ROYAL COMMISSION.

Hokitika Guardian, 26 June 1923, Page 3

ROYAL COMMISSION.

ON ROYALTIES QUESTION. SUITING AT HOKITIKA. MONDAY, JUNE 25th. The Commissioner, Mr John Strnuclion presided, taking his seat at 10 a.m. (Continued). David John Evans, sworn, said he was Clerk to the "Westland County Council, Hokitika. The matter was a vital cne to the Westland County Council and for 10 veal's they had been hammering in the endeavor to get a square' deal. It was duo to Mr Murdoch that the matter had been brought forward. The opinion of Mr T. W. Retire, County Solicitor, was then obtained (handed in). The importance of the matter was recognised by the Council and application was made to the Government for redress. The opinion of .Mr Skeirett K.C. was obtained. At the end of 1919, a deputation of the Council interviewed Mr Massey. Prime Minister, lie handed in the County Chairman's report of June 1919. and report of a conference of local bodies sawmillers. members of Parliament, which Sir Francis Bell attended by invitation, oil Ist. July 1919. These pamphlets dealt fully with the subject at issue. The first payment referred to by Air Murdoch was in the year 1515-15. LT'dllS 14s lid; and in 1923 £495.

The total moneys received I rein the hand Board were 225,291 8s (id, plus eg,4o-1 18- -Id specially received for Midr:ii 1 v;iy lands, tl was very noticeable dial since tin- agitation the receipts had increased very ccitsiderahly and last year the highest on record was received, "viz. £2500 9s fid. It was noticed that the amounts received lor export was almost infinitesimal to what was actually exported. It was due to a conference with their Chairman. that the Grey County joined issue in the agitation, and it was then considered that the payments received were very small indeed in comparison. Towards the end of last year the local bodies moved in the matter and as a result the then Chairman (Mr Jeffries) submitted a report. In I'ebrtinry last a large deputation waited on the Prime Minister at Wellington. The Cotiferoure resolved to ask that a Commission he set tip. This request was placed before the Prime Minister ami a.s a result of this, the Commission was now sitting. I’nvisi tt was made ill Lite Washing Up Hill of hi-t year, fur a North Island local body to he reimbursed ler damage done in the roadbv tinib -r transit.

The Comini.-stoiior stated that hiorder of reference did not include past royalties.

.Mr Evans conn oiled that in Westland there were over 91) miles ot road which the Council had to maintain for heavy l raflie. hi 1921-22 the Council's expenditure on roads was LI. 111. Revenue from timber was 22300. In 1922-2,'S the expenditure increased t<i 0015 oil roads, out of a general revenue of .215.425, the amount in el tilling receipts for royalties ol 22389. In last year the royalties formed IS per cent of the revenue. The Council had hen rating up to a high limit. Two wars ago the rate was 9 farthings, and last year was S farthings. Ihe Council in recent years has borrowed substantial sinus lor road works, some that will he u-ed for timber cartage. With regard to leakages, which amount to a largo at lit, he instanced that rents on limber areas are considerably merged into royalties on timber cut, the local body not getting any of the rents. Tim amount in dispute oi rents iiupropcth credited would in Ids opinion run into ilemsamls ol pounds. 1 lie Council had now IT miles ot' main road to maintain, and appeals In the Government lor subsidy had not boon granted. Reference was made to the varied.. mills u-ing County roads lor carriage ot timber, involving a huge drain on the ratepayer:. owing to the* iicrrav'd expenditure necessary to keep Lite roads in passable order, duo to the extraordinary trallie. In answer to the Chairman, the witness said they were going to lo~<‘ the whole of the revenue ol the 1.550.(1119 acres of land now placed under the Forest Ad. The Forestry Director had suggested that tile Council should apple lor a certain amount, but no amount had boon stated. Ibis involves a tremendous loss to the district, while tin- burden of tile upkeep of the roads was thrown on the local bodies. In answer to a question of the lill'ther loss involved, lie (hough! a very rea enable estimate "as that half a million acres would ho worth L'-i an acre in royalties.

The County Council had not entered into anv >pecial cun,nil I nionl s. lie considered Ibe (‘ouncil Wiiuhl lie seriously embarrassed by the taking away of the revenue while the rulepa vers will he unduly burdened by the homy expenditure ill Ihe upkeep ol the roads. Ear more money- was spent nil the upkeep of the roads ilmn was invoiced in the royalties claimed.

The local body collected over L'tiOOO in rates. Nearly 50 per cent of their income was from rates. East financial year the County- rate- were LT>2!)O Ids 7d and County ratepayers paid Jjfi:i7 7s 2d. harbour rates.

Sawmill right s. taken under the Mining Act wore rated, hut so lar no areas under the Forest A<-t were being rated. The population of the County was about IlltlO, and they were paying about C7OOII in rates.

The qitestieii ei heavy l rail:e byr-lav was a burning question. Ihe Westland County was now forming a byelaw, but there was a difficulty in enforcing bye-laws of a<iinilur nature.

Tlie limber traliic would grow considerably in I utitrc. They considered till* forests should i:e available tor local

revenue. The forest s were local property, 1 he locality being entitled in the fruits within its I,otinditrics. The Forest Department, should continue to pay the royalties as in lie past under the previous acts of Parliament. The Council considered they were entitled to the royalties previously- paid. There had been a change of ownership, hill the new ownership .should pay the royalties previously- paid the Council. The Commission adjourned at 12.15 till 2 p.m.

AFT ER NOON SITTIXG. Gordon llaicourr, swoi-n. said he h.-ul interviewed and asked Mr Galbraith, Commissioner of Crown Lands, about -inn acres at Teremakau river. Mr Galbraith accompanied witness to Mr Hanson of the Forestry Department. He had a sketch plan with him. It showed there were 2nn acres of white pine timber, hr Hanson agreed to lot witness have 100 acres. Some time alter he received a letter from Mr McGavock, stating the area would have to be appraised, and surveyed and then offered for auction. So far nothing more has been done. He was taken hack at what he considered w*a.s crooked dealing, alter having the land promised to him. lie had lost the opportunity of working the area and the Council had lost the royalty. Thomas \Y. Duff, sworn, stated he was Chairman of the Westland C utility Council. The matter had been placed fully before them by Messrs Murdoch and Evans, which he emphasised and endorsed.

William James Butler, sworn, said the County revenue was expended for the creation and upkeep of facilities for th? benefit of the people, The nwt-

ter in qir&stion was of serious import to tho ratepayers of the County. If what was a prospective revenue was taken away, it involved a further liability on the ratepayers. As a ratepayer it very seriously affects flic users of the roads. The digest referred to previously, followed the result of a conference and was made by the Director of Forestry. Dealing with the question of the total amount that should he paid a very moderate estimate was put in by Mr Murdoch. He was in a position to state that Stuart and Chapman Ltd., cut out a considerable area that went over 100,000 feet per acre. There is in every tree, a quantity of first class timber and it is a matter of impossibility to separate first from second class timber in the hush. If there were good facilities for transport more of the timber was transported to tho mill, and therefore more was got out of the bush than if the transport facilities wore not good. Apart from the millable timber to be taken out of the hush, there will he other products taken out, such as for pulp making, while a far larger quantity of poorer timber will lie taken out than previously. Quite a large quantity of inferior timber was exported to Australia that was not usable in New Zealand. With the advance of industry, a far greater quantity of the poorer quality timber will he utilised in the future than in the past. Considerable importance should he given to this aspect. Firewood, fencing and posts would he utilised for Canterbury in the future. This will help to increase the royalties from the timber. There were 51 million feet exported from Greymouth last year. At (id per 100 this would mean 212,500. The Westland County had received JL2300 royalty. He pointed out in reference to rates that last year his firm’s rates had increased by 50 per cent.

William Mi liner. County Overseer, sworn, handed in his report to the County Council, dated June 23rd. The timber royalties should he available for assisting in the upkeep of the roads which the special traffic causes.

Mr Evans said there had been some hesitancy on the part of the Government in connection with the tyre tax, and the licensing of motor vehicles. Under the Highways Act the Government would probably tax motor vehicles. At the Counties Conference in Christchurch on Wednesday last a remit was passed asking in what way the Government proposed lo act, so that the local bodies would know what ni l ion -hiiuld he taken and if aclnm were taken what assistame would lie given in l lie local bodies. Alex I). MoGavock sworn, >; 111 1 he was Conservator of State Forests for Westland, lie proposed lo pul before the Commission a number of figures lie had drawn up. Tho timber cut in Westland County for the last four year- ivas Off Crown Land- ... 52,340,200 feet Oil State Forest ... 7,207.400 feet Oil" Freehold 51 .fill 1.090 feet The percentages were Crown Lauds 55",,, State forest 7”,’,, freehold 35",,. The timber cut ulf Crown Lands and carted on tramways was 31.(100,001) feet, carted on County roads 1 .(ISO.8(10 ft, mi Public Works roads, 8,200,800, on combined Public Works and County roads 7,848,900. Total 52.340,200. Various other figures were given _ of dili'erent particulars. The total amount taken by means ol tramways was fi1.579.200 or fifi 0 ,, by Countv roads 3,532.900 ur 4 . : bv Public' Works roads, 13,-1 15.200 or II", ; bv Public Works and Count v road-. 15.991.700: or I■ '> . .

In answer to the Chairman he said that ol the area of the Midland Railway rc-ervat ions the local bodies receive all rents and royalties. In Westland County the Forest reserves wen 1 917.511 acre- of Crown Lunds ami 557.0-0 acre- of endowment lands. The

Stale Enresl docs not receive any revenue for 1 ieeii -es granted In the Warden’s Court. When it was eoit-itlcreil dial only (!", of the timber cut off Crown Lands is tarried over County toads, he wa - of opinion that the local body was hem;: well treated. He was of opinion that as the timber is cut out in the future, more will lie carried liv tramways and less liv the leads. ITe instanced tin* Knnieri Timber Coy's tram, which would bring i's logs almost to Hokitika borough shortly, and the Ferngrove Sawmill Cov. at Ferguson-. who would soon lie connected up with Stuart- and ( hatiniait’s tramway. He abo p luted out that every foot of limber carried over County roads is also carried over the Borough of Hokitika's roads, and that body does not rcceiv anv royalty or assistance. Ho felt sure that 05°.', of the timber cutin the future would not use the Countyroads at id. He pointed out that of I 1 ..'178.100 super feet, MJ",', was cut- off freehold lands and carted over the reads. He thought the County Council should receive a portion nt the revenue and the State Forest lias never

onposed ii. He would suggest that the Commission ask to lie supplied with a return showing the amount of revenue naid to the County- Council derived from the .Midland railway reserve between April I. 101 l and March list, 102:!.

Mr Evans slated that the Countv Council would also like to have this return. The Council had made repented application for this information, hut had hit up against, a blank wall ns far as the information was concerned. In reply to further ooestions, Mr MeGavock referred the Commission to the head of the Forestry Department or declined to make any reply beyond statin; that the answers were included in the figures supplied.

In reply to Mr .Murdoch, the Commissioner said there should lie no objection to the County being represented when the acting head id the Forestry Department was called in Wellington in give the figures of the quantity of timber in Westland, which Mr McGavock had asked should be obtained from the head officer instead of himself. Mr Butler said this was an important point and the County- should have an opportunity nt reviewing the

Mr Dull' then thanked.the Commissioner for his attentive hearing and the latter complimented the Council on the able maimer their views had been placed before him. The sitting then concluded.