GENERAL ASSEMBLY.

Globe, Volume XXIV, Issue 2583, 18 July 1882, Page 4

GENERAL ASSEMBLY.

[PHM AJSOOIATIO3 IBUHTBUCJ HOUSE OF BEP3ESBNTATIVE3. Moira&T, Juit 17. The House met at 7.30 p.m. HKW MSMBfiB The member for Btsnmore, Mr Pilliefc. wes intrcduoed by Sir George Grey and Mr Wynn Williams, and took the oath and his seat for Stan more. lASD BUI, Mr Ptke resumed the debate on the Land Bill, lie oomplimented Mr Bolleston on introducing this exoellsnt Bill, which showed he possessed the oourage of his opinion. He had the nobis audacity of advocating opinions which, if not popular, were at least noble and just. The main principles of the Bill were in •coord with the tendenoy of modern thought. Although no Legislature had ever endoavorod to givo them practical effect, the principle W2B that the land w«j, and must always remain, tho property of the State, no matter how dispcod of The Bill would benefit individuals by enabling them to go on land without first impoverishing themselves by an expenditure of purchase money. The advantage to the State would be incalculable. What would be the condition.of the colony if it sold all its land ? To sell land was really not to raise revenue, out to destroy taa source from which the revenue should bs raised. There was really ao limit to the taxation whioh land might bear, although there*was a limit to the power of indirect taxa'ic n.They were flinging thoir patrimony to the winds in selling this land, and allowing large estates to accumulate in the hands of a fow, regardless of the lessons of the history of other countrioa all the world over. The majority would, in turn, make the minority pay when they found themselves shut out from tho land. He entirely concurred with the caution shown by the Government in proposing first to try the experiment on a limited scale. Ho laughed to scorn the idea

that people would not take up leasehold*. Xhe sales of pastoral leases in Otago, which bad realised £70,000 a year, showed this. Ho believed two-thirds of Dunedin was let en losses. There wai a great deal of sentimental noasocse talked about this question of freeholds os against leaseholds. People did, n-3 a matter of fact, lend monoy on leasss. Ho preferred the State to the money lender (is a landowner. If the leasehold ultimately became freehold, a ill one great good would be done, that the people would baro been settled on the land. In India the autn of 16,000,000 waß annually raised by the rent of land*. He entirely differed from the Minister of Linda :■: referenoe to the lands on goldfield*, and thought at least thirty years' lease should be given, and not limited to twenby■one years. The outcome of the ballot system was that tho wealthy man got the bulk of the land, as so many dummies were put in. He considered the landlordism of the private person was the worst sort, and not that of the State. This Bill would be a death blow to land shark*, and therefore th c y would oppose it. He complimented Sir John Hall on hii masterly ■ speech on Friday night. The deferred payment system was originated by the ■pettier (Mr Pyke) in 1862, and not by Mr Donald Beid, as stated by Mr Bolleston. At nhe present time the agricultural lease system (was preferred to the deferred payment system. Section 38 was, ho thought, one of the harshest ever introduced in suoh a Bill, and it should not be allowed to pass in ita present shape. He regarded clauses 45 downwards with great fear, lost they should lose their reserves for primary eduoation by \ this BilL He would try and have these clauses struok out in committee. He was

perfectly sure the clauses for the relief of the deferred payment settlers would never be availed of. He thought the Bill introduced by Sir George Grey to be better for deferred payment settlers than the Bill ictroduoed by the Government. Ho congratulated the Minister of Lsnds on the clause referring to pastoral leases. He hoped that no party feelings vrould influence members in dealing with a measure of this importance. Mr Hubsthousb had listened carefully to the speeches on this Bill, and had oome to this conclusion—that the law to settle the people on the land must not be oast iron, but very elaatio. He hoped to see the day when (he education reserves of Otago would be eettled with a thriving population. It was the duty of the Legislature to place the people on the land. He did not think the deferred payment settlers required relief at the present time, but thought they should work out their own destiny. He held that the peace and o /ntentment of the people was of more importauoe than theoretical dealing with land. He thought there ought to be a difference in the duration of leases in open and forest land. In forest country there ought to be an extension of time in the first instance. Under this Bill it would be very wise to reserve to the Crown auriferous land. Bf He hoped the law of entail would be abolished, thus breaking up large ontates every generation. Mr Fbbsus said it seemed to him the question was whether they should or should not lease a portion of the available lands of the Grown. He was no tsdvooate for nationalising the lands of the colony, but looked upon this Bill as a great help to settlement of the lands of the colony. Xhe auriferous lands of the Grown ought to be con* served. He contended that the deferred payment system had been a success, and thought the extension of the deferred payments system within limits, and the leasing of arable lands would result m the settlement of the country. He should like to see a number of alterations mada in committee, though the time of leases should, iu oome oases, be greatly extended. He complimented the Minister of Lands for introducing the measure. Mr Weston said this measure was one of tfco most serious the House could dispose of. Met one of the advooates of the Bill had gon? into the Bill thoroughly. The Minister of Lands said the Bill was not to interfere tenure of land at present held by privaftr-iEdividuals, but he thought this limitation a mistake. The question of the

deferred payment settlers had been brought before the House over and over again. He thought whether the deferred payment aettiers paid or not, they must be left on the land. The xnoit that could be done was to leave them time to pay the money. They could not be tuned off the land. lie thought there was lonta justice in the remarks of Sir George G-rey on this Bill. The deferred payment settlers were given this ground, and there was no guarantee that the land would ba proporly tilled or the conditions fulfilled. He condemned the condition of the lease proposed by the Bill, whioh provided that only one-fifth of the land was necessary to be cleared, and the rest might thus remain in a state of nature. Mr Bolleßton said tha Government did not wish to encourage the borrowing of money by the people, bnt it was aobeasary for farmers to borrow. It was provided that the people were not to hold m.ois than 640 acres. He could not agree with the limitation. This measure would chock the proper use of money, and would result in a quantity of land remaining in a State cf nature. It was preposterous to think a man would take 640 acres of bush land for twenty-one years. The system of arbitration propcted was unfair, as the Crown would nominate one of the arbitrators

and the cottier the other, and the Crown a , t third should these two not agree. It was unlifcely people would come here for a leasehold when they could get a freehold oheaply in Amerioa or elsewhere. Hon. members who approved of the Bill had killed it with faint praise. Mr Bolleston said he wißhed to encourage the gold mining industry, bat had not evinced that in the leant degree. This session, when members went to see him about anything they only got evasive answers ; but here he came down with this Bill as a universal panacea, and in reply to all complaints said take a lease and be happy. The gold fields did not want this Bill, and it was not adapted to their requirements. He spoke at considerable length to show this. Mr Kolleston x. ally knew very little about the Bill, and did not understand its effect. He (Mr Weston) was -very doubtful whether Mr Bolleston was sroally the parent of the Bill. However, as the Government hod brought in this Bill they should ctand jr fall by it, and not allow it to be mangled and changed in committee. 'Che only way to check the acquisition .of largo estates be held to be ttio abolition oE the law of entail. He expressed the uVinoet disappointment at the policy, weakness, want of policy, and pro.eraetiv»*.'.is of the Government this session . HThoy eat on the Benches, lotting members -scramble over wretohed private measures. There was a great contrast between their conduct this session and that of the late Premier. Now nothing could be got at all from them. He felt it bis duty to say this

openly, althopgh ho said' it with paiD, at many of the members of the Government were hit personal friends. It wm now the duty of the Bonce to lee that right men ■were pot on the Government benches, and that the work c f the oonntry was done, or else they would ell go baok to their constituents like fools and not like wi»e men. He did not say how he would voto if a vote of want of eocfidenoe was proposed, but unless thoy brought down a real polioy at or.oa and procesded to deal with it in a business-like wajf he would do hii boat to turn them out.

Mr Duncan would not vote for tho Bill. Speaking from experience in his district ha believed the leasing system proposed would not answer. People would take up leases and abandon them, after exhausting the land. He denied that the deferred payment system had proved a general failure. In oertaiu coses it had done so no doubt, bnt that wa9 due to causes foreign to the system itself. Mr Stewabd said the colony could not afford to say to the people looking out for a new home, that they could only give them leases, while other colonies and oountries offered them freeholds. They could not bo oontent with their present population. Ten years hence there ought to be a population of a million. To attraot this there must be a possibility of aoquiring freeholds. What with Nationalisation of tne land and compulsory insurance, people would be driven out of the colony instead of being attracted to it. If a clsbs of Orown tonantj were created here there would soon bo a no rent agitation, as there was in Ireland.

Mr T evin supported the Bill generally. Mr Levbstam and Mr Feldwick opposed the Bill, and Mr Hobbs supported. At 12 55 tho House adjourned.