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Lyttelton Times, Volume VI, Issue 372, 28 May 1856, Page 8

Friday, May 23. The Speaker went to prayers at 11 a.m. Mr. Thomson presented" a petition from Papanui iv favour of the Government clauses. Received. The Speaker left the chair. The House went into Committee on the clause to be substituted for 68.

The Provincial Secretary moved that the proposed clause be substituted for 6S. He thought that after the debate of last night this clause would be accepted by the house as a corollary.

Mr. Dampier felt it his duty to put one or two points forward. He thought that thisquestiou would still have to be fought; if the government sold land to parlies, who would not have bought it if they had known—

The Pi-ov. Secretary thought that this was raising a discussion that had been disposed of. Did the hon. member object to the clause ?

Mr. Dampier thought that in selling land •under these clauses, that it would be a legal fraud to^sell the land as free from encumbrance; •when a person had paid his deposit, and went to see his land, and found it claimed by a holder of a pre-emptive right, he would come back and demand his deposit; and he [Mr. Dampier] bad yet to learn that there was any part of the Land Regulations, authorizing them to return money. The purchaser would be in the position either of losing his deposit, or going to law with the pre-emptive right holder; a position which lie considered they had no right "to put a purchaser in. He should certaiuly press this matter to a division, and moved that his name be recorded iv the journal of the house, protecting against such an act of legislation. He would move that the first paragraph of clause 68 be retained, as he considered they had no right to place purchasers in such a vitally false position. Mr. Beat seconded the motion.

Mr. Thomson said they had sat 7 hours last night, and the staple of the debate was immorality, litigation, acts of parliament, contracts over and over again. He hoped they were uot going over the same course to-day. Mr. Olliviee said that this was opening the whole case over again ; that it was an attempt to iucrease the business of the house ; that it was an effort to open the case on a mere quibble. Mr. Dampieb must protest against the coarse line of argument adopted by the hon. member. Mr. Moobhouse should uot support the amendment. He considered that the house last night asserted its belief in its power to legislate on this subject, and to extinguish these rights. He perfectly agreed with the correctness of the argument of Mr. Dumpier, but he saw not the slightest hope of success. The Prov. Segeetaet said he had purposely abstained from argument, as he understood the question to have beeu settled last night.

The house divided, when for the amendment appeared only the proposer and the seconder. The original clause was then put and carried.

Mr. Bakker withdrew his proposed amendments on clauses 1, 2, 68, and proceeded ■with clause 43, which in his opinion, was defective, inasmuch as it provided for only roads and drains; now there were other works to he performed in the Province which could also be paid for in land, and he thought that the payments should be to the value of the work done, instead of only half as at present.

Mr. Dampier said that he should second the motion, but should not vote for it. (Laughter.) They were met together not for the purpose of legislating on this subject, hut to frame regulations for the sale of land. If we disposed in this ■way of our land, how was the New Zealand Company's debt to be satisfied ? He was also afraid that if the regulations were sent up to the Governor with a clause like this, that it would be used as a peg oa which to hang a refusal of them altogether:

Mr. Beay thought that the arrangement was muck called for at this moment. Government bad uo means of carrying ou the public works,

and this opened a way to help them out of their difficulties. For instance,- the Iliccarton road, that very important road leading to so many cuttle stations, would soon become utterly impassable. Mr. Bowen should vote against the motion with reluctance, but he thought that great injury would be done to the Province if any delay occurred in the settlement of the laud regulations, and he was afraid that this might cause a delay.

Mr. Moohhouse would support the motion as it would, he thought, lead to greater economy in the public works. For instance, at Akaroa, there were works to be done which would cost the Government £150, and if the people were allowed to do it themselves the work would be done for £100.

Mr. Rhodes agreed with the last speaker

Mr. Ollivier thought that this would be like a storekeeper living on his own goods, and thinking all along th.it he was living cheaply. He did not think it expedient to alter the clause until it was seen how it worked. Again, from what fund was the crown to be paid the first price of the land ? Mr. Hamilton strongly objected to the proposed clauses; the government considered that alterations more than absolutely necessary will endanger the regulations altogether. The reason why the amount of land given now is only to one half of the work done, is on the principle hitherto acted on ; that if any work, not of absolute public necessity, is requisite to be done, that the persons for whose benefit it chiefly is, subscribe one-half the amount among themselves, and then government finds the othei half. As to the Iticcarton road, the people using that road had had it made for them and it was only to repair it; they could not be so badly off as the Kaiapoi people, who had never hid a road at all.

Mr. Barker, in reply, said that the land would be subject to no charge, as it would he a free °rant from government. The principle had been admitted, let it be carried out to its legitimate conclusion. Mr. Bowen begged the lion, member to withdraw his proposal ; he should like to see it come on some other time, now he saw no chance of its being carried.

Mr. S. Beai/ey would oppose the motion. Mr. Moorhouse thought that the hon. gentleman had better withdraw his motion. Mr. Bakker would not press this motion, and he would withdraw the remaining motion in his name.

The Chairman reported progress,

The Speaker resumed. The Provincial Secretahy then moved that the amendments now adopted be sent to his Honor the Superintendent, and that he be requested to transmit them to his Excellency the Governor for his approval.

Mr. OiiLiviEß moved for an explanation respecting an advance of £500 for the purpose of purchasing plant for the c mtractors for the Suraner Road. There were certain reports afloat which rendered explanation desirable.

Mr. Hamilton said that there could be no hesitation about an explanation. The hon. gentleman then entered into details of the affair, and explained that owing to the funds in hands of the government falling short, they had been compelled to suspend the works. He concluded by saying that no blame whatever attached to the Contractors, who had uniformly given satisfaction, and were fully approved of. Mr. Dampier enquired if there was any contract entered into which the government were unable to begin or to carry out.

The Provincial Secbktary replied that there was not, all had been paid for as far as it had gone; ne fresh contract had been entered into.

Mr. Davis said that he hoped the contractors for the road did not think that they were taking possession of the public works of the province ; if this idea got about that they exclusively were to be employed on the government works, it would operate to the injury of other men, who thinking they stood no chance withdrew from competition.

Mr. Qljjlvuir was perfectly satisfied with the explanation, and would withdraw his motion. Certain rumours had been afloat to the prejudice of Government, and he thought that the Council ought to meet and repeat them in a becoming mannerMr. according to notice 3 moved

that an address be presented from the Council praying for the appointment of a resident judge. The evils they were suffering from owing to the absence of a judge were so notorious that the motion would commend itself to every • me. Just now people have been summoned to attend on the session of the court for the loth of May, and have come a distance of 80 miles and upwards, and now the session ij not to be held till June 25th. These people were at a great loss of both time and money. There had now been confined in the jail at Lyttelton for nine months, a man who was yet awaiting his trial ; if he were innocent, a grievous wrong had been committed ; if guilty ,he may have even suffered a greater term of imprisonment th;tt would have been awarded to him. Then there was a case from Otago ; there would be a difficulty here, as the witnesses had declined to come up, and he believed that as they were bound to appear at the May sessions, that they were now absolved from their recognizances. Then again our public prosecutor is the Prov. Solicitor, and he has absolutely to do the work for oilier provinces. The man who is now in the jail, was taken in the Nelson district, and it cost £16 to bring him to jail. In short, the difficulties and expenses of a prosecutor were so great, that it would not be undertaken except on very great occasions. £50 was all that was set apart for the expenses of the Supreme Sessions. Last time it cost £52l Then again, the civil business was in an equally bad condition, as it all had to be transacted at Wellington, and it really precluded a case being tried on its merits. The Colony bethought was far enough advanced to be entitled to a judge. He should suggest a judge resident at Canterbury, so that he could take Otago and Nelson, an overland journey to either of which places could be now accomplished in 7 to 10 days, and would be more ceriaiu than water communication. He had been informed that owing to the difficulty of getting legal redress, much capital was unemployed in die colony. The Union Bank would be far more practically useful, if the. managers saw a way of making parties fulfil their cm tracts without litigation at Wellington.

Mr. Dampiek seconded the motion, and fully confirmed the statements of the lion, gentleman. There had been cases to his knowledge sent to Wellington, from this place, three years ago. and were still unsettled. The motion was adopted.

Mr. Rhodes reminded the house that they had a vote on the list of £300, for a ferry over the Rakaia. He had lately come from that quarter, and begged to submit to the house a proposal which he thought would meet their requirements. A person, named Dunford, would undertake to build a house of accommodation and provide boats, punte,&c, on condition of a bush licence being granted to him, nith a guaranteed payment of £50 for three years. The Puov. Skoretaky thought that the proposal seemed feasible, but was desirous of obtaining some expression of opinion from the house, authorizing them to appropriate part of the sum voted for this purpose.

Mr. S. BiiALEY objected to the license. He thought it an encouragement to drunkenness. There was a house within 15 miles of the place.

Mr Davis said it was an advantage to have a i)umber of these houses, as then the men were more divided between several houses, and a collection of disorderly characters avoided. He disapproved as much us any man of intoxication, but you could not prevent the men from spending their mon^y, and it was better to have it done in properly licensed houses than in sly gvoat shops. Mr. Hamilton reminded hon. members that the magistrates vere very severe with the, bush licenses ; the holders knew that for a (hst offence they were liable to be deprived of their, license. Mr. Blaki&ton asked if the whole sum of £600 voted by the Council for the Kaiapoi road was spent. The Prov. Secretary said it was not, but as funds were short, they were spent as they came in. Mr. Moorhotjse wished to know if there was any chance of the works at Akuroa, for which a sum was placed on the estimates, being done. The Prov. Secretary was afraid there was no chance, they were already in advance of the year's income. Mr. Habiilton said that he had received, intelligence from Auckland, aud from a cur-

gory examination of the accounts, he foresaw that we should be able during the current year, to obtain no more than l-3rd of-the rerenue derived from the cmtoms. It therefore behoved, them to be very careful, and uot to anticipate public revenue. . . ... !'^ Mi. Fooics spoke to a point of order. He had always understood that the House meant to treat the Land Regulations as a bill, and to debate the general policy on the second vead.ing, and the details in committee. That order had been departed from yesterday, but being then in the chair, he had been unable to make any remark ; he wished now to have it recorded that he had made this stand. The Provincial Sec&ktarythen handed to the speaker a message from his Honor the Superintendent, when The Speaker read the following message from his Honor :— The Superintendent, though rapidly recovering from a long and severe illness, regrets that he is still unable to attend the ■Provincial Council for the purpose of proroguing it in person. The Superintendent has assented, in the name and on the behalf of the Governor, to the following ordinances :— 1. The English Agent's Ordinance. Sess. VI. No. 1. 2. The Roads Ordinance. Sess. VI. No. 2. ?T7 3. The Public-house' Ordinance. Sess. VI. No. 3. 4. The Appropriation Ordinance. Sess. VI. No. 4. And will also recommend to His Excellency to issue the additional regulations for the sale of land, which have been passed by the Council. The Superintendent cannot but express bis great regret ttiat the Council should have been compelled to separate without settling other questions of great importance; especially, without finding some immediate remedy for the great injury done to the roads by trailing timber upon them. The absence ef some such remedy will cost the Province a considerable sum of money in repairs, which might have been rendered needless. The Superintendent also regrets that his illness should have again prevented his again urging on the Council the need of providing for the Education of t'le people. He had bopel that Canterbury would have taken the lead in a question of this nature, but he regrets to find that it will now be one of the last of the Provinces to provide for the civilization of its inhabitants. The Superintendent will take care that the sums voted by the Council sball be expended with care and economy, so far as the funds in his hands will admit; but lie desires that in order to avoid disappointment, it should be borne in mind that the Council has 'voted a much larger expenditure than the estimated revenue of the year will cover. Should the revenue, therefore, not exceed the estimate, much of the work contemplated by the Council must remain undone. James Edward F;tz Gerald, Superintendent. A second message was then read from his Honor the Superintendent, proroguing the Council till March 3rd, 1857.