PROVINCIAL COUNCIL.

Hawke's Bay Times, Volume II, Issue 39, 27 March 1862, Page 2

PROVINCIAL COUNCIL.

Monday, March 24.

The Council met according to adjournment. Present—all tire members except T. H. Fitzgerald.

The minutes of the last sitting having been read and confirmed, The Superintendent laid on the table the Estimates as revised, remarking that only five or six copies had been prepared owing to the shortness ’of time afforded, which he hoped would meet the requirements of the Council.

Mr. Dolbel asked the Superintendent when it was likely that the road from Mohaka to the Tauranga bush would be laid out, as it had beeu made as fjr as it had been laid out, and they could not proceed with it.

The Superintendent said the Provincial Engineer would shortly proceed there, when the matter would be attended to.

Mr. Colenso moved the adjournment, till next day, of the third reading of the Publicans Licensing Amendment Ordinance, in courtesy to the member for Napier, who was absent, and who, lie believed, wished to introduce some clause.

Mr. Ormond seconded the motion, on the understanding that if the member referred to was not in his place on that day it should be proceeded with.—Carried. Mr. Colenso moved the adjournment, till next day, of the third reading of the Executive Act for the same reason.

Mr. Alexander seconded, on the same understanding.—Carried. Mr. Colenso gave notice that, on the 26th' March ho would move an expression of opinion of the Council as to whether the Provincial Treasurer is bound to pay a warrant, which, although signed by the Superintendent has not been countersigned by the Provincial Auditor or his deputy.

The house then went into committee of supply on tiie motion of Mr. Ormond. The Superintendent, in referring to the Estimates said the Government hail endeavored to make the iinuncial position of the Province as .clear as possible in order to show the Available Revenue from Ist April, 1862, to 31st March, 1863. The income of the Province for the fifteen months ending 31st March, 1863, and including balance in hand at the commencement of the year, would be £36.498 os. 9d. From this had to be deducted £8776 6s. 6d., the amount payable on account of Wellington debt, and other liabilities, and <£lo,llß 3s. lid. expended or under contract for the first three months of the present year, leaving for appropriation <£17.603 15s. 4d. This sum was proposed to be thus appropriated : Ordinary expenditure (including £I,OOO for a payaljlo Gold Field, £SOO for immigration, £SOO for steam communication) £7Bll Crown Lands Department 670 Survey Department 2137 Engineer’s Department—Public Works and undertakings 6683 Mr. Triphook asked what scale the Government bad adopted in the reduction of salaries. The Superintendent replied that deductions had been made in the salaries of the heads of departments, but he could not see how it was possible to reduce the salaries of the subordinate officers. A discussion here ensued between Messrs. Rhodes and Colenso on the general estimated revenue, when the chairman proposed the first item— Superintendent £l3O Capt. Lambert asked if it included the Inspectorship of Schools, and was answered in the negative. Mr. Fitzgerald moved that the sum be increased to £450, Motion agreed to on division, the noes being Messrs. Rhodes, Dolbel, Carter, Wood,, and Triphook—s. 1 member of Executive, at £5 per diem when on duty ... ... ... £lO Superintendent's Clerk, Clerk to Council, and Immigration Clerk 250 Contingencies 25 Provincial Trcasurerand Accountant 275 The two first items were passed. Mr. Ormond moved that the Provincial Treasurer's salary be raised to £3OO if lie would undertake the Inspectorship of Schools. Mr. Colenso agreed to do so if one visit per annum to the Wairoa would be deemed sufficient.

Agreed to. Contingencies.. £ 20 fCarrie,f) CnnTw al f uditor 150 (Carried,) Contingencies 40 married i Provincial Solicitor ug ' Mr. Triphook moved that it be reduced to £IOO. Amendment negatived on division. Ayes Messrs. Dolbel and Triphook —2 ontingencies £ 3 (Carried) Provincial Interpreter 100 « Contingencies 3 •• 7 Country Members at 12s. Cd.,.! 62 10a. Mr. Triphook moved that the item be struck off. Division—Ayes: Tiffen, Wood, Triphook, Hitchings, Dolbel, Colenso— 6. Noes: Rhodes, Carlyon, Lambert, Ormond, Alexander, Carter—6. * The Chairman decided the noes had it, and the amendment was therefore negatived. Mr. Colenso protested against the vote, saying it was contrary to all parliamentary practise that a person having a direct pecuniary interest in any matter should give a vote. The Superintendent had set the example, and he had followed when their salaries were under the consideration of the Council. The original motion was carried. , Messenger £IOO Contingencies . ’ 1 a Carried. Supreme Court — Expenses for witnesses £ino « aole . r iSd Cerned. On the item Gaoleress, £25, coming on, Mr Ormond opposed it, and moved that it be struck off. Amendment affirmed on division, the noes being Messrs. Carter, Dolbel, Hatchings, Fitzgerald, Alexander— s. ° moo Carried. Rations for Prisoners 80 Increased on motion of Mr. Colenso to £lO5. Contingencies _g 00 ' Coroner's Department—Contingencies 10 Carried. Police — Inspector £2lO Mr. Oemond moved that £52105. tilfsOth June be substituted. Agreed to. •i 1 Ser « eilnt at from Ist July, to 31st March ... £lO5 Carried. 1 Corporal £llO Capt. Lambert moved that ’the Corporal be increased to 115, and that the privates be reduced to 3 in number, at £IOB each. Several members spoke on this motion, against, decreasing.the_number of Police, although they would like to see their efficiency increased. Eventually, the Corporal at £lls was carried, and 4 constables at £IOO each. 1 Private (Clive)' £IOO 2 Privates (Waipawa) 21X) 1 District Constable (Mohaka) ... 25 Allowance to Inspector till June 30 ... ... “9 Allowance for horse to Policeman at Waipawa 36 Horse allowance for Serjeant for 9 months from Ist July to 31st March 39 iq 8 . These items were carried. Prisoners’ Rations 20 Increased, on the motion of Mr. Tiffen to £SO. Expenses for Prisoners, £2O Contingencies, £3O Capt. Lambert wished to see the Police in uniform, and if the sum proposed was not enough to buy them he would propose £4O. At present the only badge a policeman carried was a big stick with which he amused himself with flogging stones. He did not want anything expensive, but some distinguishing badge by which they might be known to be on duty. • Carried. Chanitahle — Provincial Surgeon, 11 Of, Hospital Attendance, 100/. Rations for Patients, 80 1. Furniture and Water Bed, 40/ Carried. Charitable Aid, 50/. Mr. Colenso moved that it be £IOO, remarking that it would be a great pity if, during the ensuing winter many cases of real distress should arise, and the Government not have the means of alleviating it. Mi. Rhodes said if such cases arose, no doubt the Superintendent would be indemnified fpr any such act. He did not like to see the estimates encumbered with a lot of money for fictitious purposes, locking it up from being spent in useful purposes. Mr. Colenso’s amendment negatived. Colenso moved a further amendment, of £75, which he withdrew. Contingencies, 35/. Carried. On the vote for Grants in aid of Education the Superintendent, in answer to Mr. Ormond, said that some of the reserves would shortly be leased. Grants under Education Act, 250/. Carried. Special — Harbor Master and Pilot, 200/. 2 boatmen at 6s, 6d per diem, 240/. Bonus to ferry at Napier, 9 months at 60/., 45/ Contingencies, 60/. Inspector of Weights and Measures’ Inspector of Slaughter houses, Inspector of Sheep, and Registrar of Brands, 200/. Carried. Mr. Tiffen asked how the duty of Inspector of Weights arid Measures was carried on, foT everything he bought was short weight

—bread, sugar, or coals. Capt. Lambert thought the Police should carry out this duty, but was inforined that it was a general government appointment. The Superintendent also explained to Mr: Rhodes that it was not the Inspector*s duty to visit the shops, but it was the duty of persons to come to the Inspector to get their weights and measures tested and stamped. Carried. Registrar of Sheep, Southern boundary of Province 150/. Contingencies, 80/. Receixer of Land Revenue, Oontingeugencies, 51. Expenses of Elections, GO/. Carried. On the motion of Mr. Tiffen, the sum of £4O set down for Waipureku ferry contingencies was increased to £6O. Ron us to Ferry at Waihua, 20/. Bonus to Ferry at Waikari, 51. Bonus to Ferry at Wairoa. 20/. Carried. Local Posts, Waipawa to Buataniwlia, 3 months, 8/. las. Puketapu to Pekapeka via Tutaekuri, 3 months 61. ss. Steam Subsidy, 6C V. General Printing, 200/. Insurance on Government Buildings 90/. Special Constables 30/. Council Library and Newspapers 30/. Powder for Saturday’s gun, 15/., (Mr. Colenso having proposed that it be increased to 20/,) Registrar of meteorological tables 25/. Miscellaneous contingencies 300/. Reward for payable Gold Field, 1,000/. Immigration guarantee, 500/. Furniture for Government offices, 15/. Coals and Firewood for do., 30/. Compensation to Capt. Uenton, 13/. Carried. After the chairman had reported progress, the Council adjourned till 7 p.m. The Council met at 7 p.m. Present—all the members except Mr. T.H. Fitz Gerald. . Crown Lands Commissioner and Chief Provincial Surveyor, £350. Mr. Triphook moved as an amendment that the two offices be divided, and that the Crown Lands Commissioner should have £3OO, saying that this separation was recommended by the select committee which had been appointed to investigate the matter; and in answer to Mr. Colenso that lie intended to meet the necessity of providing for a chief surveyor by appointing one of the two surveyors who held Provincial appointments to that office, at the same salary, and increasing the amount of contract surveys. He could not say how the service could be made less burdensome ; but if he had had the framing of the estimates, he would have reduced the number of officers rather than reduce their pay. Amendment negatived on division, Aves : Triphook and Dolbel. Chief Clerk, £2so.—Passed. Travelling Expenses for Commissioner, 12s. 6d. per diem, £2O. Capt. Lambert thought the sura ought to bo increased, as the chief surveyor, to do his duty well, should be in the field a great deal. Mr. Tiffen thought the item sufficient, as any one who knew the profession was aware that nearly all mistakes which occurred took place in the office, and not in the field. Any one could survey, but few could project their work properly. Original sum carried. Contingencies, £so.—Passed. ...... Public IVorA's and Undertakings — Two Surveyors- at £3OO each ; Travelling allowance for ditto, £B6 each, £72 ; Draughtsmau£2so ; Survey Laborers, £IOOO ; Contracts, £SOO , Contingencies, £ls ; Provincial Engineer, and Director of Works and Paymaster of Ronds, £3OO ; 1 ravelling Expenses, £IOO ; Contingencies, £5 ; Director of Works, bonus on leaving the employ of the government, £100; Napier Gaol—Furniture, £loo.—Passed as read. Steam Dredge,—Engineer, £216. The Superintendent said it was necessary to carry this and the two following items, in order that the works which had been commenced might be proceeded with ; and when this was finished it would take some one to look after the dredge and keep her in repair. Mr. Triphook moved that the discussion on these items be postponed till the harbor works came on, which was carried. Mr. Carlton asked if the Superintendent had received a letter from the Pilot on the subject of Harbor Improvements. read, as also an answer to it from Mr. Wright, on the motion of Mr. M. Fitzgerald. Completion of Harbor Works between Yautier’s and Heydn’s, £BOO. In answer to Mr, Colenso, the Superintendent said this work 'might be done by hand labor for £9OO, without the dredge. Mr. Ormond opposed this vote, as it had been stated that these sections would not be valuable for some time ; and as it would not be wise to he sinking capital in investments which would not bring a return for a long time. Mr. Triphook defended the vote on the ground that it was nearly finished, and only wanted £BOO to render it available ; and said that if what had been done went to wreck through not completing it, he thought it would be a great waste of money, and that the commercial part of the community who lived at the Spit would feel it more than any one, through this unprotected part washing into the harbor. Mr. Colenso followed in the same strain, saying that if done by the dredge a double advantage would bo obtained, viz., the channel deepened, and a section of land, on which a good deal of money had been spent, completed and made ready for sale. Capt. Lambert said the country members would not oppose anything which would benefit the Province. They would gladly see a good harbour ; but the fact was it would cost too much. It had cost £16,000 already, and we could not afford any more. Dr. Hitchings thought that as the Arabella was in harbor, it would be s matter of courtesy to allow the dredge to assist in taking her out, as ho believed her services had been asked for by the Pilot, and he though she might he profitably employed during the next three months. Mr. Triphook said she was now dismantled, previous to getting her new machinery in, the old machinery being perfectly worthless ; in fact ho wondered how it had lasted so long. Mr. Colenso. said it would be a pity that this item should be struck out, as her slew machinery had arrived at a great cost to the Province, and wpuld now bo useless, as it had nevdr Been proved.

Mr. Rhodes said lie had always been opposed to Harbor Improvements, and had only voted for the sum of £6,000 for them because the plant had coat so much. He thought that if the sections were sold as they were they would realise a fair price. Besides, he thought it better that the work, if required, should be done by hand labor ; and as to rigging out the dredge to tow the Arabella out, he believed, if she went outside, she would leave her bones on the bar.

Mr. Alexander followed, saying that the Council ought to be guided principally by the Engineer’s report. Air. Iriphook said the dredge had only been working at half power, only using one boiler. Hitchinss asked if it was true what he had heard the captain of her say, when asked why he had been so long coming here, viz., that he had only used one boiler ; and on being further asked why be did not use the other, said lie should be very sorry to trust his life in her if it was used. Mr. Tripuook explained although perhaps the boiler would not have been 40ibs. square inch, the pressure required for steaming, vet it would do very well for the low pressure required for dredging. > - The house divided. Ayes, 6 : Tripliook, Wood, Alexander, Caster, Tiffen, Colenso. Noes, 7 : Ormond, Carlyoh, Fitzgerald, Lambert, .Hitchings, Bolbel, and Rhodes.

Motion negatived. Mi. Oumoxd moved that the engineer’s salary be £sl for 3 months, instead 0f£216 for 12 months, th H-ge of the dredg^^uring Carried. „ The Superintendent wished toHSI what the Council would propose should be dbue with the dredge. Rhodes said she iujafct be sold to either Marlborough or Otagoi Rfiaphat the Superintendent should communicate with the Governments of these places at once oi> the subject. Foreman of dredge at 12s. per day ; Stoker, at 95.; machinery, £IOO ; Funnel and Gallev, £7o. Struck out.

Bridge across Slmkspeare flat, £35. Mr. Cotjjkso asked tlie Council whether after having struck off so large a sum from the estimates, whether they would not recommend the Superintendent to add the sum struck off to the estimates, for filling in Sbakspcarc-flat, affording employment to a number of working men. The original vote passed. Bridge, Waghornc-street £2O ; Painting Survey office, £B.—Passed. b J Tlydcrabad-road, £3OO. The Sui*Ki«.vtESDENT explained that he had thought it right to put this sum on the estimates ns a road had been promised in that direction, but seemed to be some misunderstanding about the conditions which had been recommended. Mr. FiT/GKiiat.d wished to know if the road was to be made on the mud flat. If so, £3OO was useless, it. would require £3,000. Mr. Colexso said that all those people who at the commencement of the settlement paid such high prices for their sections at the Oncpoto and its neighborhood did so on the faith that the Government would make that road first, he should move thus the sum be increased to £SOO. Amendment put and carried. Noes : Lambert, Rhodes, Tifien Ormond, Carlyon, ]Vf. Pitzgcrald.~G.

llastings-street, £3OO. H'Pkn moved that the sum be increased to £uOO, as so many sums had been struck off, and it would employ labor for working men in the town during the winter months. Mr. C aui.tox said they did not come to legislate for working men alone, but as to which were the best roads for the good of the Province. l)r. IIiTcniNGS would like to know where this money was to be spent, as it was a long distance between Napier and Clive. He should like to see the white road contiuued two or three miles every year, J

Mr. Rhodes thought the place where the money ought to be spent was between Tareha’s bridge and the ruined chapel, as that portion was very bad, and that the other end of the white road was good, and fit for traffic.

Capt. Lambert said members seemed to try how much money they could spend round and about the town ol Napier. lie should oppose this, hs the road was good enough, drays and carts coming in every day from Clive, and not getting stuck, which was the case on the other side of the N<*aruroro. &

• C I OLENSO said it; wa3 the best natural road m the whole colony, and ho thought it quite unnecessary, and he was quite surprised at seeing the names of so many of the inhabitants of Napier to such a petition as that which accompanied it. Mr. Rhodes should support it, and was surprised Mr. Colenso should object, as be pretended to be the cliampion of the working classes, and here was an opportunity of finding labor for the unemployed. Amendment put, and lost on division. Ayes : Dolbel, Rhodes, IJitchings, Triphook, Wood, and Original £3OO put and carried on division. Noes: Carter, Colenso, Lambert, Ormond C’arlyon—s. ’

Approach to Milton-road from Mr. Catchpool’s, £lO ; Hospital-road, £ls.—Passed. Waghorne-street to Hastings-street, £175. Mr. Golexso said if the Executive had known that such largo sums would be struck off the estimates, they would have put a much larger sum then this on the estimates for the work mentioned He should move that it bo increased to £3OO. Amendment negatived. - r- TjumooK moved that it bo increased to Jrassea oil mvision.—xTccs * Lsnb fi ?t Carlyon, Fitzgerald—3 * ' Repairs to Awatoto-road, £loo.—Passed. Line from Awapuni to Clive, including bridge at Awapuni, £BOO. Mr. Rhodes said that the engineer’s report showed that this road was the shortest and cheapest. r

Mr. Colenso said, even admitting it was the shortest and cheapest it was by no means the safest, and cheap things were not always the best. He was at aloss toknow whether they were considering this as a trunk line into the interior, or as a branch road to Clive. Be did not mean to impugn the statement of the engineer, but he meant to say that £5,000 would not make the road from Awapuni to Clive. The smihd fern ridge which ho describes in his re-

port, is under water during the winter. The natives, too, had said that the pakehas must ho mad to make a road by this line, and many who had been induced to sign the petition, did so w ithout knowing what they had signed, and were anxious to have their names taken of}'.

Mr. Thipiiook would vote for this sum, as he believed it to be a matter of expediency, as they were not discussing the trunk lines into the country.

The Superintendent, in answer to a question, said that the natives had. agreed to lease 5 acres of the land for the Ferry-house and site for the punt. Capt. Lambert thought that the money of the Province had been frittered away in making branch lines, and the trunk lines had been neglected. Mr. Wright’s plan made the other line half a mile nearer, while Mr. Gill’s made it three quarters.

Mr. 13or, hi: l was surprised at Mr. Colenso, who was always so economical in his ideas, stating that it would require £SOO, when he believed £2oo' would make it. He thought that the place for the punt was Waitangi. He thought it foolish to try and throw Clive in the shade by cutting off a road to it at the time when it was coming into the market. W hy, there were 800 quarter-acre sections, that would bring about £4OOO into the chest, which would repay the Government any Outlay it might make on Clive. Last vear they had voted £OOO for the same purpose, which had not been expended, and he could not understand members voting one session for an object and opposing it nest. He called it child’s play. Capt. Lambert moved that the sum of £BOO be applied to a direct road to Havelock. Negatived. Original motion affirmed on division—Xoes : Colenso, Carlyon, and Lambert. Sir. Alexander reminded tho Council that it would he necessary to authorise the Superintendent to spend a certain sum for the payment of the natives for site of ferry-house, &o. New Ferry Punt, £l7s.—Passed. Te Ante Hoad, £SOO. Capt. Lambert asked whether it was for repmrs. He begged to call the attention of the Council to the state of the road just beyond the second bridge past Havelock, at the termination oi the metalled road. It was a regular bog in winter. °

Mr. M. Fitzgerald moved as an amendment that the item be struck out. Mi - . Iripiiook would like an expression of Council whether the Te Aule or Middle line were the better.

Cahlyox said if traffic was a criterion, the -Te Ante line was.

Mr. M. Fitzgerald said that if the same sums of money had been spent on the Middle line as had been lavished on the Te Ante, it would be much the bettor road. The natural features of the line were better, whilst it had plenty of drainage, and went through more Crown land than the lo Ante line by ten miles.

Mr. Colenso said it would not do to talk now of what ought to have been done. 'We had this fact, that to make a really good road to Waipawa and would not cost as much money now by the Te Ante road as if the Middle line was now to be made.

Mr. i'ITZGEKALD »till maintained that the Middle hue was the better, and would remind the Council that a road with a bad foundation costs more to keep it m repair in a few years than the original cost of making it. C'apt. Lambent thought it would take a smaller sum to complete the Tc Ante line. A petition had been sent last session by the inhabitants of Havelock respecting the state of the road at that It °u' i- 6 lumself had seen animals bogged there. Ue believed the Government had lost .-sight of it. flic amendment was negatived. , m °ved that the sum be increased to which was carried. Middle Eoad, £l5O. This item was carried an foment by Mr. Fitzgerald that it be increased to £3OO having been negatived. Porangaliau Eoad, £250; Bridges bet ween Porangahau and Tautane, £2OO ; Eoad from Tammnu to Patangata, £125.-~Carried ; Mr. Fitzgerald’s amendment that the last item be increased to £4OO being negatived. Bridge at Tamumu, £3O. Mr. Colexso asked if the Government road would pass over this bridge ; also whether the proprietor could shut it up at pleasure. Mi. Tiii vhook would also like to know if the bridge had been approved by the Engineer, as it might be worthless.

Mi. Tiffex said he knew the bridge, and it had been used by the public for some time, and saved crossing a creek three times, as also a bad swamp. Item passed, on condition that. the public should have a right of road. Eoad from Edenham to Wautukai, £BO. After some discussion as to the desirability of this road, the item was passed on a division— Aocs : Colenso, Triphook, Carlyon, Lambert, and Ormond.

Hoad to Moli at a, £lso.—Passed . TraL ; k 10 Mohaka, £2OO, was increased to £-50 on the amendment of Mr. Uolbel on which the house divided—Noes : Hitchings, Ormond, Lambert, Carlyon, and M. Fitzgerald. Petane Road, £llo.—Passed. Road to Kcreru Bush, £2oo—Passed, on the Superintendent explaining that it was to open up the bush sections, which are open for selection. Meaneo Road, £2oo.—lncreased to £-100 on the motion of Mr, Alexander, Making Culverts between Waipukurau and Ruatamwha, £100; Tarring and Battening the Fparanna Bndge, £loo.—Passed. The Superintendent wished to add £l5O for a Bridge over the Maraetotara. After a discussion between Messrs. Rhodes, Tiffen, and Colenso, the item was negatived. Grants in aid of loads, £is6o.—Passed.

The Superintendent moved that £2O be added for bonus to Wairoa ferry, stating it was much wanted.—Passed.

This finished the estimates, and the chairman reported progress. The house resumed, and adjourned to next day at 3 o’clock.

[The Council met on Tuesday, and after going through the remaining business, the Superintendent declared it prorogued.