"AND THERE WAS'NT LIGHT."

King Country Chronicle, Volume V, Issue 385, 9 August 1911, Page 5

"AND THERE WAS'NT LIGHT."

BOROUGH COUNCIL DISCUSSION

ELECTRIC VERSUS AIR GAS

EXPERT TO INVESTIGATE. There was a full attendance of Te Kuiti Borough Council on Monday night, and a considerable number of members of the public were also present, when the Mayor opened the pro ceedings, which were devoted to consideration of the lighting committee's recommendations with respect to Dreadnought gas. The Town Clerk read the reports furnished by the special sub-committee which visited Eketahuna and Waipukurau, and tne letter from the Dreadnought Gas Company re power, which appeared in last Wednesday's issue.

<Jr Sims said Mr Chambers had told him that non-explosive gas was no use for power.

The Mayor said the letter was of a later date. The firm's statements had always been perfectly reliable. Cr Finlay asked about coal gas. and that the report should be read. There were the bye products to consider.

The Mayor said bye products had not proved bright at Waipawa. The Clerk read the Waipawa report, and then a letter from the Te Kuiti Gas Light, Heat and Power Syndicate, offering to instal a plant for the supply of petrol gas and to manufacture the gas and supply it direct to the Council's mains at a cost of 4s 6d 1000 feet, meter price. They claimed it surpassed all other forms of lighting, wheher electric,coal gas,or petrol gas for utility and cheapness. A petition, signed by 56 residents and ratepayers was also submitted, and prayed the Council, before installing a Tight, to allow ratepayers and householders the privilege of recording their votes on the question, and also asked that the Dreadnought and Te Kuiti Gas Syndicates be invited to instal a demonstration plant so that each could be voted for on its merits.

C Forsyth said Mr Clapham had attended a meeting of the Council and offered to give a demonstation, bui. nothing had been done. Cr Somerville said Mr Clapham had also promised to give the actual cost of an installation, but it had not been received.

Mr Clapham, who was present, said he had put in an installation in Mr Hardy's office, and he had personally invited the Council to see it when he was at the meeting. That was the invitation. Cr Forsyth: Is your gas explosive?

Mr Clapham: Ye 3; al! gas is explosive, or it wouldn't burn. He invited the Council to see his gas, and he would give all information. Cr Finlay asked the price of an installation, saying the borough proposed to be their own proprietors, and were not going to allow any monopoly. Mr Clapham said it was a matter they would have to go into and submit an offer in detail.

Cr Forsyth: Is your light in use else w here.

Mr Clapham: No. The old company was not successful because the principal backer died on arrival in New Zealand, and that upset things. Cr Young said that if they were to be confronted with propositions like that one they might as well throw up the sponge. He saw no advantage in prolonging the discussion and entertaining new projects without finality. Cr Finlay strenuously opposed giving the right to the syndicate to operate in the town, but was willing that they should be given a chance of putting up their gas in competition with others. Cr Sims said the petition asked that ratepayers should have the privilege of giving their vote on the subject. He strenuously opposed it. If the Council could not come to a decision, they

were of no use. The Mayor: Hear, hear. The Clerk then read the minutes of the lighting committee's meeting, and the recommendation to the Council to adopt Dreadnought gas. Cr Forsyth quoted letters from the Town Clerk and Borough Engineer of Te Aroha, saying nothing was charged for street lighting, which was worth £230, and they yet had a credit balance of -£331 after meeting all charges. He referred to a letter which appeared in the ''Chronicle" and said a 35 Kilowatt installation would give 35,000 candle power, and not 12,000 as stated. If the town went in for arc laps for street lighting it would be much cheaper. Lux lamps cost £22 10s, arc lamps of 1500 candle power cost £lO. Cr Hardy did not question the cost of lamps. Auckland and Rotorua were lighted by arc lights. Te Kuiti would not be. Te Aroha adopted electric light because they were satisfied of the cheapness of water power, but it was a quite limited power they had. The Mayor asked that Councillors would avoid technicalities. What they wanted to know was how they could get a cheap light. Cr Young said his own report advocating electric lighting gave the approximate cost of an installation at Te Kuiti. A suction gas plant was proposed and with all fittings and plant he could guarantee it would not cost more than £4400. Mr Drummond, an electrical expert present by invitation, said he would guarantee the installation could be put in at the price mentioned. Sixtyhorse power was allowed for in the estimate, and the plant would supply 3000 people. Extensions of the power plant could be added at one-third of the original cost. Taking power for power, the cost of putting in electric motors was about half that of gas engines. The Mayor: You say the installation could be erected for £4400, and would recommend your firm to i ccept i at that price, but that much would depend on the length of the mains. Mr Drummond: Yes; it would coat more if the lines were lancer

The Mayor: Can you give us any other town where electric light has been installed at the cost you mention 0 The Eketahuna plant cost £7200. Can you explain how it is that it cost such a sum? Cr Young said he had already explained that the estimates were exceeded through a faulty installation. The Mayor : To the extent of £ 1000. That reduces it to £6200. We want to know the reason why installations in other towns have exceeded the estimates by 50 per cent. Cr Young: Patea cost £2500. The Mayor: The cost was £SOOO, and ..hey charge 9d gross and 7id net; per unit to make it go. Then take Te Aroha, Can Mr Drummond give the saving in the cost between suction gas and water power? Mr Drummond: The original cost would be less and the cost of working less too.

The Mayor said his experience was that the original estimates were always exceeded. Mr Drummond suggested that, if a s-heme were adopted, a first class enigneer be appointed to report on it. Cr Forsyth quoted the borough engineer as saying that the water supply was sufficient for 5000. people, and at present only 1500 were requiring it. There was a fall of 300 feet, and initial pressure of 130 lbs. There would be enough pressure in the mains to generate electricity, and if the population grew later on they could have a separate plant.. The Mayor: Quite so. It might be worth consideration.

Cr Forsyth said he had prepared a scheme with the assistance of Mr Drummond, and it worked out fairly satisfactorily. They allowed 10 shops with 15 lights each, 5 boarding house? and hotels with SO lights, 6 billiard rooms using 8 "lights, and 150 private residences with 5 lights each, 4 arc lamps for Rora street, of 1500 candle power, and 50 metallic filament 100 c.p. lamps for the other streets. ihe initial cost of the installation was taken at £4400, while receipts from 22,000 units at 8d consumed by private consumers, 8212 units for street light at 8d and 100 units for power purposes at 4d per unit gave an income of £llBO. Expenditure showed interest and sinking fund £264, depreciation £220, wages, man and assistant, £3OO, incidentals £46 and fuel £BO, a total of £9lO, leaving an estimated surplus of £276. If electric light were adopted street lights _ couid be switched off or on automatically. It was not usual to use power in the night time, but it would be available. The Mayor asked Mr Drummond the comparative cost of coal gas and electric light. Mr Drummond said skl per unit compared favourably with coal gas at 4s 3d. He thought Sd per unit would compare with gas at about 7s. The Mayor quoted Mr Black, of Wellington, who said Sd per unit was a high price for electric light, and was equal to coal gas at 6s. Mr Drummond agreed that this was a correct comparison. Cr Hardy admitted he had not allowed .for metallic filament lamps when writing his letter, but it was always bsst to allow on the basis of ordinary lamps. Arc lights and power would still remain as before. A 40 kilowatt machine generated 53 horse power, and they had not allowed for losses in transmission. A recent paper he received put the losses in transmission at 90 per cent, when generated by steam. Mr Drummond said all allowances had been made. Losses in transmission would amount to about 11 per cent.

The Mayor said he had been as I tonished to hear a statement in the i street that the question of lighting j had not been properly considered, and j had never been before the Council, , and briefly summarised all the steps 1 leading- to the adoption of Dread- j nought gas by last year's lighting : committee, the Council and the rate- : payers in public meeting assembled. ; At the poll there were only three ob- 1 jectors. Anyone should now know that ; the old Council did deal fully with ; the question. They had not felt jus- ; tified in recommending electric light or coal gas, as a substantial loan | would have been required of fully j £6OOO to £BOOO. The borough in- j debtedness amounted to £34,360, and after the current year the total rates would amount to £2365. The rate ; struck last year waH little over a fifth j of what they would have to pay next j year. In other words, a man paying ' £1 this year would pay £3 next year, j apart from the water rate. For the j next two years they would have just j as much as they were able to bear, and ; the Council holding that lighting was j luxury, did not feel justified in going | to the ratepayers for a larger sum. | If a cheap light could be got they j were justified, and of various schemes i that of Waipukurau was the only one j it was an advantage to adopt, while j for cheapness there was nothing to beat it. They had been dealing with the cost of installations of electric light. Te Aroha cost £7SOO, Patea £SOOO and Eketahuna £7200, and Te Kuiti would not be able to instal at less than those towns have done, as two were using water power. They had got nearer to a reasonable estimate in the offer that night at £4400. If it couid be proved, and assurances given that it could be supplied to consumers at a reasonable price, it was well worthy ot consideration. It was evident that Eketahuna had made a loss of £230 last year, adding the loss on street lighting of £l5O, that made £3BO of a debit. Manufacturing and selling o? electricity by a public body was going into an industrial undertaking, and they were not justified in going in unless they were satisfied it was a sound business proposition, bo rar as the Patea statement was concerned, he said three different statements had come from there. In Cr Young's letter the installation was put down at +'2500 Five years ago he was in Patea,' and they had the borrowed another £IOOO, so he knew the figures put in the "Chronicle'' were abso- ; lutely wrong. The Te Aroha 1908 heet showed £l4O charged to

ordinary expenditure for street lighting. Th&t year they had raised £IOOO in debentures and paid oil debts owing. In the letter to Cr Forsyth it was stated the total income was £IOBB. The only way to arrive at the profit uf £331 was by adding street lighting. Three years ago they were not making sufficient profit to pay for street lighting and had to pay it out of ordinary revenue. Experience the world over showed that electric ligning was one of the worst paying speculations any public body had tried, and they were not justified in believing they Were going to instal it for £4 400. He was quite prepared to admit Dreadnought gas was new to most of them and looked upon with suspicion. It had been tried for two years at Waipukurau. They had an ofi'er to instal the patent, building and plant to generate 20,000 feet of gas for £250 and including street mains £2BOO. The borough engineer was confident £3OO cnuld be saved on mains and that brought it down to £2500. He estimated the amount of gas required in Te Kuiti per annum at 8,734,000 feet at 3s 9d per 1000 feet. The gross income was £O7O. The expenses were: cost of petrol £3OO, labour £IOO and incidentals £l3O, showing a clear profit of £l4O. or £240 if the price of gas was made 4s (id per 1000 feet. The crux of the question was that 1000 feet of gas could be produced under the Waipukurau system for Is 7Jd plus 3d for labour. Cr Forsyth: What candle power?

The Mayor said it anything was . wrong with the candle power the hospitals using the light would not like it. No light in the market could Lie produced at the same figure. If electricity could be installed as cheaply j and show such a profit he would be j satisfied. A wire received that day from the Dreadnought people offered to guarantee the borough against loss j for two years. The difficulty of con- . densation had been got over. There was absolutely no difference between j Dreadnought and ordinary coal gas ex- ! cept the former was produced in half j an hour and they would use a pelton wheel at no cost to the borough. He ' believed the gentlemen advocating electric light were just as conscientious as himself, but until they could give positive proof that the light , was as cheap and safe, the committee that recommended Deadnought gas had the beat grounds for doing so. Taking whatever system they might and j weighing it in the balance, petrol gas i was bound to come to the front. He i formally moved the adoption of the : report.

Cr Finlay asked the cost of the gas net, and whether the Council was in the hands of the company supposing the firm left the country.

The Mayor explained the various steps leading up to the adoption of the light at Waipukurau and S3id the company was willing to put it in at Te Kuiti at absolutely bedrock cost for the purpose of demonstrating that the light was a good one. They offered a guarantee of 12 months, or a guarantee against loss for two years. He would not consider any proposal to allow a private company to operate in the borough even at 3s a 1000 feet, in what should be borough work.

Cr Lusk seconded the motion, saying it was a clean light, would cook, iron and warm a bath and the difference between it and electric light was in striking a ma'ch and pressing a but ton.

Cr Hardy asked Mr Drummond whether his firm could guarantee the work for two years like the Dreadnought Company. Mr Drummond replied that the usual term

Cr Young moved as an amendment

"That Te Kuiti borough be lit by e ectric light and a report be obtained from a hydro-electric expert." Cr Hardy seconded, and thought before deciding on electrical power they should get a report from an expert. He had never seen a kitchen where cooking was b ing done by electricity. Cr Finlay supported the amendment, and said petrol was wholly in the hands of the Standard Oil Company, which controlled the petrol export of the world. He consequently felt that, although the Dreadnought people made out a very fair case, without further enquiry they were not justified in taking it up. Cr Forsyth supported the amendment. They would have to go to the ratepayers for more money to iinish their roads, etc.., so why not for electricity? Te Aroha had a credit balance of £l9 0s 5d in 1908 and in 1911 £561. It was charging £2 a year for lighting a five roomed house. Cr Sims supported the amendment:. It was useless to argue the cooking qualities of electricity. That power was not perfected yet, and was certain to be developed in a snort time. Cr Finlay asked Cr Young to alter his amendment to provide for getting the services of the most competent hydro-electrical engineer. The Mayor said that was practically what lie was going to suggest, and asked Cr Young to move the following motion in place of hie.

Cr Young agreed, and it was accordingly moved by himself and Cr Finlay. "That before coming to any definite decision the matter be referred backto the committee for the purposes of obtaining a report from a competent authority and to report to the Council at a future meeting. The motion was carried.

Mr Drummond explained that he only came to the meeting as a friend of Cr Young and not in any official capacity. A vote of thanks to him for his attendance closed the proceedings.