Ward: That is absolutely ' untrue. I withdraw that, Mr. Speaker. It is incorrect. The hon. gentleman has misrepresented me from beginning to end. It was the valuations I was re-

ferring to. (Hear, hear.) I was not in charge of the Valuation Department. - (Hear, hear.) ' And from the establish- ; Blent of the National Government there ' *was an understanding that policy ques'•tions should not be raised during th 3 existence of the Government. (Hear,

hear.) It is absolutely contrary to fact that I had deserted the Government, and the Prime Minister knows it. (Hear, hear.) Mr. Poole: He doesn't know what he is saying. (Hear, hear and laughter.) Mr. Hine said that he was very much amused at the Leader of the Opposition's criticisms in regard to the estimated surplus in-the Budget* But what value did the right hon. member expect to be put on his own predictions? In 1915 he estimated a deficit of over £1,000,000, but there was actually a surplus of more than £2,000,000; and so on for the years following. With hydro-electric development, etc., said Mr. .Hine, the Dominion needed more population, and immigration should be encouraged as much as possible. For his part he would guarantee employment for three years to all British soldiers who wanted to Come here.

THE GOVERNMENT POLICY. A Liberal member: Is that the Government policy? (Laughter.) Mr. W. A. Veitch (Wanganui): Would you employ them before our own returned men! (Hear, hear.) Mr. Hine: I would guarantee them employment for three years too. (Hear, hear and laughter). Members, he added, amid interjections, were very fond of sheltering themselves behind the Government; but be thought that the soldiers could trust the Government to look after them. (Laughter.) Mr. J. Payne: Not on your life! (Hear, hear anil laughter.) The Speaker said that the interjections were getting far too numerous. He could hardly hear the hon. member speak The Hon. G. W. Russell: If that is the policy of the Government, why isn't it in i£e Budget? (Laughter.) Mr. Payne: You are interrupting too much. (Laughter.) - Mri Hine declared, in conclusion, that the policy of the Government was well devised,-and he believed that when it wa* properly understood the people would recognise that it was a policy, not urine interests of a section, but in the.interests -sof. all "resident, In the'country. (Hear,

MISREPRESENTED. Sir Joseph Ward said that he was very sorry to have to rise to correct some of the misrepresentations made by the Minister. Because he was a young Minister who had just accepted office he would have preferred to let him have his say and go his way; but, to prevent misunderstandings on the part of those who might read "Hansard," he felt compelled to refer to the matter. The hon. gentleman had stated that he (Sir Joseph) had cavilled at the amount of expenditure on soldiers; but he had said nothing of the sort. What he had Baid was that the amount it was proposed to expend in one year on the purchase of land would force values up so high that in course of < time it would be ruinous for Soldiers going upon the land. (Hear, hear). When the hon. gentleman said that he had deserted the National Government and that he had made a statement that he should not have made he was absolutely incorrect. When he (Sir Joseph) was in the Government he had held the same opinions about the unwisdom of putting so much down at once in the purchase of land, and had said ■ so. A number of soldiers had bitterly complained to him about the appreciation of land values now taking place, and about having to go upon the land at such a highprice.. He cited again the case of a farmer who had sold his, farm at £SO an,3tcre on going to the* front, but was now asked £9O an acre for it. Did the hon. member mean to say that that was in the interests, of the. soldiers T

EXCESSIVE BORROWING. Of the forty millions the hon. member' had said he proposed in his manifesto tn borrow there was no item of expenditure to be expended in less than two years, and some were to be spread over four years. Mr. Hine: I never stated the period in which it was to be spent. Sir Joseph Ward: No; that, is what I am pointing out. You should have mentioned it. (Hear, hear.) What I was complaining about was that under ths Budget proposals from twenty-nine to thirty-three millions was to be borrowed in one year, and that fourteen millions Were to be spent in one year on one item. (Hear, hear.) To spend seven millions in each of two years on that item was, he added, a very different matter. (Hear, hear.) He had urged that five millions should be borrowed at Home, and that seven millions should be spent on land purchase this year, rather than .force over 29 millions in paper money—because it would have to be paper money—on this country in one year. In regard to Hawke's Bay, he had jointed out that the valuations had increased from six millions to nine millions, and that if that was a fair indication of the position throughout the country, when the revaluations were made the soldier-settlers would have to pay 50 per cent, more in taxation. (Hear, hear.) The hon. gentleman had Baid that .he had under-estimated the surpluses the following years, but he had always done so on principle, as he had repeatedly stated, to ensure sound finance. (Hear, hear.) Did the hon member realise that the balance left by his predecessor was £72,000, and that be (Sir-Joseph Ward), accepting departmental estimates he found, had had to bring down proposals to recast the whole of the finances of the country to meet war conditions. (Hear, hear.) The hon. gentleman had said that the actual surplus was .three millions; but, personally, he had hoped that it would be five millions. (Hear, hear.) He purposely under-estimated the revenue to keep something in hand for contingencies. (Hear, hear.) And then he found a junior member of the Ministry, who had just jointed, coming along and criticising him for trying to keep the country safe on sound financial lines! (Hear, hear.)

Mr. Hine said that he had not quoted the amount that the right hon. gentleman proposed to borrow in his manifesto. He had simply quoted him as saying anything in the shape of a large borrowing policy outside New Zealand would be very costly. Sir Joseph Ward: Yes; a large policy. Mr. Hine: And that we should rather borrow locally. Sir Joseph Ward: Hear, hear. Mr. Hine: The right lion, gentleman misrepresented me, and I have taken the opportunity of putting it right. Sir Joseph Ward: Well, I don't agree with your statement of the case, anyhow.

Permanent link to this item
Hononga pūmau ki tēnei tūemi

https://paperspast.natlib.govt.nz/newspapers/TDN19191008.2.60

Bibliographic details
Ngā taipitopito pukapuka

Taranaki Daily News, 8 October 1919, Page 8

Word count
Tapeke kupu
1,827

PASSAGE AT ARMS. Taranaki Daily News, 8 October 1919, Page 8

PASSAGE AT ARMS. Taranaki Daily News, 8 October 1919, Page 8

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