PARLIAMENT.

New Zealand Times, Volume XXXIII, Issue 5491, 1 November 1878, Page 2

PARLIAMENT.

LEGISLATIVE COUNCIL. Thursday, October. 31. The Hon. the Acting-Speaker took the chair at 2.30 p.m. THE PREMIER AND SIR D. BELL. Sir F I>. BELL, following precedent on similar occasions, said he might be allowed to refer to an expression which Sir George Grey was reported to Lave used in another place, That report said that Sir George Grey made use of the following words :—“ Sir Dillon had stated that tho natives had passed the Laud Tax Bill, and they should be punished.” He (St Dillon) had never used such words. After explaining the utter impossibility of hia having used such words, he concluded by expressing his deep regret that Sir George, in the close of both their lives, should r present one with whom he had worked for many years, whom he had honored with his personal friendship, as having spokeu in such a manner of the natives, and should have done so in the face of his (Sir D. Bell's) denial. He regretted, he said, that it should have fallen to the lot of Sir George Grey to hold him (Sir Dillon) up to public execration for opinions which ho did not hold, which Sir George knew that he did not hold, and which be never expressed in his place in the Council. A discussion followed, in which members on all sides concurred in upholding the denial of Sir D. Bell as to his having used any such expressions as those attributed to him by Sir George Grey. NATIVE LAND ACT AMENDMENT. This Bill was read-a third tim« and passed. GOVERNMENT NATIVE LAND PURCHASE, This measure was further considered in committee.—On Mr. Hart’s amcndm u nt, t© proti-cb certain Scottish advances, there was a long discussion.—The amendment is in these words : “ Nothing herein contained shall * alter or affect the interests or rights to possession of land under memorial of ownership to orders for the issue of such memorials.” A division was called for For.fche amendment, 11; noes, 10. The remaining clauses were passed, and the Bill reported with amendments. Subsequently the Bill was re-committed, and the proviso slightly altered. WHAKATANE GRANTS VALIDATION BILL. This Bill was committed, amended, reported, read a third time, and passed. APPROPRIATION BILLS. The Public Works Appropriation Bill and the Appropriation Bill were introduced and read a first time. The Council adjourned at i o’clock, till 8 p.m., to admit of conferences being held in tho interval. The Council resumed at 8 p.m. GOVERNMENT NATIVE LAND PURCHASE BILL. The Bill was read a third time and passed, THE CONFERENCES. The report of tho conference on the Rating Bill was brought up and agreed to. The report on the Municipal Corporations Bill was also brought up and agreed to. Tho report of the conference on the Railways Construction Bill wai read. It recited what had been done, and Colonel Whitmore, saying that he thought the compromise -proposed a reasonable one, moved that a further conference be sought with the House of Representatives.—After Dr. Pollen had pointed out that the managers expressed no opinion at all, the Hon. Dr Grace showed the difficulties under which the conference had worked. The Speaker of the House of Representatives had persisted in saying that the Bill was an Appropriation BUI. He then informed the Council that the Attorney-General had proposed to make the amendments required by the Council by message from the Governor. Dr. Grace, continued to sky that this was a matter for the Council to decide—whether they should adopt the suggestion of the Vttoruey-Geueral, or, strong in their indefeasible right, and refusing to allow the Council to be guided by the opinion of the Speaker of the other Chamber, persist in their amendments, —The Hon. Mr. Waterhouse said the concession obtained was a great one. The House of Representatives had, in, effect, admitted that the Bill was not an appropriation one, despite the opinion of their Speaker.—The Hon. Mr. Hall thought the Council had in no degree exceeded their clear right; but the Speaker of the other Chamber held a ’strong opinion to the contrary, and, in all the circumstances of the case, he (Mr. Hall), while upholding the rights and privileges of the Council, which were important to the country,—if the point was conceded that this Biil should not be considered an Appropriation Bill, he would recommend that a further effort at accommodation - should ■ be- mak.—After a few remarks from the Hon. Captain Fraser, in which lie said he thought tho ini sertiou of the clause objected to was , intentional, the Hon. Colonel Whitmore moved for the appointment of fresh managers, which \vas agreed to, and the Council adjourned, so that the conference could be held.

. PUBLIC WORKS ACT AMENDMENT. Before adjourning, a message was received saying that the House of Representatives could not agree to certain amendments made by tbe Council in tills Bill. —The Hon. Colonel Whitmore moved that the Council do not insist on the amendments objected to.—Motion agreed to. After au interval of an hour and a half, the report of the managers was brought up by Mr. Hall, who moved a resolution confirming the ■ report oa condition that the House should, adopt the amendment, as proposed, by message from the Governor. The Hon. Colonel WHITMORE : Sir, on behalf of the Ministry, I undertake that that shall be done. PUBLIC WORKS AND IMMIGRATION. On tbe motion for second reading, the Hon. Mr. Waterhouse called attention to the 17th clause, which clearly contained a tack. The Hon. Colonel WHITMORE said t danse was iutndnced in the fear that the Railways Construction Bill would not pass. The clause was necessary to prevent immediate difficulty in the prosecution of public works. But since the report of the late conference had been adopted he was authorised to say, on behalf of the Government, that the clause would be withdrawn. The Hon. Mr. WATERHOUSE then moved a resolution so that a record should appear of the fact that tho Council had noticed what it considered a tack ; but relying on the assurtuce of the Government as above had permitted the Bill to proceed. However, could not allow the Bill to pass without noticing some objectionable features—the construction _ .of sm ill local works out of loan, the contracting temporary loans, and in other respects. The payment of such an item as Colonel McDouuell’s compensation out of loan ho mentioned as indicating a vicious system of finance. Sir D. B RLL. referring to the Railways Construction Bill in Victoria and Telegraph Bill in England, showed that these Bills (precisely similar to tho Bill on which the conference had just been sitting) bad not been considered -Appropriation Bills. He maintained that Sir William I’itzherbert was holding opinim-g at variance with, liud taking a different chip # to, that of his (Sir Dillon'S) predecessor and himself (Sir D. Bell.) And he had with him in his view tho greatest speaker of the British House of- Commons, who was now tho guide, in England, in all matters of trouble. Were ho (Sir Dillon) the leader of this Council he would advocate that in such difficulties as had just arisen the assistance of the Speaker of tho British House of Commons should be sought He was satisfied with the •compromise which was arrived at, and the happy termination of the affair was a subject of congratulation ; the more particularly as it had been arrived at without any bitterness being shown on either side. (Hear, hear.) . ' _ , . „ After pome remarks from Captam X rascr and Mr. Peacock, Colonel- Whitmore replied. The resolution of Mr. Waterhouse was then put and adopted, and tho Bill was read a second time. APPROPRIATIONS RILL. This Bill was read a second time without discussion, and the Council wont into committee. . «... .i The two Appropriation Bills were then committed, reported, read a third time, and passed, and The Council adjourned at 11.35 p.m. house of representatives. Thursday, October 31. The Speaker took the chair at 2.30 p.m. the judges. Tho Hon Mr. STOUT formally moved the ■ House into Committ -o of Supply, to enable Mr. Barton to make a motion. Mr BARTON said he had intended to ■ move a motion, but in consequence of so many 1 members having left Wellington and the hour of prorogation was so near, that ho felt any expression of opinion from the House as at ; present constituted was of little or no value, and that, therefore, a motion would be futile. Under those'* circumstances, ho should not i move the motion standing in his name. The motion for Committee of Supply was then withdrawn,

BILLS WITHDRAWN. The Riverton High School-Bill, Onehuoffa Grammar Maori Representation Bill, Electoral Bill, South Canterbury Education Reserves Bill, and South Dunedin Reserves Bill. DANIEL JA3XES MOOBE. The following motion was agreed to, on a division, by 14 to 12, —Tliat this House will to-morrow resolve itself into a committee of the whole, to consider of a respectful address to be presented to hi *• Excellency the Governor, praying that provision may bo made to give effect to the recommendation or the Goldfields Committee upon the petition of Daniel James Moore, of Otago. Mr. RICHARDSON ; Will the Government givo effect to a resolution carried in a thin House like this 1 [The Hon. Mr STOUT : No.] I know a great many members have strong objections to the resolution, and that on a fair division It' would never have been carried. The Hon. Mr. STOUT pointed out that the resolution affirmed something that could not be carried out, viz., that the House should tomorrow resolve itself into a .committee. The House would be prorogued before it could come on again. After soino little discussion the matter dropped. MANCONUI AND BAT OF ISLANDS ELECTORAL BILL. Sir ROBERT DOUGLAS was not going to proceed with this Bill ; but he said he had to complain of the misrepresentations he had been subject to at the hands of the newspaper owned by the Government., He quoted the remarks made, and also the provisions of the Bill, to show he had been unfairly treated. He contended that it was nothing but just that those persons who had been put on the roll by n, mistake, to say the least of it, should be called upon next year to defend their claims ; bat now it was toe late, and the Government must take the responsibility. Mr. TOLE complained that a member of the other House, who had a newspaper in his hands, grossly slandered him (Mr. Tole) and others, ' who had endeavored to do the natives justice in the matter. He went into the whole transaction at great length, and defended the Government in the course they had taken. After some remarks from Mr. Barff, the debate was adjourned for half an hour to allow of. a conference being held with the Council. The House re-assembled at 7 p.m. The Hon. Mr. STOUT informed the House that the conference of both Houses, with regard to the Railways Construction Bill, had separated without coming* to an agreement; the managers of the Legislative Council insisted on a clause which interfered with the privileges of the House of Representatives, as it was an Appropriation Bill. He believed it was intended by the Legislative Council to move for fresh managers. If that woie done, and a message were sent down to that effect, then he thought fresh managers should also be appointed by the House of Representatives. The Legislative Council would not meet until eight o'clock, ond therefore the House would have to be adjourned again until a quarter-past eight. The report of the conference on ihe Rating Act Amendment Bill was agreed to. The report of the conference on the Municipal Corporations Amendment Act was agreed to, 3XANGONUI AND BAY OF ISLANDS ELECTORAL BILL. The debate on the motion for the second reading of this BUI was resumed. Mr. HOBBS said he would vote against the BUI, and he regretted that it had ever been brought before the House. He hoped the people of New Zealand would suspend their judgment in this matter before it had been thoroughly investigated before au impartial commission. Whatever the decision of the commission might be neither time nor trouble would be spared by him to thoroughly sift the matter far his own satisfaction. Mr. Williams had been a long time in the public service, aud he had always borne a high character, and it was for this reason that ho thought a full and impartial investigation should be made. Mr. SWANSON thought it was an ruufnrtunafce circumstance that Mr. Williams should be called upon to resign at the time he had. Ho hoped this matter would be fully and impartially inquired into on the spot; and in connection with the proposed commission, there was one gentleman whom he should like to see appointed by the Government to conduct the inquiry. He referred to the hon. member for Wanganui (Mr. Bryce). There was not a single member of the House who had not the ( highest confidence in Mr. Bryce, and in the ability, patience, and impartiality with which such an Inquiry as this would be conducted by ] that hon. gentleman. Mr. Bryce lived far ■ away from the Bay of Islands, and could not 5 j>-.v«dbly be biassed one way or the other. He > (Mr, Swanson) felt satisfied that no man who '< could be selected would give such satisfaction i as Me. Bryce would give, if he could be in- 1 daced to go fco the Bay of Islands to hold the | inquiry. He believed that all parties would be thoroughly satisfied if that gentleman were chosen, and they would then get I at the truth of the whole matter. He re- ] grttted that Mr. Bryca had left for his home, J or he should have asked him whether he ( would be willing to go before he (Mr. Swanson) made the suggestion ho did. He hoped, ' however, that the Government would indicate 1 whether Mr. Bryce would be appointed as a j commission, in the event of that gentleman ■ consenting to undertake it. ‘ Mr. MACFARLANE considered it would i be a great thing if a gentlemen of Mr. Bryco’s 1 high reputation could bo induced to conduct this injury. He hoped the Government would ; be able to induce that gentleman to proceed to the Bay of Island-*. Sir GEORGE GREY said the suggestion made by the hon, member for Newton (Mr. Swanson) would receive the earnest consideration of the Government, and in alMikelihood Mr. Bryce would be appointed as a commission if he consented to act. After a few remarks from Sir ROBERT Douglas, the motion for the discharge of the Bill was negatived, and the motion for its withdrawal carried on the voices. The House adjourned until 0 p.m. A message was read from the Legislative Council, stating that fresh managers had been appointed to confer with managers of the House of Representatives on the Railways Construction Bill. Messrs. Moss, Macfarlane, and Ballanco were appointed, and the House adjourned for half an hour. Shortly before 11 p.m., the Hon. Mr. Bal ‘ lance announced that the conference had agreed to the following report; — “The managers being unable to agree upan the question whether clause 3 of the Bill is or is notan appropriation clause, recommend that the amendments made in the said clause be omitted, and that the Ministry advise his Excellency the Governor to avail himself of the powers of the fifith section of the Constitution •Act, by transmitting the following amendments for the consideration of the Legislative Council and House of RepresentatiTes instead of those that the Legislative Council proposed— “ Provided always that no contract shall be entered into for the construction of any railway or any portion thereof,' unless—l. In the case of each line to bo constructed plans and estimates shall bo laid before the Governor da Council, with a certificate from the chief engineer that the route chosen for the xailway is the best available one. “ 2. Hnch pi ms and estimates to be approved by the Governor in Council. “And it is hereby declared that within thirty days after the commencement of the then next session of Parliament, such plans and estimates shall ho laid before both Houses of Parliament, together v/Ith a copy of any contract which may have been entered into in respect of the railway to ivhich such plans aud estimates refer. “J. Bailancb, “ J. S. Macfarlank, “ Fdk. Moss.” The Hon. Mr, STOUT said that ho would more tha adjournment of the House until 11 a.m. to morrow, in caso any Bills might bo sent down with amendments from the Legislativo Council. The prorogation would take place on Saturday. The House adjourned until 11 a.m.next day. The Hon, Mr. SHEEHAN stated that the Ilinemoa would leave immediately with tho Taranaki and Auckland members.