PARLIAMENTARY. HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES. WEDNESDAY.

Te Aroha News, Volume III, Issue 156, 29 May 1886, Page 4

PARLIAMENTARY. HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES. WEDNESDAY.

Wellington. The House resumed af 1- 2.30 p.m. The Speaker, accompanied by the mover and seconder, and Executive, proceeded to Government House and presented the Addres3 in Reply, On his return, bills of which notice had been given on the previous day were brought in and read a first time.

Sir George Grey's Land Bill. • When Sir George Grey was about to move • his bill for purchase of private lands for settlement, the Speaker said the measure involved the expenditure of public funds, and required the assent of the Crown. Sir Geo. Grey eaid it was the same bill as that introduced and assented to last year ; but the Speaker replied that the proceedings respecting it required to be taken de novo. At the suggestion o! the Premier, who ap prahended no difficulty in the matter, the motion for the introduction of the bill was adjourned till to-morrow, Mr Stout promising to ask for the assent of the Government.

Returns. The returns of which notice had been given on the previous day were ordered to be laid on the table. The New Hebrides. Sir G. Gkey moved his resolution protesting against the acquisition of the New Hebrides Islands by France. He did not believe that any more important question than this toould be brought before the House, because it involved the fate of thousands of natives in various parts of their land. He hoped that the question would be discussed apart from any party feelings or consideration? For many year§ efforts of a beneficent character had been made in this colony towards civilising and educating the natives of these islands. Large blocks of land had been set apart by natives in New Zealand to produce funds for this work, and children of the natives had been brought here for education. Various religious bodies had directed their attention to the spread of Christianity through the New Hebrides, and the Presbyterian Church especially had done important work in this direction, and the people of the colony had contributed largely for thi3 purpose. In the first resolution he had prepared he asked the House to agree to the magnificent work that had been pro ceeding. The other resolutions might appear to be rather numerous, but he desired the people of New Zealand to have a succinct account of what had taken place. He asked the House to confirm this principle, th%t morality and justice affirmed that they had no right to enter into the future prospects or deetinies of these people, and give an assent to that which they had no right to consent. Be asked the House to say that the offer of France to cease the transportation of criminals to the x>ew Hebrides was a great boon that they had no right to accept. The question of the danger of additional transportation to the Isle of Pines should not move them from this course. He had refused to entertain the proposals for the reference of this matter to a Sel-ct Committee, because the way in which this offer was made seemed to imply a danger that the question might become a party one. It was wrong to* take from a body of men a possession which was their own, and hand them over to a foreign power, and no committee could report that such an action was right; but they were told that a committee wa3 necessary because there were confidential despatches which could not be laid before the House But such despatches could not alter the views of the House. The speaker proceeded to denounce the action of Earl Granville in connection with these negotiations as that of a "trackster." Even if the New Hebrides were to go, what guarantee would they have that successive Government? would observe their treaty, and would refrain from transporting criminals to these eea3 ? They had recently known Russia tear up treaties, saying they were wrongly worded, and why also should France not do the same ? The Premier said he did not intend to approach the matter in a party spirit. If Sir Geo. Grey was not dieposed to avoid party feeling, he should not have made use of remarks to which he gave utterance yesterday. He complained that Sir George Grey had not approached either the Ministry or the leader of the Opposition with regard to the resolutions/and held that he ehould have adopted this course if he wished his resolutions to be unanimously adopted. He was prepared te Bhow that the Government had be9n anything but quiescent on this matter, and proceeded to explain the action they had taken to secure independence of the Hebrides. Negotiations were still proceeding relative to the Bervey Group. The Kermadic Islands were annexed too, and it would be a great pity if Germany got Samoa. England's position in regard to the New Hebrides was that Germany and the latter power had arranged that France should take the island, and Germany would not object. The importance of Rapa would be seen from the fact that when the Panama Canal opened that would be the only port en route for New Zealand The New Zealand trade to the Hervey and Cook Groups was three time that of our trade to other islands, and amounted to £30,000. It was a fact that the French flag was actually flying on the New Hebrides, and unless England got Rapa or the Hervey Group it would be practicaly Bhut out of the Eastern seas. They could not send these resolutions to the Government in their present form, because they were not accurate. They did not show the policy of New Zealand—that policy was contained in the bill introduced last year. He considered the proper course to secure a resolution forcing the concurrence of all sides of the House would be to appoint a Select Committee of members having the confidence of the House, to frame resolutions. He asked of what value would be ft series of resolutions emanating from a member who spoke of Earl Granville'a action in the negotiation as a truckster. He regretted that the hon member had ho far forgotten himself as to be led away by an old feud between himself and Lord Gran- . ville, to make use of such an injudicious expression. He thought that the proper method to approach the Home Government was by a legal and respectful address to Her Majesty. He therefore moved that a committee be appointed to consider the question of the attitude this colony should pursue in such relation to the Pacific Islands, such committee to have power to call for persons and papers, and to report' from time to time, the Committee to consist of the following members: —The Hon. Major Atkinson, Sir G. Grey, Meeara Montgomery, Macandrew, Mow, O'Connor, the Son. W. Rolleston, Mr Beetham, Sir J. Vogel, and the mover. Be admitted that the Government had not been so successful in this matter as they wished, tjbut they had kept it constantly before the Colonial Office. hMt JpowanE , Stewart considered the Home mad country if ere under a lasting

— — . r - tlebfc of gratitude to ihe member for Auckland City East for the noble manner in '. which he had coma forward on this question, i and he believed the resolutions proposed by j that gentleman had the support of a majority of the members of the House. He did not believe the Government had the confidence of the people of the colony on this subject. The action of the Government was vacillating, and their attitude was not a proper one. The course pursued by the Premier of Victoria he believed represented the feelings of the people of New Zealand. The Premieb asked, What about New South Wales? Mr Stewart replied that he believed that the Premier was in sympathy with the Premier of New South Wales. If the French flag was flying at New Hebrides without the consent of Great Britain, they could compel that power to lower that flag again. New Zealand should not conceal publio opinion now. In England they were not sufficiently impressed with the importance of these topics, and it was necessary that the colonies should express their views. He believed an expression of opinion from New Zealand would have due weight with the Home authorities. In the event of war it would 1 be of the greatest importance to France 1 to have arsenals and dockyards in these Islands ; and from these depdts the commerce and passenger trade would be greatly harrfassed. He thought their policy should , be one of no surrender, and would prefer , any other nation than France acquiring these Islands. Major Atkinson trusted the debate would not degenerate into personal matter or a party content, (Hear, hear.) Unanimity on the subject was desirable, and practically | the question was, how could that be=«t be obtained ? Had New South Wales and New 1 Zealand joined the Federal Council, this 1 question would not have arisen. Had there been unanimity in the colonies, he ventured r to say that neither Raiatea nor Rapa would have been handed over to France in eettlement of Canada's dispute with France. Without we could speak unitedty, the Imperial Government would not look to theße islands. Our only chance of getting a particular policy established in the Pacific was by approaching the Federal Council and acting in concert with them. He could never be a party to bartering away the Hebrides to France or any other Power for any other island. (Cheers.) In view of the cablegram published to-day, be recognised that the ques1 tion was settled for a time. It was with regret he had to vote against the resolutions which expressed his views to a large extent, but he de-ired something like unanimity, which could only be obtained by the rele- ' eration of the matter to a Select Committee. Having spoken approvingly of the attitude 1 on the question always taken by the member for Auckland City East, he appealed to that gentleman to withdraw his resolutions. Mr Macindrew differed from the last speaker as to the result of New Zea- ' land not having joined in the Federal ' Council. He preferred seeing unanimity in the colony. The resolutions fully set forth the position which New Zealand, to his mind, ou^ht to take upon this subject 1 Friends of liberty all over the world should ! protest againat and re3ist the annnexation . ot New Hebrides on the Dart of France. If annexation were agreed to, a heavy blow to 1 the future progress and civilisation of those ! islands would be dealt. With a view to ' unanimity being attained, he hoped the resolution would be withdrawn Mr Montgomery protested against the 1 New Hebrides being bartered or other wife | ceded to France or any other Power. We should also let it be understood that we could not give our sanction to the procedure on the part of Great Britain. The resolutions were in entire accord with his opinions, and he '' could not -vote against them. Mr Stewart suggested that the Government should accept this amendment, " That in the opinion of this House, New Hebrides Islands should not be ceded to any foreign power." The Premier : No ; I cannot accede to that. The House rose at 5 30. On resuming at 7 30, Mr Hobbs said he thought it would be unwiee to speak in disparaging terms of their French neighbours who were in possession of New Caledonia. We should rathar prefer to cultivate a friendly feeling with those people. (The Premier : Hear) The House should enter its protest in a most firm and friendly manner ap ainst the French occupation of New Hebrides. Mr Fisher deprecated taking a passive action in respect to this question. He preferred seeing a loyal addres3 presented to the Queen, but if the resolutions were passed, he should feel compelled to support them. The Premier here intimated that he was willing that Sir George Grey's resolutions 1 should be referred to the Committee. He (Mr Stout) had proposed that the names of Messrs Downie Stewart and Scobie MacKenzie be added to the Committee. Some considerable waste of timefollowed, there being splitting of hairs on the question of procedure. Mr Dargaville moved the adjournment of debate till tv-morrow evening, with a vie ;v to a compromise being arrived at, but this was negatived on the voices. There was another long bill before any conclusion was arrived afc, but eventually the Premier's suggestion that both amendment and resolution be withdrawn was acted on. Sir Geo. «rey explained that he had withdrawn the resolutions because it had been stated that such a resolution from him would be received with disfavour in England. Mr Stout : I never paid that. Sir Geo. Grey : Well, it had been stated that in consequence of the manner in which he had spoken of the Secretary of State his resolutions were likely to be received with disfavour by the Home Government. It was time we emancipated ourselves from the fear of statesmen elsewhere. The Secretary of State could grant titles and honours of a temporary kind, and to incur his disfavour would be very unpleasant. Indeed, he could assure the House that in reflecting on Earl Granville, he had done so solely with reference to his late words and to late events, and not with respect to anything that had taken place rathe past. The Premier gave notice of motion for the appointment of the Committee already named for the consideration of the whole question. Loan Debentures Bill. The secondreading of the Loan Debentures Bill was shortly meved by the Treasurer and agreed to. - ' ' rj^ The House rose at 8.40.

THURSDAY. The House met at 2.30 p.m.

Questions. Replying to a question, the Minister said it was impossible in collecting the property tax statistics to show the mortgages on rural and town property separately. A bill was being introduced to c c port duty on gold.

Bills. The following bills were introduced and read * first time: Land Association Bill (Itcbb), Eight Hours',

Bill (Bradßhaw), Employment of ] Females Bill (Bradsdaw), Native Equit- <. able Owners Bill (Ballance), A Bill to Authorise the Purchase or' Acquisition ot Private Lands for the Purpose of Settlement (Grey). The introduction of the latter measure bad been assented to by the Governor, and it was taken in committee. , |

Returns. Returns were ordered as follows -.—Of acreage land in each district available under the Homestead system (Montgomery). All moneys expended by the colony in connection with Samoa (Hobbe). The expenses during the year in connection with Ministerial residences (Hurst). The travelling allowances drawn by Ministers and attendants during last year (Hurst). Thenumberof operators in the Telegraph Department, and the number who prosented themselves at competition examination in telegraphing in December, 1885 (ftoas).

Rabbit Pest. On the motion of the Hon. MfLarnaoh, a committee of Southern members was appointed to inquire into the best means of dealing with the rabbit pest, to confer with a similar committee from the Legislative Council, and report in a month. Sib Julius Vogel moved for the appointment of an Accounts Committee, and said he was willing to add further Otago members to it. Probably with the object of having additions made before the committee was agreed to, Mr Downie Stewart talked the motion out till 5 30 p.m. Municipal Corporations. At the evening sitting the Premier, in moving the second reading of the Municipal Corporations Bill, said it was a cunsolidatory measure. It dealt with the raising of the rates and expenditure of the same. There was a new provision with regard to borrowing, it being necessary that threefifths of those voting waa required to support a loan before it was sanctioned There was also a provision for the union of municipalities, and it was hoped that some of the smaller boroughs would join larger boroughs near them. Then it was proposed that the Mayor should be a Justice of Peace during his terra of office, without it being necessary for the Government to sanction the appointment. This was intended as a step towards elective justices. The hon. member for Manawatu bad been "o kind as to advise him Mith respect to uiany clauses of the bill, and he expressed hia indebtedness to that gentleman. He (the speaker) intended, at a later stage of the proceedings, to introduce a general leasing bill, giving boroughs the alternative powers with regard to leasing reserves, and copies of the measure had been for warded to all the municipal bodie3 in the colony, so that the chance would be given them, before it became law, of suggesting necessary amendments. Mr D. Stkwart hoped the Premier would not go into committee on this bill for 10 days at least, as the measure was very important and required full consideration. He objected to the clause rcndeiing the councillors liable for wrongful expenditure. He said it would deter men of substance from taking part in the administration of borough affairs. And he took exception to other clauses. Mr Sutton hoped the second reading would be postponed 8 or 10 days. The Premier said he had no wish to bring the bill on, but it passed the second reading last year, and a majority of the amendments were inserted at the request of members. If they delayed the second readings the progress of the * business would be greatly interfered with. Ho would ask for the second reading now, but the committal would not be taken till next week. Messrs Connolly and Moss suggested that the bill be delayed some time, in order that boroughs might have an opportunity of expressing their views respecting the measure. The second reading was carried on the voices and committal fixed for Tuesday next, the Premier promising that if any municipality wired that it had not time to consider the bill, he would agree to its committal being deferred till the following Friday. The Loan Debentures Bill passed through committee without amendment. This was read a third time and passed;

Land Grant to Middle Island Railway Mr G. F. Richardson, in moving that the Government be requested to cauee to be prepared for the information of this House a plan showing the several blocks of land proposed to be given to the Company for the construction of the East and VVeat Coast Railway, with the schedules giving description of the character and areas of such lands, said*the honour of the colony waa involved in thia matter. It was desirable that the inhabitants of the colony should know what land they were going to part with. The public puttirg their money into the Company for the construction of the line should also know the value of the land they were going to get. Sir George Grey moved as an amendment, " That^the Government should refer, for the report of a Special Committee, the question of the expediency of granting large blocks of land, mineral or otherwise, to companies as a concession for the construction of railways " An end should be put to the system of reserving large blocks of land for the construction of railways. In the United States.the system had occasioned great discontent. The East and West railway should be constructed as a colonial work, and he believed the major-'ty of the House would support such a proposal. Taking millions of acre 9 of Crown lands in this way was an improper attempt to rob the people of the heritage of their children. The Treasurer said that to carry the amendment would be an endeavour to withdraw from a contract entered into. He was sure the House would not take up so derogatory a position. After a lengthy discussion Sir George Grey's amendment was lost by 47 to 9. Mr Richardson's resolution was then put and negatived by 34 to 24, and the House rose at 10.30 D.m.