PROVINCIAL COUNCIL.

Southland Times, Issue 1173, 29 November 1869, Page 2

PROVINCIAL COUNCIL.

THURSDAY, NOVEMBER 25th, 1869. Evening Sitting. Mr Macdonald, the member for Carapbelltown, was introduced by Mr Wilson, and took his seat. ' Mr Wilson presented a petition from Mr John Menzies, of tbe Waianiwa, and moved that it be allowed to be read. Mr Kinross seconded. The petition— requesting leave to purchase the land occupied by an old track over section 4, block VI., now rendered useless by a new road crossing the Waianiwa creek, and supported by a declaration signed by 14 settlers — was read. Mr Wits on explained that the only persona affected by the disuse of the track \. were those who had signed the declaration. The petition was received. Mr M'Clure gave notice of motion for the production of the specifications of the agreement between the Government and the lessees of the Bluff Harbor and Invercargill Railway. THE SPEA.KERSHIP. Mr Johnston said he had already intimated he did not intend that his appointment to the Speakership should be a permanent one, and would now resign his office, calling upon the Council to fill the vacant chair. Mr Caldeb, said Mr Johnston had not assigned his chief reason for resigning, j It was considered irregular for a member ] of the Government to occupy the ' Speaker's chair. Mr Wilson thought Mr Johnston should occupy the chair until a Speaker was appointed, as it was objectionable to have no one to address. Some difference of opinion having been expressed as to the party with whom the onus of proposing a Speaker rested, Mr Calder said the Government had made a proposition, that if either Mr Steuart or Mr M'Clure would act as Speaker, on a division one of the Government supporters would be withdrawn, and, further, that the Speaker should have leave to vacate the chair, and speak on the floor of the House should he require to do so. He moved tbe appointment of Mr Steuart. Mr Wilson seconded. Mr Steuart would decline, even at the risk of the penalty for contempt. He thought the Government should provide a Speaker. Mr C alder said it appeared minority was inclined to coerce the majority. The election of Speaker was not a Government question. Mr Lumsden said the first election of Speaker was made an occasion for Government tactics, and such was the case now. It appeared inconvenient now to continue Mr Johnston in the office, and an attempt was made to throw the duty of providing a substitute on the other side. As to coercion, it was with the majority, from whom the nomination of the Speaker should come. If Mr Wilson and Mr Johnston were the men best fitted for the ofiice one of them should have been reserved for Speaker, and the Government filled up otherwise. It was the duty of the Government to provide a Speaker. Mr Johnston said Mr Lumsden had made out a strong case of party tactics, but as far as he (Mr J.) was concerned, acceptance of the ofiice was simply a concession. It had been said, himself and Mr Wilson were best fitted for the office- If other members chose to apply themselves they could be equally well fitted. Mr M'Clttre, referring to ° May," said that if a vacancy in the Speakership occurred during the session, it was the duty of a minister of the Crown to nominate his successor. Mr Caldeb had already done so. He would, however, now propose Mr M'Clure. Mr M'Clube would distinctly decline. Had he no other reason, the state of his health would prevent it. Mr Calder — although it was irregular, but not illegal — would now propose Mr Wilson. The Hon. Dr Menzies seconded. The course was unusual, and perhaps unprecedented, but " May " did not prohibit it. Mr Wilson" consented — reserving to himself the right to speak on any subject of importance. He wished to prevent a deadlock. The appointment of Mr Wilson was carried. NOTICES OF MOTION. Mr Calder moved — " That the ' Ap- 1 propriation Ordinance, No. 2, 1869/ be read a first time." Mr Macdonald seconded ; and the Ordinance having been read a first time, the second reading was made an order of the day for Saturday morning's sitting. Mr Webster, in moving — " That a Select Committee, to consist of the following members, viz., Messrs Menzies, Calder, Wilson, Lumsden, and the mover, be appointed to inquire into the financial state of the province — embracing the consolidated, as well as the floating liabilities — with power to call for persons, books, and papers ; three to form a quorum ; and report to this Council within six days " — said he was desirous of obtaining the information sought by the motion, for various reasons. He was a comparative stranger in the province, and particularly to its political aspect. He was not in possession, from authentic sources, of the information which he thought necessary to enable him to come to a fair conclusion as to the true position and prospects of the province. His opinion as to the best course to be ultimately adopted would depend on the information he might be able to obtain. As to the important subjects they would be called upon to consider, their proper settlement would depend mainly on this. It was important to geij together the best committee they* could, and have the present liabilities distinctly ascertained, and the future prospects fairly weighed.

A one-sided view was of no use— both sides must be represented. He doubted not but that there were many in the Council who were still open to conviction, and who would, upon the report of that committee, form their judgment. He claimed the support of all independent members. His own proclivities were known, but he would say that if such information as they might be able to elicit by the committee asked for, showed that it would be unwise to continue in our separate existence, he should be willing to give way, but he thought it at least wise to have authorised statements on which to proceed. As yet, the foundations for the conclusions which had been arrived at were very slender. They had been formed, in some instances, perhaps more as the result of a desire than a reasoning. It was on this ground ho asked for the committee. It would save time and trouble. The Hon. Dr Menzies seconded. Mr Caldeb said the mover of the resolution had, in his speech, expressed himself as though his wish was to have a valuation of the assets of the province. He had asked two questions, one of which was answered by the published statistics of the colony, and the other by the statement on the table. If Mr Webster denied that statement, it was for him to show wherein it was wrong. If it were intended to go into valuation of asset?, then he (Mr C.) objected to the constitution of that committee. Mr Webster would be ■willing to insert any desired name, and would ask leave to substitute Mr Johnston's name for that of Dr Menzies. Mr Johnston would not be able to bring up a report six days hence. The motion was amended by Mr Webster's proposed substitution. Mr M'GiLr,rvRAT thought, with the detailed statement before the Council, the appointment of such a committee as that moved for was waste of time, and, moreover, implied want of confidence. The Hon. Dr Menzies said Mr Calder, in 1864, had proposed a similar motion to that now before the Council, but more full, and extending further. On that occasion, the Superintendent was named as a member of the committee. He (Dr M.) thought it desirable that the whole matter should be considered, and a mixed committee would be less likely to bias. The Government had expressed an intention of proposing a great constitutional change, and the Council should master all belonging to the subject. If the Government opposed the appointment, it would seem like wishing that Council to take the course proposed blindly. Mr Kinross thought that, as all the information sought by the mover of the resolution could be obtained without a committee, there was no use in appointing it. The suggestion appeared made to cover the want of ideas. What was wanted was a radical change. Mr M'Clttre thought the opposition on the part of the Government was unwise. Mr Calder had, at different times, used equally forcible arguments on both sides of the question, and had warned the Council against the misery to ■ result from the course he was now - recommending. He (Mr MC.) thought the information should be given. Mr Toshack believed the Government were willing to give all information within their power. The head of the , Government had stated that deficiencies in the statement giyen, if any,. could be_ supplied at the Government offices. Mr Lumsden regarded it as the right . of members to obtain the information sought by the committee. Mr Calder said the information on the table was correct. He (Mr L.) challenged the statement. Campbell and Robertson's claim for <£144 10s lOd was not inserted. The proposed enquiry was what a commercial company would make in circumstances of difficulty. Investigation might show that the liabilities were not so immediately, pressing as was supposed. The province had before been in as bad a condition as now, and had tided over. The report of the Committee in 1864 described the province as prostrate and yet she now existed in a state of independence. Before throwing up that independence he would like to see what could be done. He regretted that Dr Menzies was left out, as he would have liked the Committee larger. Mr Macdonald said that Mr Calder had made a financial statement, and there were the returns on the table. Any member wishing further information could obtain it. He considered Mr Webster's motion a vote of censure. The Committee of 1864 had been referred to, but it must be remembered that then there was no Superintendent elected, and no Executive possessing the confidence of the Council. Mr Daniel considered the motion unnecessary. There was no wish to conceal anything of the state of the province, and, as 1864 had been referred to, ha (Mr D.) trusted no one wished a renewal of the state of matters then existing, when the Sheriff was in possession of the Government offices. Mr Dalbymple thought the detailed accounts asked for simply meant waste of - time. M> M'Neill said he thought the Government was under a misapprehension, as to the object of the mover of the resolution. The present was not an ordinary occasion, and members of the Council did not wish to return to their constituents without being able to say they had gone into the details of the matter, and were satisfied that the. course pursued was the only course open. Mr Caldeb would repeat that the floating liabilities of the province were before the House; the consolidated liabilities could be ascertained from the blue books. If the statement on the table were not full, he would supply any deficiency in his power to supply. The local liabilities could not, however, be given in detail.