Untitled

Globe, Volume XXIII, Issue 2323, 14 September 1881, Page 3

THE ESTIMATES.

On the motion for going into committee of supply, Mr Bbtce moved the motion standing in his name, affirming the desirability of reducing the estimates by J 830,060. He said it had been reported outside to be an inspired motion. He supposed that meant that it had been inspired by the Government. Such was not the case, and in fact he did not know down to the present moment whether or not the Government intended to accept the proposal. He had purposely framed it so that that they would be en-kbled to accept of it without any loss of dignity on their part. He went on to say that in his opinion they stood as much in need of retrenchment as ever, and that unless economy was still practised, the threatening financial catastrophe might still take place. He was astonished to find many members willing to withdraw from the economy they had entered upon. He was fully convinced that the estimates could bo reduced je30,000, without in any way impairing the efficiency of the service. The colony was heavily taxed in comparison with other colonies. The total revenue, including taxation and railway profits, did not exceed .£2,000,000; the interest on loan and sinking fund swallowed up one and a half millions of money, leaving only .£500,000 to carry on the business of the colony. Such being the case, it would be seen at a glance that great economy still required to be practised. It appeared to him that there was only one way of preserving the solvency of the colony, and that was by largely increasing their productive powers. The reduction proposed would indicate to the Government that it had the sympathy of the country in their efforts for retrenchment in whatever way it could be effected. He believed that tho time was coming when they v.oald have to face tho retrenchment question in even a more earnest manner than they had yet done. Mr Giubk seconded the motion, and spoke in favor of tho proposed reduction. The debate was interrupted by the 5.30 adjournment.

EVENING SITTING. Tho Ecuse resumed at 7.30. THE ESTIMATES.

The Hon. Major Atkinson said that he woald accept Mr Bryce's motion in the si irit in which it was made. He did not pledge the Government to reduce the estimates to the amount proposed, but they would do their be;t to cive effect to it.

The motion was then put and carried. On the question for leaving she cb.air, Mr Satjndkrs moved —"That it was not desirable to proceed with the consideration of the estimates until tbey had passed ths Corrupt Practices Prevention Bill through all its stages." The Hon. J. Hall Baid that it was asking too much to delay the estimates until this Bill was passed through all its stages. He looked upon tha Bill as a preventative rather than a euro, and he proposed to refer tho Bill to a Select Committee. If that would be satisfactory to the mover, he would undertake to follow that course at onca.

Mr Saunders said he would accept that assurance.

Sir W. Fox gave it as his opinion, in centradistinction to what tha Premier had Baid, that he

knew of his own knowledge thattbe measure was required for something more than a preventa*jVJ - Indeed, he was afraid it was needed in New Zealand as a cure. ( Mr Collins would support the amendment, believing that the Bill was urgently needed in New Zealand as an antidote to existing evils. Mr Speight warned them that if referred to Select Committee they would hear no more of » v this session. tfte'*. a liykb spoke in favor of the proposal by « «**' ' nm S? t t 0 refer the Bill *o a Select the' GoTfty. The character of the Bili wae such CommittteeV believe a single member expected that he ditf *M&. •> present shape. rS would'passing 'ht it possible to pass the Mr GEOBfi-E ' otherwi-o, and urged Col. TBiMßta- t&BUglft he estimates. The them- to go on at once wits v > n e. Bi !l aa s atood was n Slra * v n Port of goins Mr MoNTaoircßT spoke isr sw. t his opinion on with the Bill at once, givfaj* it »«• through that if She estimates were oec* 'rtnre' members would forthwith tako tHei* effjv and there would be no chance sf the 1 S3J . session. Mr Weston spoke in favor of the estiiar.te j being gone on with at once, leaviny the Bill' to ' be dealt with by a Select Committee. The question was put that the Hotwo go into committee—Ayes, 36;. noes, 33. The- Houss then resolved itself into committee of supply. Class 2—Colonial Secretary, printing and stationery, .£20,536; sheep, cattle, &c, .£1127. Passed. Miscellaneous services -.£24 i 490. Item, revision of statutes, .£BOO. Mr Ahdeews moved that the sum be reduced .£SOO. Mr Stewart contended that the payment was a most improper one. It was paid to the Solicitor-General and a Judge of the Supreme Court. He contended that it was most improper. The work conld be done in twelve months, bnt if they continued to vote this sum it would, he believed, go on for a century. Tho actual work -ras being done by a person who had not received anything, and who had not the name of a commissioner. It was an abuse, and ought not to be tolerated.

The Hon. J; Hall said that it was entirely incorrect to say that the balk of the work was done by the secretary. The Solicitor-General had to devote a great deal of his own time to the work. How the Jndge got throngh his share of the work he was not prepared to say. Within the text twelve months the bulk of the work wonld be done.

Mr Andrews said that the Premier could not possibly know what he was saying. The Solicitor-General himself had stated in evidence that he had done practically nothing; that was his own statement, and on being farther interrogated as to what had been done, ho stated that the three commissioners, to whom .£735 14s had been paid, had done practically nothing. All the work had been done by the printers. The Hon. T. Dick denied the statement made by the previous speaker, and went on to say that the party referred to as having done the work without payment by Mr Stewart was quite a mistake. The facts were that he received his payment as regularly as any of the rest. He also complained that the Solicitor-General should be allowed to do this work outside his own office hours, as it unfitted him for the discharge of his ordinary duties. Mr Pitt concurred in the impropriety of a judge holding an appointment like this outside his ordinary duties. Mr Weston expressed a similar opinion. A judge's mission should be a sacred one, and his whole time ought to be devoted to his duties. Mr J. B. Fisher had taken the same ground in 1879, and was glad to see that opinion so innuentially shared in as it was on this occasion. This work was in the character of a gift in the patronage of the Government, and as snch it was a most improper thing to give it to a judge of the Supreme Court. The Hon. T. Dick hoped the vote would not then be interfered with, promising that the Government would take the matter into consideration, and see what could be done. Mr Baeroh read a telegram from the Attorney-General of the late Government, dated

1878,_ appointing the commission, and adding that it would_ occupy about twelve months. He pointed to this as a significant fact. It was now 1881, and they were told that the work was not yet completed nor likely to be completed. Mr J. B. Fisher pointed out that they had only that day elicited the fact that one man had been lying in Hokitika gaol for six months charged with murder, and had not been brought to trial. This of itself showed that proper time was not being given to their ordinary duties by the Judges, and yet they were engaged on other duties.

The reduction of .£SOO was negatived on the voices.

Mr Stewart then moved a reduction of .£250, expressing his opinion that the whole thing might be completed in nine months' 'time. After a statement from the Colonial Secretary that the suggestions made would be carefully considered by the Government, the amendment was withdrawn, and the item passed as printed. Item West Coast Commission, .£2OOO. Mr Thomson desired to know when the Com-

mission would come to an end, and he also desired information as to the details of the charge set down.

Mr Moss also questioned the aetion of the Commission.

Sir W. Fox explained that a large amount] of survey work had to be done bsfore the crown grant. He could not say when the Commission was likely to end. Hitherto it had progressed very much to his satisfaction. What had yet to to be done he was afraid was more complicated than that already done, still he hoped to have it well advanced next session. Already all the work south of Oeo, which comprised nearly half the whole district, was completed, and he could name every person entitled to a grant. The Hon. W. Rolleston said he was responsible for the work, and he was prepared to accept that responsibility to the fullest extent.

He was quite satisfied of the value of the work done, and being done, by Sir W. Fox. Mr Moss contended that the enquiries conducted by this Commission ought to be conducted in open Court. As it was this Com-

mission had to bo backed up by an Armed Constabulary. Item—Payment under Babbit Act, £2ooo— passed, after some disenssion. Class 7, Legislative Department, £35,400. Item—Bellamy's, on account of establishment, £125. Mr Pitt moved that it be struck out.

Mr Saunders thought this the most extravagant department of the service. Item —Chairman of Committees (additional

to permanent salary, Legislative Council, £300). Mr Andrews moved that it be struck out.

Ayes, 26; noes. 20. Item struck out. Item —Clerk, £9O (additional and permanent salary, £400). Mr Andrews moved that it be struck out.

Ayes, 24 ; noes, 39. Item retained. Clerk of Parliament, .£IOO (addition to permanent salary, .£800). Sir M. O'Rorke appealed to have the item retained. Mr Andrews pointed out that this officer pot .£6OO, and it was proposed to give him J6IOO more, while laborers and others with 6s a day had to submit to reductions. If they went on making these increases where were they to end. Mr Saunders pointed out that this officer did the work as well when he had only .£4OO. Raising this salary caused them to raiße other salaries. He looked upon it that .£IOO was enough, and they could get a man to do the work for that amount. They were placing burdens on the heads of the population of which they would yet be ashamed. He aßked why they should pay such men as this salaries far more than they could get the work done for. Mr Pitt thought £6OO was quite enough for the office, and he asked why it was proposed to give £IOO more at a time like this. .£OOO was the amount fixed by tbo Permanent Act, and he saw no reason why the amount should be in-

creased. Mr Montgomery said it was ridicu'ons that they should pay the clerk .£7OO and the Speaker only .£6OO. The House divided. Ayes, 32; noes, 20. Item retained.

Item, Sergeant-at-Arms, £2OO. Mr Andrews moved the reduction of £lO. Ayes, 8 ; noes, 44. Mr Andrews said that all his efforts at retrenchment would now appear to be futile. He considered that it was unjust to reduce one part of the Civil Service and not another. It was in view of that fact that he had taken the staud he had done. Finding his efforts of no avail, he would now retire from the Chamber altogether and leave them to do as they chose. Item, Bellamy's, on account of tho establishment, £l25 —Struck out on the voices. The remainder of the vote was then put and passed. Class B—Treasury Department, £70.803 ; Property Tax iJepartmeot, .£8193; misccll.neous, .£12,590. Passed. Class 6-Customs, total, .£69,820. Pa?so<i. Class 7—Commissioner of Stamps, £221,295. Passed.

Arrears of Survey, £9083. Passed. Government Insurance, £20,231. Tasked. Class 4—Minister for Justice vote; department of justice, £1399 ; crown law offices. £2208. Cla3B 4—District Courts and Supremo C;iurt. On the vote for the iiesident Magistrates and Wardens, Mr Finn drew attention to the conduct of Warden Stratford, at Kumara, a-:d moved a

reduction of .£IOO in his salary. Mr Seddon spofte r-trm:gly against the Warden's conduct, which he said was driving the population away from the place. Mr Dick promised to ascertain whether it was true the Warden had disregarded the instructions to him not to hold his Courts at

night. He would not bo al.oweJ to disobey suoh instructions.

Mr Finn withdrew his tcolioa, and (he vote waß passed, aa did also the \-otes for crimin 1 prosecutions, fceß and expenses of inquests, contingencies and prisons.

At 3.15 a.m. progress was reported, and the House adjourned).