PARLIAMENT.

New Zealand Times, Volume XXXI, Issue 4840, 26 September 1876, Page 3

PARLIAMENT.

HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES. Monday, September 25. The Speaker took the chair at half-past seven o'clock. NOTICES. Sir GEORGE GREY gave notice to introduce a Bill providing that all males of twentyone years and upwards in the colony should have a vote. I Mr. O'RORKE gave notice that he would ask whether the Government intended to I provide a steam launch for the harbor of Manukan. Mr. JOYCE gave notice that he would ask whether the government would extend to evening papers during the recess their present privilege of receiving five hundred words at evening rates. QUESTIONS. Mr. HAMLIN asked the Government, —If they will take steps to give effect to the recommendation of the Public Petitions Committee in the case of Coleman Phillips ? The Hon. Major ATKINSON said the Government did not intend to take any steps. Mr. REES asked the Premier,—Whether the Government intend to give effect to the recommendation and report of, the Public Petitions Committee in the matter "f the petition of Gill, Tudehope, and Harker ? The Hon. Major ATKINSON said the recommendation was approved of, and the sum would be placed on the Estimates. In answer to Mr. Murray, Major Atkinson ' said the report by Mr. Wilson, Native Land Purchase Commissioner, would be laid on the table in a day or two. new bills. The following Bills were introduced:—Dunedin Drillshed Reserve Bill, Blueskin Recreation Reserve Bill, and Blueekin Athenseum Reserve Bill. PROVINCIAL ABOLITION FINANCIAL ARRANGEMENTS BILL. The House went into committee to consider of giving leave to introduce the Provincial Abolition Financial Arrangements Bill. The Bill having been introduced, Mr. O'RORKE reported, and it was read a first time; and the second reading made an order of the day for the day following. MUNICIPAL CORPORATIONS ACT AMENDMENT BILL. The report of the committee on the above Bill was agreed to, and the Bill was read a third time, and passed. HARBOR BOARD BILLS. Several Harbor Board Bills were introduced and read a first time. ' POST-OFFICE ACTS AMENDMENT BILL. The House went into committee on the above Bill. Mr. BURNS suggested that there should be halfpenny postal cards instead of penny, and moved that the word halfpenny be substituted. Mr. WAKEFIELD pointed out that there were ho halfpence in-the country. He thought the newspaper stamps were a mistake, and did not think there would be any public objection to the rate being made a penny. Sir GEORGE GREY supported the proposed reduction. The Hon. Mr. WHITAKER opposed it.. On the question being put a division was called for, and taken with the following result: —Ayes, 49 ; noes, 20. Mr. BURNS suggested that it should be made a halfpenny for the towns, and a penny for the country. The only way to make postal cards popular was to make them cheap. Sir GEORGE GREY supported the last speaker. The Hon. Mr. BOWEN reminded the House that this was an experiment, and it was easier to reduce if found necessary than to add. Mr. WAKEFIELD opposed making any division between town and country in the postal system. Mr. BURNS moved as an amendment to clause 2 that the rate of postal cards be Id. for places where the postal charge is now 2d., and sd. for places where the charge is Id. Mr. DONALD REID opposed the reduction. Mr. ROWE said his residence at home was just six feet outside the boundary of the town, •-and it would be an awkward distinction to make a difference of Jd. between him and his neighbor six feet distant. He thought the discussion was useless, and should be dropped. Mr. SHRIMSKI would favor a vote of 3d. per card. ' A division was taken on the amendment, which was negatived by 45 to 19. Sir GEORGE GREY moved that after the price stated the words bo added or Buch other value as the Governor in Council may from time to time determine. A division was taken, the amendment being negatived by 36 to 29. The remaining clauses were passed without amendment, and the Bill was reported to the House, read a third time, and passed. COUNTIES BILL. On the motion to go into committee on this Bill, Mr. SEYMOUR said there had been very considerable alterations made in the Bill, and he wished to say a few words upon it before the Speaker left the chair, because he did not altogether approve of the transformation which had taken place, and could not see with respect to the permissive part of it what position the counties would be in—it was not made clear. He thought some provision should be made for exonerating districts under peculiar circumstances from the operation of the Act, particularly so in the case of certain small islands. As to the appeals to Court for the correction of rolls, he considered that greater latitude should be allowed as to the particular Court in which the appeal and revision Bhould take place, inasmuch as an application to the Court appointed by the R.M. might be to many extremely inconvenient. He objected to tbe ; provision in clause 53. that 'chairmen of road boards so long as they were drawing salary should not be eligible as candidates for the House.of Representatives, or to be called to the Legislative Council. He referred to

other clauses in which he found objectionable provisions with regard to loans, &c. Mr. ROLLESTON was going to speak, of the Bill as one which he would endeavor to assist through committee, but the Bill in its I pvesent form would not be satisfactory to the country at large. It was calculated to cause confusion instead of harmony between the General and local Governments. The principal defect of the Bill was that it separated the town from the country, that it took too sudden a step in the direction of change. The country generally did not really know what abolition meant, as was admitted by the Government the other night, because one district would naturally have different ideas as to what should take the place of that which was taken away. He did not think this form would be acceptable. He framed some resolutions which indicated his idea of that which was required. They were as follows:—(1.) That the counties shall include boroughs, and shall be coterminous with the existing provinces, subject to alterations in their boundaries, as provided for in section 9 o£ the Counties Bill, and with power to create new counties. (2.) That there shall be a council for eich county or province, consisting of not less than nine, and not more than fifteen members. (3.) Such council shall be elected by the road boards and municipalities within each county or province ; and where no road boards are constituted provision shall be made for the division of the county into districts for this purpose. (4.) The chairman of the council shall sit in the council, and shall have a deliberative and casting vote on all proceedings of the council. (5). In addition to the discharge of such business as shall be entrusted to him by the council, the chairman shall perform such duties as may from time to time devolve upon him by authority of the Governor or of the General Assembly. He pointed out that there were other objections to the Bill, such as the spontaneous breaking off of counties. As to the financial proposals, they presented nothing new, and they would have the counties coming to the House for money, as the provinces had done ; and he thought this was the reason why the Government had provided for chairmen of boards not being eligible as representatives in the General Assembly. The hon. member went on to say that the borrowing powers, as given, were fraught with very considerable danger. It was taking a step backward, he thought, and the boundaries of the counties were not at all satisfactory, and suggested that they should be cotermiuous with those under the provincial system. Then, again, he could not see why the land fund should not be evenly distributed throughout the country. The separation of boroughs was a grave mistake, and calculated to impair the satisfactory working of the Act. As to the number of members of councils, he thought by having fewer members the general interests of the country would be more sought after than individual interests. The election of members to the county councils should be left to the road boards and boroughs. In conclusion, he trusted he should be given credit for a desire to serve the country in the position he took up regarding the Bill, to which he could assure the House he should offer no factious opposition. Sir GEORGE GREY wished to know what reply the Government had received from the Home Government as to the abolition of p:-o-vinces/reminding them of what Lord Carnarvon had stated with respect to the question of confederation, as affecting the West Indies, that it could not be proceeded with by her Majesty's Government save at the spontaneous request of each Legislature concerned.

Mr. REYNOLDS said he could not conscientiously approve of the Bill, because the majority of the people in Otago were opposed to it. He referred to a caucus meeting of Otago members at which a resolution in favor of one county for Otago was passed. Mr. LUMSDEN contradicted .Mr. Reynolds. He (the speaker) had not agreed to any such resolution. He was simply actuated by a desire to assist the passage of the Bill as far as possible through, the House. Mr. JOYCE said the resolution was agreed to without much deliberation, and subject to future provisions. Mr. PYKE was astonished to hear the member for Port Chalmers endeavoring to mislead the House as to the feeling of the Otago members, who, as a matter of fact, did not desire that Otago should be one county. They did not desire to be tacked on to the province of Otago. Mr. ANDREW said he should support the Bill before the House. It was not perfect, but would have to be perfected by the localities themselves.

The Hon. Major ATKINSON said that the Government had not made any explanation of the Bill as amended, because the late Government had already spoken on it, and the alterations embodied the views of those who had contended for amendment in different directions. The principle objections taken to the Bill were of a nature which would have been better discussed in committee.

Mr. ROWE said the Bill did not adequately provide for local government, and hoped to see it amended in committee in the direction of reducing the extent of counties. Mr. MURKAY-AYNSLEY, in reference to what he said about Lord Carnarvon's despatch, stated that there was no analogy between the circumstances of New Zealand now and the islands he alluded to, because the latter were virtually separate colonies. Mr. WOOLCOCK thought time was being wasted, and that discussion on the details of the Bill should be deferred until the House went into committee.

Mr. DONALD REID disagreed with the last speaker as to the waste of time, and said with regard to the remarks made by the member for Dunstan that he had not represented the views of the members for Otago. The general desire was to proceed tentatively, and that hereafter other measures might be determined on as they were found to be requisite. The House then went into committee on the Bill.

The amendments made in the old Bill were agreed to pro forma, and the Bill reported to the House, after u hich The Hon. Mr. WHITAKEB. moved, and it was carried, that the Bill be recommitted tomorrow (this day). EDUCATION BOARDS BILL. The Hon. Mr. BOWEN, in moving the second reading of the Bill, gave an outline of its provisions, and stated that the Bill was a temporary measure to carry on the system of education thonghnut the colony for a time. Mr. MONTGOMERY, while he would not oppose the Bill, objected very strongly to the levying of a rate of £1 per child. Mr. DONALD KEID did not look upon the payment of fees as a burden ; on the contrary, he thought the result would be more advantageous, and moreover, the system of fees should be continued unless the Government contemplated increasing the salaries of teachers, as the latter would otherwise be done a manifest injustice. He hoped that the system of fees would be continued, otherwise he had no objection to the Bill. Mr. STEVENS agreed with the Bill in the main, but took exception to charging for that which he thought should be provided for by the State. Mr. KOTXESTON said the school fee system was wrong if education were to be compulsory, which he took it was intended. Mr. HUNTER supported the imposition of fees, thinking that the colony had not yet arrived at a state inwhich it could afford tosupply entirely free education. He regarded the provision respecting rates as satisfactory, and thought it was a subject with regard to which they should benefit by the experience of other countries.

Mr. J. E. Bitowsr, Mr. Kennedy, and Mr. Andkew followed, the latter remarking that England was not to be taken as an example for the colony iu this respect, inasmuch as the countries were so differently circumstanced. He looked upon this Bill as a patchwork affair. It would have been better to have maintained the Boards as at present existing, and bring down a large measure next session, one which would throw the coßt of education on the Consolidated Revenue.

After a good deal of further discussion, The Hon. Mr. BOWEN, in reply, said he had purposely avoided the topics touched

upon during- the debate, because the Bill was of a temporary character only. As a matter of fact the Bill provided for a diminution of the charges made all over the colony. The Bill was then read a second time, and ordered to be committed next day. The House adjourned at 1.10 a.m.