PARLIAMENT.

New Zealand Mail, Issue 35, 23 September 1871, Page 4

PARLIAMENT.

HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES. Thursday, September 14. the education bill. Mr FOX said he was gratified at the feelings expressed towards himself and the Government. With regard to the appointment of a'Minister of Education, it was not the intention of the Government to appoint a new Minister of Education in addition to the Ministers who already sat on the Government benches. There would be no additional expenses; the duties would be undertaken by a Minister in addition to the portfolio which ho already held. He altogether demurred to the view that the Minister of Education should be independent of the Government, and should hold his office for all time, subject to good conduct. It would place him beyond all control; such a course would be opposed to the general rule that the'responsible administrators should have the control of every officer of the State. The next point was the definition of the districts, which are at present conterminous with the provincial boundaries. Hon members were running away with the idea that the provinces were to be set on their legs again by the erection of provincial boards. _ The Government wished to interfere as little as possible with the existing machinery. They thought they would be acting very unwisely by making any violent eruption ; and if they had to take any division, there was none that they could take so easily as the provincial boundaries. The next point was a very important one —the constitution of the boards. He thought, as far as he had been able to gather from the opinions of hon members, that the elective wastheright one, but he thought he saw advantages, so long as Provincial Governments existed, in bringing the boards into communication with the Provincial Executive. Reasons had been given to him which induced him to believe that the communication would be desirable, and he proposed that the boards should consist of the Superintendent and Treasurer of each Province, and so many members, from five to twelve, elected by the school committee, They would be the connecting link between the pulse of the province and the school board, and ho had reason to believe that such a plan was not an unwise provision. He would favor the idea of a compromised board of this sort. Then, as to the school fees. There were many reasons in favour of the payment of fees. It interested the parent in the education of his children, and it was a very considerable source of school revenue. In framing Mr Foster's bill, it was found unwise to abandon them, and it had been decided to retain the provision for the payment of fees. In America no school fees were charged, but he thought, on the whole, they should adopt them ; that either fees should be charged, at such a rate as the board might -appoint, or that the Nelson system, which imposed an annual rate of £1 on every householder, in addition to a head rate of 5s for each child not exceeding four in any one family, should be adopted. He would now approach that very ticklish, and, at the same time, fundamental point of the bill—the subject of the aided schools ; a point on which he expected as great a difference of opinion, and as narrow a majority as on any other portion of the bill ; stiil he hoped they would have a majority, because it would be most unwise to sweep them away ; it would be unjust to shut the door against them to the extent they were provided by the bill. More than that, it would give rise to such an amount of opposition among a large section of society, that it would render the working of their school system as a general, national system almost impracticable* It was not a system that could be worked in the face of a violent opposition ; it must have a very large majority among the people. On these grounds he hoped the aided schools would not fail to pass through the House. The next series of clauses was the conscience clauses, and the necessity for them would depend on the question whether the aided schools and the Bible elauses passed ; if these conscience clauses were thrown out, then there would be no necessity for the aided schools. If the House passed one they would require the other. He would pass them over and come to the consideration of the Bible clause —the clause which prescribed that the Bible should be read daily. Several hon members, some of whom he scarcely expected to do so after the manner in which they had expressed themselves, did object to the use of the Bible in schools. He had endeavored to get at the reasons for objecting to the use of that book being read to the children in the schools, and the reasons, as far as he could understand, were three: the first was the impropriety of such a course ; the second was the uni’easonableness of such a thing ; and the third was that it would have an injurious effect to endeavor to teach children dogmatic theology. He agreed that it was even fruitless and unnecessary to attempt to instil dogmatic ideas into the minds of children of tender ages, and as far as that object went he quite concurred that it was objectionable, but it did not follow that if the Bible were read in the schools that it should convey one dogmatic idea. A thousand passages might be permitted to be read with great advantage in the presence of the most innocent minded child. Experience proved that there was very little fear of schoolmasters adopting dogmatic teaching; they would be found to be quite content to give the reading merely—they were not in the habit of giving dogmatic teaching—they were not likely to attempt to proselytise. Objection was on the ground that there were erroneous translations in the Bible, but he thought that entirely fell to the ground; he had read Bishop Colenso’s work, and it did not weigh very much with him. There were many passages that would form the staple of a child’s education, and he thought the objection a very weak one.

Another objection —and as a conscientious one he regarded it with all respect, particularly if it were used by a father towards his own child — was that there were passages in the Scripture which ought not to meet the ear of a child. But that was purely a matter of selection ; selections might be made that would obviate that objection altogether. He could not help remarking on what he would not call hypocrisy but a feeling of affected delicacy in such an objection, and he confessed it was with some amazement he heard it urged by several hon members on behalf of the children of the working classes; the very persons who insisted on the giving of nothing more than a merely elementary teaching, and opposed anything in the shape of a classical education, and yet were, at the same time, scraping together every farthing for the purpose of giving their children this very classical education they so much objected to, or at any rate the highest education they could afford to pay for. He was sure, and he thoroughly agreed with the hon member for the Hutt when he made the statement, that the Bible was the book of books, and he trusted the House would not be a party to prescribing that the Bible should not be read in schools. Another point on which there was a difference of opinion was as to compulsory education, and the general opinion of the House seemed to be that it was desirable if it was possible to carry it out, yet that in the present state of society it would he very difficult to enforce the observance of that portion of the bill. He concurred in the objection, and proposed to follow the course adopted in England, namely, to leave it to the local boards to settle whether, in each particular instance, compulsory education should be decided on or not. If the Government carried the bill and the feeling of the country was that it was a good one he knew of no reason why they should not carry it out, so that he hoped the House would allow the compulsory clauses to stand. Then came the question of rates. A great difficulty rested on the fact that the different provinces had different systems. They must expect that every portion of the community would object to fresh taxation, and he must confess that as regarded the property rate he was opposed to it, because it was unjust to throw upon the landed estate the whole burdens of the community; personally, he would object to its being levied solely on landed property. This matter might also be left to the local authority in each province, although he would propose that it should be a household rate, because there was the argument in its favor that two provinces had already adopted the household rate —Nelson and Canterbury. Mr Fox read from a return to show what the result of a household rate would be. There were at present in New Zealand 65,129 houses, of which, to use a Hiberniauism, 2014 are tents, and that left 63,115, after deducting the tents, liable to pay the rate, which at £1 per house would produce a corresponding amount in money. At present, the total amount collected for school expenses in all the provinces was £37,672, Of course in those provinces where the rate was at present paid it would not touch them at all. Mr Fox read the amount of school expenditure in each province for the past year, showing the amounts, according to population, which should have been spent for school maintenance in each province, and the actual amounts paid. Many of the provinces were lamentably low, Marlborough—where there was only one schoolmaster, and that one a lady—having spent only about £4O, while a head rate would have required the expenditure of over £IOOO ; while Otago, which by the same ratio need not have spent more than £15,000 had spent £IB,OOO. From these returns, Mr Fox said it would be seen that where the people were willing to tax themselves a sufficient amount could be raised for the educational requirements of the whole colony. Having touched upon the direction the Government would take, and the amendments they would consent to adopt in the bill, he would leave it with the House, and if it were bo modelled as in their opinion it would be desirable to withdraw it, they would do so, and allow the people of tho country to discuss it during the recess. He would move the House into committee on Friday next, at half-past seven o’clock. The bill was then read a second time. Friday, September 15. The Speaker took the chair at half-past two o’clock. NELSON GAS BILL. This bill was committed, reported without amendment, read a third time, and passed. MESSAGE EROM HIS EXCELLENCY. The SPEAKER anuounced the receipt of Message No. 2 from His Excellency, transmitting the Dunedin and Port Chalmers Railway Bill, with an amendment adding a new clause which stated that the gauge of the railway should be 3ft 6in instead of 4ft Bfin. The amendment was agreed to and the clause added to the bill petitions. Mr Reynolds, Mr Harrison, Mr G. M'Lean, Mr Bathgate, and Mr Reeves, presented petitions, which were ordered to lie on the table. public petitions, committee. Mr T. KELLY brought up the report of the Petitions Committee on the petition of Tupanga, of Auckland, complaining of European interference with the foreshore at the Thamesthe committee reported that the matter set forth was settled by the terms of the treaty of Waitangi. Also, the report of the committee upon the petition of 255 laboring men and others of the city of Dunedin, praying the House to pass a measure regulating the periods of payment of workmen by contractors; the committee recommended the petition to the favorable consideration of the House. Also, the report of the committee on the petition of Francis Williams, stating that an act was passed in 1863 whereby he became entitled to select,

subject to conditions, a certain portion of land, that from various causes he has not made the selection, and praying'that he may be enabled to do so; the committee recommended that the petitioner should be permitted to make selection of his land within twelve months. Also, the report of the committee on the petition of E. Holliday, widow of the late John Holliday, a discharged soldier from her Majesty’s 57th .Regiment, praying that she may have a grant of the land her husband would have been entitled to ; the committee reported that the petitioner’s husband had not complied with the regulations applying to the selection of land by discharged soldiers, and they could not, therefore, recommend the petition to the favorable consideration of the House. Also, the report of the committee on the petition of J. M'Evoy, a discharged soldier from her Majesty’s 58th Regiment, praying for a grant of land as a discharged soldier; the committee’s report was similar to that in the last case. MAP BOOM. Mr WOOD brought up the report of the committee appointed to select a suitable room in which to exhibit the various railway plans in the possession of the House. The committee had selected a room which, at a slight expense, could be adapted to the necessary requirements, and he wished to know if the Government were willing to incur the expense. Mr GISBORNE said the Government would see that the work was carried out. PAPERS. Mr GISBORNE laid on the table a number of papers and returns. SECOND READINGS. The Agricultural Lien Act Amendment Bill, the Jury Bill, the Canterbury Forest Plantation Encouragement Bill, the Sale of Poisons Bill, and the Carrington Land Grant Bill, were read a second time. COMMITTALS. The Wellington Special Settlements Bill, the Wellington Waste Lands Regulations Amendment Bill, and the Otago Settlements Bill, passed through committee. The amendments in the first named bill were ordered to be considered on next sitting day, and the two latter were read a third time and passed. PETTING BACK THE CLOCK. Mr FOX moved that a copy of the affidavits of Sir David Monro and Mr D. M. Luckie, filed in the Supreme Court, Nelson, in the case of Monro v Luckie and Collins, be laid on the table of the House. He also asked the leave of the House to lay on the table an affidavit by George Maurice O’Rorke, Esq, relative to the putting back of the House clock by Sir David Monro, the then Speaker of this House, during a division in the session of 1862, and extracts from cotemporary newspapers reporting the debate which ensued upon a motion made by Mr Fox, and seconded by Mr Curtis, relative to the putting back of the clock on that occasion ; together with an extract from the journals o i this House, recording the said motion so made by Mr Fox. The motion was agreed to. CIYIL SEEVICE CORRESPONDENTS. Mr HARRISON moved that any regulations issued in pursuance of the resolution of the House on 20th July, 1870, defining the position of officers in the civil service with respect to their connection with the press as correspondents or otherwise, be laid upon the table. Mr GISBORNE said that as the regulations were similar to those of Victoria, there would be no necessity for laying them on the table. THE COUNTY OF WESTLAND. Mr HARRISON asked leave to postpone his resolutions, on account of the non-arrival of certain papers and documents which were necessary to the case. WELLINGTON EECLAIMED LAND BILL. This bill was committed, for the purpose of considering amendments made by the Select Committee. The amendments were agreed to and their consideration ordered for Tuesday. SAYINGS BANKS. Mr T. L. SHEPHERD moved that a bill be introduced to compel the annual publication by the Government and private banks in the colony of New Zealand, of the names of depositors and the amount of their deposits, the principal or interest of which has not been claimed for a period of three years prior to such publication; such bill to apply to unclaimed deposits and interest prior to the passing of such bill. Mr BATHGATE thought the hon member should postpone the debate until a subsequent debate, in which the whole system of public accounts would be brought under notice. He thought the banks had no right to continue the practice referred to by the hon member. He thought if a person died in the manner described by the hon member, the whole of the money should go to the Crown, and not be appropriated by a private individual. By our laws, if a person picked up a five-pound note, having some knowledge to whom it belonged, and did net return it, he was liable to be prosecuted, and why should these institutions be permitted to appropriate unclaimed deposits. Mr VOGEL hoped the hon member would withdraw his motion on the assurance that inquiry would be made into the matter. Mr M'LEOD thought the Ministry might go a little further in the matter. The sooner the banks were subject to some such inquiry the better. He looked upon it as a serious matter.

Mr G. M'LEAN thought Mr Bathgate, who had some experience of banking matters, should have given them some instances. In his experience he did not know any such cases. He thought they were not bound to accept the statements of anonymous writers. He thought the motion was of no use whatever.

Mr STAFFORD thought in cases of running accounts where persons were drowned such iunds might remain in the possession of

the banks for ever. He knew of a case in which a sum of money had been lying for 23 years in one of the banks, and had it not been for an accident it would never been called for. In another case, in which a sum of money h ad been paid into a bank for the purpose of erecting a monument, a similar circumstance had occurred, and had it not been for his recollections of the circumstances neither of those accounts would ever have been heard of. Mr WOOD saw no necessity for interference in the matter at all, Mr Murray, Mr T. Peacock, and Mr Swanston spoke in favor of the motion, the latter gentleman stating that for the protection of diggers and seamen such a provision was highly necessary. The motion was then withdrawn. MESSAGE FBOM HIS EXCELLENCY. The SPEAKER announced that he had received a message from His Excellency transmitting the Estimates for the ensuing year. MAORI REPRESENTATION. KARAITIANA TAKAMOANA moved, That, in the opinion of this House, it is desirable—l. That the native race should be represented in the other branch of the Legislature. 2. That a Maori should be appointed a member of the Executive Council of the colony, to advise with the Minister for native affairs. 3. That the Maori Representation Act should be amended, and the number of Maori members increased to twelve, giving three Maori representatives to each of the present Maori electoral districts ; and that Europeens as well as Maoris should have the privilege of voting at elections of Maori members of the House of Representatives. The hon member delivered a lengthy address, which concluded as follows :—I say, let us be equal in this House. Do not let us be excluded from anything that may be done in this House. lam not able to enter into the subject at any great length. This is what I have to say on the present occasion.

Mr M'LEAN thought it was gratifying that throughout the difficulties they had experienced through the North Island that they found these people coming forward with such propositions to be heard on equal terms in the House. The natives had frequeutly expressed a desire that they should be placed on more equal terms, and the Government were of opinion that the first part of the proposal should be entertained. The Government were not prepared to say that they should have no Maoris in the executive, although they had of late been very much in the habit of soliciting the advice of some of the intelligent chiefs, who must necessarily know more about native matters than other people. The Government did not consider it desirable that the present number of representatives should be increased, because they would be out of proportion to the other members. The Government did not deem it desirable that the Europeans should be permitted to vote for Maori members, because they had the privilege of returning their own members.

Mr M'LEOD thought the experiment of Maori representation, though at first not satisfactory, was now highly encouraging. He thought it highly important that they should be looked upon in the most friendly spirit. If they could impress upon them the necessity of coming to the House with their grievances it would save much difficulty outside. When they found that they were treated honorably and liberally they would have greater confidence in the deliberations of the House. There was a strong desire among them to learn English, and they wanted to see a blending of the races; they wanted to see the children of the whites going to school with their own. He thought the time would come when there would be such a fusion of the races as that they would see half-castes and quadroons occupying the highest positions in the land. He attributed many of the old evils to the action of the missionaries in maintaining a distinction between the races.

WI PARATA thought all the resolutions should be carried. If they were agreed to the Maoris outside would begin to believe that they were on an equality of rights. The Government said now that they would agree to the consultation with Maori chiefs, but why did not they agree to do so long ago. He considered it a wrong that Europeans should not vote at the election of Maori members, nor had they been consulted at the formation of the Maori Land Court. He asked them not to be afraid of the addition to their number on account of the expense ; if it were a question of European representation there would be no thought about that. If they would not give them large representation let them take their children and educate them. Mr HAUGHTON thought there was a marked contrast between the present Maori representatives of this and the last Parliament. He would support the first part of the resolutions. He thought the old representatives of the Maori race should, by reason of their parliamentary experience, have been called to the Upper House. He thought the Maoris in the colony were quite as well represented as the miners. The remarks about education, he thought, were worthy of consideration, and should receive the attention of the Government.

Mr FOX knew that there was not in the Maori race a. more shrewd or able man than the mover of the resolutions, and he regretted that through bashfulness he had not adduced some stronger reason. He thought from what had passed, the Government would be justified in appointing members to the Upper House ; but the difficulty of selection would be very great j but he had no doubt the Defence Minister would be able to make an advantageous selection. He looked upon the appointment of a member to the Executive from the Maori race as a very important matter, and one that would be productive of great good;

but again there was the difficulty of selection. He thought there was no necessity either for an increase of the number of representatives, or that ihey should be selected by Europeans and Maoris combined. Katene and Taiaroa made able addresses in support. The first part of the motion was then agreed to, and the remainder negatived. Notices of motion havng been given, the House adjourned at twenty-five minutes past twelve. Tuesday, September 19. The Speaker took the chair at half-past two o’clock. DUNEDIN WATERWORKS ACT AMENDMENT BILL. Mr BATHGATE, in a lengthy speech advocating the interests of the corporation of Dunedin and a large section of the community who opposed the passage of the bill, proposed that it be read a second time that day six months, on the ground that no monopoly for the supply of indispensable articles should be conferred upon a private company. Mr HALL, as chairman of the committee to whom the bill was referred, said the hon gentleman had not stated the case fairly as it was placed before the committee, and proceeded to show that the passing of the bill would produce very satisfactory results to the city of Dunedin. He hoped the House would not agree to the amendment. Mr REYNOLDS said that Mr Bathgate had, perhaps not intentionally, entirely misled the House as to the merits of the bill. It was easy to get up petitions such as those referred to by the hon member by promising baths and wash-houses and the watering of the streets gratis ; but he believed that if the facts of the case had been properly laid before the citizens he would never have got a single signature to those petitions. Mr Reynolds proceeded to give a history of the company, which seemed to place an entirely different complexion upon the facts as stated by Mr Bathgate. Mr MAC ANDREW, in a humorous and at the same time very practical speech, pointed out the anomalous position of the Otago members —the Otago happy family. They had the members for the city of Dunedin divided against each other, and they had the Provincial Executive, on whose recommendation he had brought in the bill, also divided against themselves. Mr REID, as a member of the Provincial Executive, wished to explain that the bill was not brought in on his recommendation. Mr BATHGATE deprecated the introduction of any matter of a personal nature ; he saw that there was a probability of such being the case. The bill was then read a second time, and ordered to be committed to-morrow. CASE OF MR SMYTHIES. The House agreed to fix the hour for hearing Mr Smythies for three o’clock to-morrow afternoon. Mr Travers, having applied for leave to speak on behalf of the New Zealand Law Society, would follow Mr Smythies. PETITIONS. Mr Bunny, Mr Haughton, Mr Fox, Mr Swanston, Karaitiana Takamoana, and Mr Curtis, presented petitions, which were ordered to lie on the table. WELLINGTON WATERWORKS BILL. Mr PEARCE brought up the report of the committee on this bill, which recommended that the bill should not include in its operation certain lands at present being occupied as mining claims for a period of two years from the passing of the act. The bill was then read a second time, and the amendments ordered to be considered on Tuesday. GOLDFIELDS COMMITTEE. Mr HAUGHTON brought up reports from the Goldfields Committee, reporting that they could make no recommendation as to the petitions in favor of a reduction of the gold duty; also on the petitions of certain persons with reference to the obtaining of water for the goldfields, which the Committee stated could not be undertaken by the Government, and recommended that the work should be done by private enterprise, upon certain conditions. PUBLIC PETITIONS COMMITTEE. Mr T. KELLY brought up the report of the this committee on the petition of James Southcombe, of Wanganui, which stated that he was accidentally injured while attending a government parade as a volunteer, and praying for relief; the committee reported that they did not consider the colony responsible for accidents on parade. Also, the report of the committee on the petition of the Provincial Council of Hawke’s Bay, praying that the House will take measures by means of legislation for the removal of the trustees of the Te Aute school, and securing that the income shall be devoted to the purposes originally intended; the committee were of opinion that the complaint should be referred to a commission under the Education Trusts Bill for settlement. Also, the report of the Committee upon the petition of James Moore, of Wanganui, praying for compensation for loss of property destroyed by order of the Officer Commanding the troop s; the committee reported that the petitioner had established a claim to a loss of £2OO, but the committee could not settle the amount of the award. Also, the report of the committee on the petition of 165 residents of Woodend, Canterbury, that the line of railway from Southbrook across the river Ashley, which is called in the chief engineer’s report “ Parliamentary Line,” be adopted; the committee reported that as the subject matter of the petition involved a question of general policy as regards the construction of public works they could make no recommendation to the House. Also, the report of the committee on the petition of certain owners and occupiers of

land in the Malvern and adjacent districts, Canterbury, for the construct ion of the western 1 ne'of railway from station to fclie Kowai, Malvern Hills ; the report of the committee was similar to that in the last case. Also, the report of the committee upon the petition of certain settlers of Wanganui, Waitotara, and Patea, for redress for injuries inflicted by certain convicted felons of the native race ; the committee could not make any recommedation, but suggested that an inquiry should be held with the view of settling claims of a similar nature in other parts of the colony. Also, the report of the committee on the petition of merchants and others of Dunedin, praying that in passing the Contractors Debts Bill, due provision be made for the securing of payment for material to the persons supplying the same; the committee reported that they could not recommend the petition to the favorable consideration of the House. Also, the report of the committee on the petition of 154 Roman Catholic residents of Greymouth, disapproving of secular education without religious teaching, and praying that Catholic schools may receive a fair share of pnblic money ; the committee reported that as an educational bill was now before the House they could make no recommendation in the matter. Also, the report of the committee on the petition of 13 L farmers and tradesmen of the Selwyn district, in favor of the imposition of a duty on cereals; the committee reported that as the subject matter of the petition involved a question of general policy they could make no recommendation. DISTRICT COURT, OAMARU. Mr STEWARD asked the Premier whether it was the intention of the Government to provide for the holding of a District Court at Oamaru. Mr GISBORNE said it was the intention of the Government to do so, and provision had already been made in the estimates. LOTTERIES. Mr SWANSON asked the Colonial Secretary whether it was the intention of the Government to introduce a bill during the present session to amend the law relating to lotteries, with the view of permitting artists to dispose of their pictures, &c, by that means ? Mr FOX entirely sympathised with the object of the question but was not prepared to give an answer without consulting the Attor-ney-General. PAPERS. Mr Gisborne, and Mr M'Lean laid on the table a number of papers and returns. HANSARD. A discussion on the conduct of this publication occupied the time of the House during a short portion of the afternoon. Several members objected to the new system initiated by the Reporting Debates Committee of having the speeches revised in the manuscript; other hon members complained that the rule was very accommodating to the “prominent” members by permitting them to have printed proofs by which to correct their speeches; while others, notably Mr Creighton and Mr Reeves, spoke warmly in favor of the abolition of the publication, and the publication of the debates in a condensed form ; other members confessed that, although hitherto strong advocates for the continuance of “ Hansard,’ 1 their faith had been very much shaken in consequence of the delivery of speeches which were not intended to elucidate matters before the House, but to reach the constituents as substitutes for hustings speeches. Some members found the correction of their speeches in the manuscript sufficient to deter them from speaking at all, while others liked the pleasure, and found no more difficulty iu correcting the manuscript than in correcting the printed proof. Ultimately a motion of Sir D. Monro» that Mr Speaker be requested to take upon himself the trouble of revising the Hansard proofs in so far as the observance of the orders and practice of the House is concerned, and at the same time to revise and correct, at his own discretion, any remarks which may have been made by him, speaking from the chair, was put and agreed to. ‘MARRIED WOMEN’S PROPERTY BILL. Mr BRANDON moved that this bill should be referred to a select committee, and Mr Fox offering no objection, the motion was agreed to. COMMITTALS. The Sale of Poisons Bill and the Carriag* ton Land Bill were committed and reported to the House with amendments, which were ordered to be considered next sitting day. GOLDFIELDS ACT AMENDMENT BILL. A bill of this nature met with a considerable amount of opposition, and ultimately the discussion on the second reading was ordered to be resumed on Friday. COMMITTEE OF SUPPLY. Mr STAFFORD, before going into Committee of Supply, said he thought he was expressing the feeling of the House when he proposed that the House should not go into the debate on the financial statement. Last session there were draft bills appended to the statement which gave a clue to the policy of the Government, and he thought it would be impossible for hon.members to come to aeonelusion on the statement unless they saw the bills which were to give effect to it. There were many important matters to come before them, as to what were the lines that would pay; what were the railways which it was proposed that the House should authorise;

and, again, the important measure of taking land for the settlement of immigrants. There were proposals to alter provincial institutions and in other ways, which would largely affect provincial institutions. Then, again, there were some measures under which the capitation allowance was to be altered. These measures were really the kernel of the business to be done. It was impossible for any debate to take place before these measures were submitted to the House. In fact, the whole of the debate would have to be taken on those measures, and if they were to go on debating without them they would find at the end of the week that they had been thrashing straw. He thought Tuesday next would be the best time to go into the discussion of the statement. He advocated this course with the view of facilitating the business of the House. Mr VOGEL pointed out that bringing down of certain bills with the financial statement of last year was the first occasion on which such a course waß adopted, but on the present occasion lion members must be aware that the circumstances were different. The financial statement was delivered at a time when it was desirable that the business should be proceeded with as rapidly as possible, and to delay it would involve a much longer postpone than the Government were prepared for. It appeared to be the desire of many hon members that the business should be hurried on, and he need scarcely tell the hon member for Timaru that the figures given in the financial statement were reliable, (with the explanations he had given of inaccuracies) and he would be prepared to answer any questions as to the intentions of the Government on the various points of the bills to be irtroduced. The financial statement was meant to be as elaborate as the members of the Government could make it until they had the statement of the Minister of Public Works. If the motion tor adjournment were carried it would simply involve a week’s additional sitting of the House at the end of the session ; and probably it would extend to Christmas. Even if the motion for postponement were agreed to, the Government were not prepared to say that they would be able to bring down the bills at the end of that time, or that they would be able to give a further explanation than that already given in the statement itself. Mr ROLLESTON thought the debate would be facilitated rather than hindered by the week’s delay. If the Minister for Public Works was prepared to give the House some intimation of those works to be undertaken, they might go on at once; but it would be useless to debate the policy twice over. Mr WEBSTER thought if they could not Bee their way clear to get through the proposals of the Government, it would be better that they should get through the actual parliamentary business, and have another sitting in about two months’ time. He for one would not be able to remain longer than the end of October. Mr EOX thought his hon colleague had spoilt the House by bringing down his statement last year at an unusually early period, and also by appending to it a series of bills, by which the policy was to be carried out. In the present session they had not had the time to prepare the measures subsequently to deciding upon their policy, and in addition to that it was useless for them to prepare a series of bills which might not be acceptable to the House. At the same time the Government would not insist on forcing the debate upon the financial statement, if it wished Borne little longer time to consider it. He would suggest, however, that they might be occupying their time for the next few days in going through the ordinary estimates. An amendment by Mr Vogel, that the debate should be taken on Thursday instead of Tuesday, was put and carried. HIGHWAY BOARDS BILL. This bill was committed, and, after a number of amendments, was reported to the House, the amendments being ordered to be considered next sitting day. OTAGO WASTE LANDS BILL. Mr REID, in moving the second reading of this bill, said that it was simply a bill to consolidate existing acts, so that a person coming into the province might at once see what the land lawß of the province were. It gave the president of the Waste Land Board power to classify the land into first-class agricultural, town, and rural land. Another important point in the bill was that it provided for the alienation of land under a system of licensing laws similar to that in the adjoining colony of Victoria; the Provincial Council was unanimous on that point. Another provision was that they made provision for the occupation of lands by the immigrants proposed to be introduced under the scheme of the Government. The bill also gave power to set apart land outside of hundreds within which leases might be taken up under the licensing system, which was a system of deferred payments. They had made provision for the taking of land which might prove to be auriferous, and also land for water races and sludge channels. This part of the bill would obviate the necessity for two acts ; it would apply to lands within the goldfields as well as lands beyond the goldfields. If the bill was adopted it would tend to settle the waste lands question of Otago, and there would be no occasion to regret the action taken. Mr G. M'LEAN said the hon member had argued in favor of the bill onthe principle that one tale was very good until the other was told. The hon member had adopted a very safe way of adopting all plain sailing, and avoiding the knotty points. It was he who had set the action of that House at defiance by refusing to put into operation the act passed in 1869. He objected to this annual dish from Otago—this tinkering with the land laws, which was driving capital out of the country. If this bill was meant to

be a settlement of the matter, he would go heart and soul for it, but it was no such thing, and the House should be careful in passing the hill, which was only brought in to serve political ends. He would move that the bill be read a second time that day six months. Mr M'GILLIVRAY thought this agitation should be brought to an end. The agitation hindered the introduction of capital, and raised up a class of agitators who did a great deal more harm than good. It was necessary, in order to carry out the great scheme of public works, that the supreme Legislature should at once do away with the conflict of the land laws of the colony, and substitute one simple land law for tb e whole colony, or at least one simple land law for each island, if their interests were not identical. As regarded the bill he had two objections. They had heard much of their liberal land laws, but in his humble opinion, there was not, except in the province of Auckland, such a thing as a liberal land law. One objection he had to the bill was that he considered 25s an acre too high a price, even for good agricultural land. Another objection he had was that the settler not only had to clear and cultivate a portion of the land within a given time; he was bound to spend a pound an acre upon it. What he wanted was a general land law for the colony, and he would endeavor to shape this bill in that direction. Mr SHEPHERD occupied the House for a considerable time with a speech dedicated to his constituents through the columns of “ Hansard.” The cries of the people, and how they were responded to, a history of the Otago land laws, seventeen years’ experience in Australia, reference to the repeal of the corn laws, and the important results that would have accrued to the inhabitants of Otago if he had voted in the Provincial Council of that province on an occasion when he did not vote, formed the heads of a very uninteresting “ stump” speech. Mr WAKEFIELD proposed the adjournment of the debate. Mr YOGEL supported the adjournment of the debate until Friday. Mr BATHGATE would be sorry to see the debate postponed, as the bill conveyed the unanimous wish of the Provincial Council of Otago. It was of great importance that the measure should be sent to the Waste Lands Committee as soon as possible, where he hoped it would receive the most severe examination on both sides. Mr Mervyn opposed the adjournment. The motion for adjournment was then put and agreed to, the debate to be resumed on Thursday. Notices of motion having been given, the House adjourned at one o’clock. Wednesday, September 20. The Speaker took the chair at half-past two o’clock. DUNEDIN ‘WATERWORKS BILL. This bill was committed, and the chairman having reported progress asked leave to sit again on next day. PUBLIC PETITIONS COMMITTEE. Mr T. KELLY brought up the report of the Petitions Committee on the petition of Benjamin Peyman, of Wanganui, stating that his property was destroyed in Wereroa Redoubt by orderof the Commanding officer, to prevent it falling into the hands of the enemy, and praying for redress ; the committee reported that as the petitioner had not offered any evidence as to the claim they could not make any recommendation, but suggested that inquiry should be made by the Government into all such claims. Also, the report of the committee on the petition of five military settlers of the Waikato district, claiming field allowance during periods of active service, which has been withheld from them, and praying for redress; the committee reported that they could not recommend the petition to the favorable consideration of the House Also, the report of the committee on the petition of Jonathan Ranken Peebles, of Sydney, N.S.W., a claim for loss of personal effects when the s.s. Lord Worsley was wrecked near New Plymouth; the committee reported that as the petitioner had not offered any evidence they could make no recommendation, but suggested that the Government should consider the matter. Also, the report of the committee oa the petition of 642 cabinetmakers and others in the city of Dunedin, praying that the rate of duty on imported furniture be increased, so as to develop local manufactures and industries; the committee reported that as the matter involved a question of general policy, they could make no recommendation. Also, the report of the committee on the petition of 172 settlers and landowners, Palmerston, Waikouaiti, and Blueskin districts, complaining that injustice has been done to the above districts, in not placing the line of railway from Waikouaiti to Dunedin upon any of the schedules; the report of the committee was similar to that in last case. Also, the report of the committee on the petition of Wikatoria, which recommended that the Government should take into their consideration the claim of the petitioner. PETITIONS. WI PARATA presented a petition from certain natives praying that certain lands in Wellington which had been taken from them should be returned. TAKAMOANA presented a petition from certain natives of the Wairarapa district praying for an arrangement of the Waste Lands Court. PAPERS. Mr Gisborne laid upon the table a number of papers and returns. NEW MEMBER. Mr John Williamson, member for Auckland, took the oath and his seat.

THE MOTUEKA ELECTION. Mr BRANDON brought up the report of the select committee appointed to enquire into the facts stated in the petition of Mr Parker. The committee found that Sir David Monro was not duly elected, and that Mr Charles Parker was duly elected, and should sit as member for Motueka. The necessary forms having been gone through, the Clerk of Writs was directed to amend the writs by erasing the name of Sir D. Monro, and inserting in lieu thereof the name of Mr Parker. WASTE LANDS COMMITTEE. The report of the committee on the Canterbury Forests Bill was read.' It recommended that the bill should pass the House, and it was then ordered to be committed on Wednesday next. THE CASE OP MR SMYTHIES. The purely formal business having been disposed of, the Speaker inquired of the Ser-geant-at-Arms if Mr Smythies and Mr Travers were in attendance, and on receiving a reply in the affirmative commanded their attendance at the bar of the House. Mr Smythies and Mr Travers having entered the chamber, the latter in legal costume, the Speaker informed Mr Smythies that the House was prepared to hear his statement. Mr Smythies, in commencing his address, thanked the House for permitting him to appear, and said that he should have felt considerable diffidence in occupying the time of the House were it not for the circumstance that a great principle was involved, viz., whether injustice had. been done by the Legislature. Hens conseia recti left him no alternative but to believe and assert that injustice had been done. That he had defended himself in all the courts of the colony, and had now laid his case before this, the most august, tribunal of the colony for final decision. “ The judges of this tribunal are now assembled,” Eaid Mr Smythies, “ and I will take leave to say that I have so high an opinion of the honor and integrity of the gentlemen who occupy these seats as to feel assured that under no circumstances could they be induced to decide or legislate upon a ease like the present without making themselves acquainted with all the facts of the case, and listening to all the arguments which could be adduced in its favor,” and therefore he knew that he should have a patient hearing. It was no part of his duty to defend that action of the judges which culminated in his admission to the bar. It appeared by Judge Johnston’s judgment delivered in the Court of Appeal, that their conduct required no defence. He says, “ I do not express any opinion on the justice or injustice of the act; with that we have nothing to do in this court; nor could we admit the suggestion that by the retrospective operation of the act the legislature intended to expres 8 disapproval of the admission of the applicant. We could not listen to anything so monstrous as a suggestion that they would do such a thing without knowing what materials the judges had before them, and what their reasons were when they admitted him. We assume simply that the legislature thought the law ought to be changed. It was remarkable, however, that the legislature had thought it right to change the past law as well as the future, and, without disapproving of his admission, it had passed an act on purpose to annul it.” He came to Auckland in 1851, and in 1856 he asked the then Chief Justice (the present Sir W. Martin) whether, if he applied to be admitted to the bar, he would admit him —at the same time he told the Chief Justice of his conviction. The Chief Justice replied, that had Mr S. not informed him of his conviction he should certainly have admitted him, as he did not know it, but that having informed him be advised Mr S. to wait a few years until he became better known. Hi 3 confession, perhaps, was more honest than wise. That it was not wise had been proved —if it were honesty little inducement bad been held out for others to follow his example. In 1863 his case was mentioned before all the judges in conference, and he was directed to present a petition at their next yearly meeting, setting out all the facts. This was done, and in 1864 he was directed to obtain evidence of certain allegations. This was done, and laid before the judges in 1865, when they unanimously certified that he might be admitted, and he was admitted, at Dunedin, in January, 1866, with the full consent of all the members of the Dunedin bar. The Chief Justice, in one of his letters to Judge Ward, said that it was the extenuating circumstances of the case which induced them to admit him, and though he might with great justice demand that the certificate of the judges be supported, yet as that was given upon extenuating circumstances only, he repudiated that advantage, as he was now prepared to prove his entire

freedom from all crime, if not from blame, in the matter, and he was willing to rest his case upon his proving that fact to the satisfaction of the House. In 1846 he entered into partnership with aMr James at Aylesbury. In 1847, a suit in Chancery was commenced by infants of the name of Miles, and a person of the name of Soden became their next friend, and the whole question was whether or no Soden signed a written consent. Mr Smythies read a great quantity of evidence, showing that up to the time of the settling of the suit, all parties admitted that a consent had been signed, but the paper had been lost, and Mr S., for the purpose of taking counsel’s opinion upon its effect re-wrote it, and this paper was produced before the Master, upon the taxing of the bill of costs, not to prove Soden’s liability, but to prove the time of its commencement. That the paper was asked for by the attorney on the other side, and Mr S. lost four guineas by its production. That an action was brought to recover the amount of the bill, but Mr S. not being able to find the original, withdrew the proceedings, and. compromised the case, and the whole matter was amicably settled, to the satisfaction of all parties. Up to this time no imputation had been thrown out, impeaching the document, nor any charge of fraud or forgery made. MrS.’s partnership with Mr James continued during two years and a half, and during that time the business increased from £BOO a year to £2OOO. Mr S. did all the business himself, his partner being engaged iu business in London. In 1849 James lost his business in Loudon, and desired to come down to Aylesbury and have the whole of the business, offering Mr S. the situation of his managing clerk. Mr S. having refused to fall into this arrangement, James, in his absence, seized all the papers in the office, including the papers respecting Soden, arrested S. for £IOOO, which he swore he owed him, although S. afterwards found that James was at the time indebted to S. Bribed Soden and one of the Mileses by a release of the bill of costs, £4OO, to swear that Soden signed no paper; entrapped S. into a harmless conversation, and got him to write a letter acknowledging the truth of what James had Baid, without saying what that was, and which was put in at the trial, after James had stated that he had then charged S. with forgery, and then summoned S. to Bow street to answer the charge of forgery. The case was dismissed, and then James obtained a true bill from the Grai d Jury of Middlesex. Having obtained the bill, and so held S. out to the world as a forger, J. got rid of him as a partner, and secured the business. He then gave notice that he should not proceed with the prosecution. S. gave James notice of trial, and retained Sergeant Wilkins as his counsel. Sergeant Byles was retained for the defence. The Sergeants met at the Central Court, and Sergeant Byles told Sergeant Wilkins that there was no evidence of fraud, and therefore he should not take the case into Court. S. insisted upon a public acquittal and apology from James, to which James would not consent, and the case was adjourned, James paying the costs of the day. In August S. again gave notice of trial, but Sergeant Wilkins had not returned from Circuit; as, however, S. supposed he had only to appear to be acquitted, he gave a brief to a junior counsel, and provided no evidence. When ths case was called Sergeant Byles appeared, with two other eminent criminal counsel, to prosecute the case. All the witnesses, including Soden’s attorney in the action, subpoenaed on behalf of the Crown, were sent out of Court, and, therefore, could not hear the evidence given, and only a clerk of James’s brother-in-law, James himself, Soden and Miles were called. Soden’s Attorney afterwards made an affidavit contradicting all the material facts, and he said that had he heard the evidence he should have contradicted it in Court, for Soden had always acknowledged signing the paper. Mr S. was found guilty of forging the paper and uttering it at the taxation. Mr S. then showed that the act of 12 Geo. 1., upon the authority of which the Colonial act of 1866, making it penal for any solicitor convicted of forgery to practise in New Zealand, was framed, did not prevent a solicitor who had been convicted of forgery from practising, and that Mr S. could now practice in England if he thought fit, and he read two opinions of English counsel, Mr James, Q.C., and Mr Cleave, to that effect, and he stated that the Attorney- General of England had also advised that the act would not be put in force to prevent a solicitor practising in England. He also showed that an application which he had made to the Home Government for a pardon had been refused solely on account of the colonial act. He then complained of some letters and papers of a hostile and ex parte nature having been published in the proceedings of the House, and was reading his answer to Mr Fox’s letter to the Editor of the Independent when the time for the rising of the House—half-past fivearrived.

Notices of motion having been given, the House adjourned at half-past five o’clock until half-past two next day.

Thursday, September 21. The Speaker took the chair at half-past two o’clock. DUNEDIN WATER-WORKS 8188. This bill was recommitted. Mr Bathgate moved several important amendments, to the following effect:—That in every place in the bill where the words “messuage” occurs, the words “ dwelling-houses or other buildings” be substituted j that section seven be struck out ; that for the “ words twenty pounds per centum” in sub-section five of the said Act, the words “ten pounds per centum” be substituted; that section thirteen be struck out. Also, the insertion of the following clause : —“ That the corporation of the city of Dunedin shall have a right to purchase all the works plant and interests of the Dunedin Waterworks Company at a valuation by arbitrators mutually appointed but the corporation must give twelve months’ notice to the Dunedin Waterworks Company or its manager in writing of its intention to purchase.” The hon member explained, in advocating the amendments that he did so in the interests of his constituents, while those who were most strongly opposing him, Messrs Reynolds and G. M'Lean were interested in a private way in the passing of the bill, the former being a director of the company and the latter being a partner of a director. Under those circumstances he did not consider that their advocacy could be said to be disinterested. Mr REYNOLDS altogether repudiated the aspersions of the hon member, who, he repeated, had endeavored to mislead the House. He did not deny that he was a director of the company j he had himself informed the House of the fact on the previous day, but he had succeeded the hon member Mr Bathgate in the direction, which he must say up to that time had been very badly managed.

Further discussion ensued, Mr Bathgate intimating that if the promoters of the bill were willing to confine their legislation to the terms of the Act of 1864, he would at once withdraw all opposition, while on the other hand, in explanation of the new clause, Messrs Reynolds and Gk M'Lean stated that the compnny would be quite willing to treat for the transfer of the plant on fair terms. All the amendments were negatived, and Mr Bathgate gave notice of the introduction of further new clauses, one of which was to the effect that the company should supply gratis water for public fountains and for watering the streets, while there was any surplus beyond what was actually required for the household consumption of the city; and another clause that churches, athenaeums, and school houses, and, used only as such, should be exempted from rates under the bill, so soon as the province w »s relieved of the guarantee of eight per cent on the capital invested. On division the latter clause was rejected, the numbers being :—Ayes, 14; noes, 23. The first of the two new clauses was then put and negatived on the voices. Another new clause “ that the limit of dividend in any one year should not exceed ten per cent,” was then put and agreed to. The chairman then reported the bill to the House with amendments, which were ordered to be considered next sitting day. PETITIONS. Mr HARRISON presented a petition from 1100 miners of the GreyYalley District, West Coast, pointing out that they had not received proper attention from the Provincial Government of Nelson, and praying that the House would assume the control of that part of the colony. Mr WHITE presented a petition from 500 inhabitants of the Kaneri and Blue Spur district, Westland, praying for the construction of roads in that district. Mr GILLIES presented a petition from 96 merchants of Auckland, complaining of the excess in light dues on the coast, and asking that uniform light charges should be levied in all parts of the colony, but that coasting vessels should not be called on to pay the same dues as those paid by foreign vessels. Mr INGLES presented a petition. Mr WILLIAMSON presented a petition from a native chief of Auckland and certain other natives, with reference to certain lands in that province. Mr J. KELLY presented a petition with reference to land at Patea. The petitions were ordered to be laid on the table. papers. Mr Yogel and Mr M'Lean laid on the table certain papers and returns. NEW MEMBERS. The Clerk of the Writs, Mr G. S. Cooper, having been summoned, was directed to erase the name of Sir David Monro from the writ of election for Motueka, and to substitute the name of Mr Charles Parker. That gentleman having presented himself, attended by Mr Bunny, was then sworn and took the oath and his seat. EXPLANATION. Mr FOX trusted the House would allow him td make a few words of explanation. Some friends of his own, for whose opinions he entertained the highest respect, had intimated to him that an expression he had used in his affidavit in the action of Monro v Luckie and Collins, conveyed an imputation against the honor and the purity of the conduct of Sir David Munro when occupying the position of Speaker of the House. The particular expression to which he alluded was the word “ shepherd.” He did not think the expression necessarily conveyed the idea that had been attached to it, but he desired to say that if the word conveyed any such impression it was his desire to withdraw any imputation on the honor of Sir David Monro. It was not his intention to discuss any other of the matters contained in his affidavit, unless he were forced into it by Mr Gillies. Mr HALL wished to make a motion without notice in reference to the report of the committee on the petition of Mr Charles

Parker. Whatever opinions might be entertained in one or two directions, there would be a universal feeling of regret at the loss of Sir David Monro’s presence in the House. (Hear, hear.) The petition which the committee had to investigate charged that gentleman with bribery, and also stated that during the election he had committed offences jflf a dishonorable charactei’. The report .of the committee only decided one part of the allegations set down in the petition, and did not state whether Sir David Monro was guilty of bribery or not. The committee had gone into that matter, and, in like committees of the House of Commons, if they found that the member charged with bribery was not guilty, is was customary to say so ; but in this case it was not stated whether the charge was a just or unjust one. He was not propared to say what was the particular mode in which the matter should be dealt with, but in accordance with the practice of the Imperial Parliament he would now move that the report of the committee be taken into consideration to-morrow. In similar cases the course adopted was to order that the report be considered on a future day, with the view of enabling the matter to be brought forward after due consideration. He would now ask the permission of the House to make a motion to that effect without notice. He would move that the report of the committee on the petition of Charles Parker with reference to the Motueka election be considered to-morrow. When that time arrived he would be prepared to propose to the House how he would deal with the subject. The motion was then put and agreed to. REGINA Y. BARTON.

Mr BRADSHAW asked the Government if they had paid the expenses of the witnesses that were summoned to give evidence in the case Regina v. Barton, which was heard at the Magistrate’s Court at Dunedin ; and if not paid, when will the Government pay them ? Mr GISBORNE said it was not usual to pay the expenses of witnesses for their appearance in the R.M. Courts, but as in this case the case were not pressed to the Supreme Court, the witnesses would be paid, and instructions would be given accordingly. DUTY ON AGRICULTURAL MACHINERY. Mr STEWARD asked the Colonial Treasurer whether his attention had been drawn to the fact, that an import duty is charged upon portions of agricultural machinery ; and whether it is proposed so to amend the tariff as to remove certain disabilities under which, in consequence of such duty, colonial manufactures now labor ? Mr YOGEL said the attention of the Government was strongly directed to the matter last year by Messrs Reid and Gray of Oamaru, and the Government were then favorably inclined to a remission of the duty upon such articles, but a bill to that effect was thrown out. They would introduce a bill this session to the extent which had been already described in the financial statement, which imposed a duty upon rice, cerals, and timber, but as there were many other cases in which strong reasons for a remission could be shown they would possibly be included, although lie would not like to give the hon member any greater assurance than this: that they would be inclined to include this particular article in this bill, as it was an exceptional article. COMMUNICATION WITH THE WAIRARAPA. Mr WAKEFIELD asked the Minister of Public Works, whether any survey has been made of the line of Coast between the mouth of the Hutt and the south-west extremity of the Wairarapa Plain, and thence to the neighborhood of Greytown, further than it was without survey condemned in the two last paragraphs of Mr Rochfort’s letter to the Honorable Mr Gisborne, of the 17th January, 1871. And if not. Whether the Government intends to order such a survey to be made, with a view to the establishment of a more speedy communication between Wellington and every part of the Wairarapa Plain most available for immediate settlement, and thence onwards to the interior, by means of a deepwater wharf near Lowry Buy and a coast railway to the neighborhood of the Wairarapa Lakes, and thence by the best route northwards, if the construction should be estimated at less cost, in proportion to area of land of good quality opened up, than the only line now surveyed over or through the Rimutaka Range ? Mr GISBORNE said no survey such as that mentioned by the hon member had been made, and it was not the intention of the Government to have such a survey made, unless it was the wish of the House. Mr Rochfort, who was a very competent surveyor, had walked along the route, and his opinion was that beside the increased length of the route there were also additional engineering difficulties. The railway could not be made along that line at any reasonable cost, because of the many land slips, which would render such a line impossible. These questions might now be fairly considered to be set at rest, as after great examination the line over the Rimutaka was considered the best that could be found. In answer to the latter part of the question, Mr Gisborne said it was impossible, as the money voted for railway works could not be spent in harbor works. NEW ZEALAND CROSS. Mr BRYCE asked the Defence Minister when the decorative distinction known as the New Zealand Cross will be issued to the persons who have been declared entitled to them ? Mr M'LEAN said the design was sent home to the Agent-General, and the medals, about 700 in number, ought to be in the colony in about four months. DECK LOADS ON STEAMERS. Mr E. RICHARDSON asked the Colonial Secretary whether the attention of the Government had been called to the practice which at present obtains of large deck loads on steamers on the coast of New Zealand, to the serious danger of the lives of passengers ;

and if so, whether they intended taking any steps for the prevention of the same ? The mover said that during last year several accidents of a serious uature had occurred, and he would mention particularly one case, in which it was miraculous that the steamer did not go down bodily, in consequence of the amount of cargo she had on board, her hold being full _ of dead weight, and lier decks crowded with cargo. Mr YOGEL said that the attention of the Government had been called to the Maori, steamer, by the Inspector at Lyttelton, and instructions had been sent to Port Chalmers to prevent vessels leaving that port with deck loads. The Government were of opinion that the matter was a very important one, and steps would be taken to enforce the regulations, which were supposed to be sufficiently rigid to prevent the occurrence of similar irregularities. With reference to the regulations themselves, inquiry would be made which, if they were not sufficient to meet cases likely to arise, the Government would take steps to have them remodelled. MESSAGE. A message from the Legislative Council was read, requesting the attendance of Messrs Bunny and Macandrew to bo examined in the matter of certain lands, and intimating to the House that they liaa passed a bill entitled the Contractors Debts Act, 1871, in which they requested the concurrence of the House. GOVERNMENT BUSINESS. Mr FOX said the House would recollect that two nights ago, when the order of the day for going into Committee of Supply was called, and they proposed to go on with the estimates, it was moved and carried that the financial discussion should be postponed until Tuesday next, and that the estimates should be brought on that day. The Government hoped the House would go into the estimates when the order of the day was called upon. What the Government then proposed was this: to continue the consideration of the estimates until such time as the Minister for Public Works was able to bring down liis statement —which would decide the action of the House during the remainder of the session. That statement would be made on Tuesday, or Wednesday at the latest. The Government would then take the discussion on the increase of the stamp duties, and the duty on cereals, immediately after which they would be able to bring down the bills on which the Government intended to shape their policy. Another point he had to mention was, that after the next week the Government trusted lion members would be prepared to forego one of the two days which they now have for business of a private nature, and further that, they would on the following week be willing to forego the privilege altogether. DEEENCES OE THE COLONY. Mr M‘LEAN moved that a select committee be appointed to consider and report upon the general defences of the colony, with power to confer with a committee of the Legislative Council ; such committee to have power to call for persons and papers. The committee to consist of eleven members ; three to be the quorum : —Messrs Bathgate, Bunny, Bryce, Curtis, Hall, Carrington, Pearce, Steward, Inglis, Captain M'Pherson, and the Mover. He thought it important that the evidence procured by Mr Yogel during his visit to England, and which was in possession of the Government, should be referred to a select committee. The motion was agreed to. NATIVE SCHOOLS. Mr M'LEAN moved for leave to introduce a bill to amend “ The Native Schools Act, 1867.” Leave being given, the bill was read a first time, and the second reading ordered for Tuesday next. NATIVE RESERVES BILL. PARATA moved that it is desirable that the Native Reserves Acts of 1856 and 1862 should be amended. He did not think that the native reserves should be dealt with by the commissioners. He would repeat an objection the Maori members had before urged —that a great amount of trouble was caused to the loyal natives by the Native Reserves Acts not being translated. The reserves should be left in the hands of the natives to be disposed of as they thought fit. Mr D. M LR AN said the Government had an act in preparation for the repeal of the acts, and providing machinery for the better administration of the different kinds of native reserves, and they would confer with the native members on the matter. TAURANGA DISTRICT. Mr W. KELLY moved that, in the opinion of this House, it is desirable that a commission should be appointed to inquire into and report upon the administration and allotting of lands in the Tauranga district, in the proince of Auckland, with a view to rectify irregularities, and thereby promote settlement therein, and the utilization of the waste lands of that district. Mr M‘LEAN said instructions had been given to the officers in the district to make inquiries such as those indicated, and every effort would be used by the Government. A court had been sitting since the hon member left his district ; many outstanding contracts had been settled, and in a very short time the whole of the disputed cases would be disposed of, not only in that district but in the district of Opotiki. Mr GILLIES pointed out that the desire of the mover seemed to be to have a commission appointed independent of the officers of the Government, who, as far as the Native Commissioner in the district was concerned, had prevented the settlement of the district. Mr KELLY said that was liis intention. The motion was agreed to. CLUTHA DISTRICT. Mr MURRAY moved that it is important

that the navigation of the Clutha river be improved, and any available information connected therewith laid before this House, and that the Crown Grant for tho Clutha River Est ate should be issued without further delay. Mr GISBORNE recognised the importance of the improvement of the navigation of the rivers of New Zealand, but he would remind the hon member that the legislature, in raising the loan of last session, practically appropriated that loan to certain great purposes, but specified no harbor works or river navigation ; therefore the appropriation asked for by the hon member would have to be authorised by special legislation. He hoped the object would be gained by the persons in the vicinity being able to rate'them selves. He hoped the second part of the motion would be withdrawn, because the Attorney General had advised that the Crown Grant could not be issued ; therefore if they gave a grant they would be issuing an illegal document. He would bo glad to confer with the hon member and the Attorney-General, so as to ascertain if it were possible to issue a grant. BAY OE ISLANDS SETTLEMENTS. This bill was read a second time, and ordered to be committed to-morrow. “ HANSARD.” The motion of Mr AYakeeiebd, with reference to the correction of Hansard proofs, was put to the House and negatived. AGRICULTURAL LIEN BILL, This bill was committed, one of the clauses, specifying the time within which bills must be registered, being postponed. A good deal of discussion arose upon this clause, Mr Peacock, who has charge of the bill, moving that the time should be limited to seven days. Many members objected to this time as being too short, Mr Bunny considering that the time should be extended to twenty-one days. The bill was then reported to the House, and leave granted to sit again next day. ■WELLINGTON SPECIAL SETTLEMENTS BILL. The report of the committee on this bill was adopted, and it was read a third time, and passed. WELLINGTON RECLAIMED LAND BILL. The report of the committee on this bill was agreed to, and it was read a third time and passed. CASE OE ELLEN M'GUIRE. The House resolved itself into committee to consider an address to his Excellency the Governor, requesting him to cause to be placed on the estimates such a sum as will give effect to the recommendation of the Public Petitions Committee in the case of Ellen M‘Guire, The Government offered no opposition and the motion was reported to the House, and ordered to be considered to-morrow. THE NORTH OF AUCKLAND. Mr Farnall’s motion with reference to the voting of a sum of money for the construction of roads was put to the House, and the first part, affirming “ that it is desirable that the money available for expenditure under the Public Works and Immigration Loan Act, 1860,” should be so distributed that the settlers and aboriginal natives of the north of Auckland may participate in such expenditure,” agreed to. The discussion of the remainder of the motion was then postponed till that day week, to permit the hearing of the statement of the Minister of Public Works. POSTPONEMENTS. The consideration of the City of Dunedin Borrowing Bill, the Taranaki Educational Reserves Bill, and the Intestate Estates Bill, was postponed. THE JURY BILL. This bill was committed. An amendment that three-fourths should constitute the verdict of the jury instead of two-tliirds was negatived. Another amendment, proposed by Mr Gillies, at the request of the legal profession, was agreed to, “ That no such verdict shall bo taken until the jury have retired, and informed the .Judge that there is no probability of their being unanimous.” The amendment was ordered to be considered to-morrow. SINKING EUNDS ACT AMENDMENT BILL. This bill was read a second time, and ordered to be committed on Wednesday next. PETITION OF WILLIAM RUSSELL. The House then went into committee for the consideration of an address to be presented to His Excellency, requesting him to place on the estimates a sum of money sufficient to give effect to the recommendation of the Public Petitions Committee on the petition of William Russell, of Wanganui. The Governor concurred in the prayer of the petition, which was reported to the House, and ordered to be considered to-morrow. THIRD READINGS. The Sale of Poisons Bill, and the Carrington Loan Grant Bill, were read a third time and passed. CROWN REDRESS BILL. Mr GISBORNE moved the second reading of this bill, shortly stating its provisions. Mr KELLY thought clause 9 should be struck out. It would be a great hardship that a man who purchased, say, 500 acres, and found whea he came to take possession, that he had only 200, should have no remedy. The clause, instead of making provision for rectification in such cases, specially provided that there should be no remedy whatever against the Crown. Mr GISBORNE said the objection might be considered in committee. The bill was then read a second time. COMMITTALS. The Diseased Cattle Act Amendment Bill, and the Highway Boards Empowering Bill were further considered in committee. The consideration of the report on the former bill was deferred, and the latter reported with amendment, leave being granted to sit again on Thursday next. Notices of motion having been given, the House adjourned at five minutes past eleven.