GENERAL ASSEMBLY.

Globe, Volume XXII, Issue 1975, 23 June 1880, Page 3

GENERAL ASSEMBLY.

LEGISLATIVE COUNCIL. ( Tuesday, Jtjnb 22. E In the Legislative Council, l . The Hon. G. M. Watbbhousb gave notice > to ask if the Government have authorised « any further inscription of stock, and Sir D. , Belt, to ask if Sir J. Vogel is entitled to any ' commission on the conversion of the last loans. E Beplying to Mr Taiaroa, e The Hon. P. Whitakbb Baid that no Bill t Trill be introduced to authorise Crown grants ' for the Arahura Native Beserves, the existing ! law giving ample power. The Hon. Colonel Whitmobb gave notice < to recommit the Impounding Bill for the , insertion of a provision re trespass on un- < fenced lands. j The Hon. P. Whitakbb laid on the table < the report of the enquiry into the Volunteer ' misconduct at the late review, with all papers ' relative thereto. ' The Hon. Colonel Whitmobb therefore I •withdrew his motion for the enquiry, pro- < mising to reintroduce it if necessary after ' reading the papers. ' The Hon. Colonel Bbbtt said that he had ' important letters on the subject, which he would place in members' hands. ! The "Hon. Mr Manteix moved the second ' reading of the Deceased Wife's Bister i Marriage Bill. ' The Hon. Captain Pbasbb supported the 1 measure. ! The Hon. Colonel Whitmobb opposed the ' Bill in a Bpeech of some length, concluding < by moving that it should be thrown out. ' On a division sixteen voted for the Bill and J twelve against. The roeult was received with ' cheers. The following is the division list: ' Por the Bill-Praser, Waterhouse, Scot- ' land, Miller, Bussell, Kohere, Chamberlain, < Martin, Williamson, Campbell, Wood, Lahman, Brett, Hart, Bichmond, Mantell. ] Against Pharazvn, Peters, Whitmore, Wilson, Beynolds, Dignan, Patterson, J. -Johnston, G. Johnson, Menzies, Whitaker. The Dog Begistration, Brands and Branding Bill and Wellington Baoing Club Bill were passed through Committee. The Hon. Captain Pbasbb gave notice to •ask a question re defective ventilation in the Shag Point coal mine. The Hon. Mr Pjtbbs gave notice to introduce the Deceased Husband's Brother Marriage Bill. [Laughter.] The Council adjourned at 5 p.m. HOUSE OP BEPBESENTATIVES. Tt/bsdat, Jttnb 22. The House met at 2.30 p.m. petition. Messrs Maeandrew, Stewart, Dick, Barron, McLean and Pulton, presented a petition from storekeepers in Otago, praying that the bottle lioense be renewed in the new Licensing Bill, and suggested that with a view of preventing the abuse of the system increased fees be charged, and from residents in Otago, praying for its retention as a great public convenience. NOTICE OF MOTION. Mr Macandbbw gave notice that he would ask if the Government proposed laying on the table a copy of the evidence taken by the Civil Service Commission ; also, the number, character "and amounts of the contracts alleged to have been entered on with a mercantile firm •with whioh the South Island Bailway Commissioner is said to be connected, also if the Commissioner was afforded an opportunity of rebutting the evidence given on the subject. QUESTIONS. Beplying to Mr Murray, The Hon. B. Olitbb said as to what the Public Works Department had done to carry out the recommendation of the Colonial Industries Committee, that the department should endeavor to use in the publio works cement made from materials known to exist in many parts of the colony, that cement had been made from stone got at Taranaki, and found to be valueless. There were no manufactories of cement in New Zealand. Beplying to Mr Murray, The Hon. J. Hah said that the Government would not be justified in incurring the expense of connecting Lovell's Plat railway fUticn with tte telegraph until, M they

| hoped would soon be the case, they could secure the services of a station-master able to work the telegraph. Replying to Mr Murray, The Hon. W. BouiBSTON said the arrangement at present existing as to holding the Court at Tokomairiro was sufficient at present for all purposes, and that a sum of money would be spent on the sohoolhouse for the accommodation of the police. Beplying to Mr Moorhouse, The Hon. B. Olives said that no tender had been accepted for the Oxford and Sheffield railway. It was one of the works which the Government had determined to delay in view of the present condition of the finances.

Beplying to Mr Kelly, The Hon. J. Haii said that the Government intended to ask the House to place a sum of money at their disposal to compensate Mr Jackson, late chief surveyor at Wellington, for loss of office. His dismissal from tho service would also be rescinded, and his resignation accepted. Beplying to Mr Mason, The Hon. W. Boeleston said that it was not the intention of the Government to appoint a separate officer for the vacancy in the Now Zealand Company's Lands Claims Commission, vacant by the resignation of Mr D. Lewis. The office would be attaohed to one of the other offices.

Mr Gkobsi" asked if the Mr H. Houghton, who had been recently appointed superintendent of the Government Insurance Department at Dunedin, is the same person who was gazetted as a bankrupt in the " Otago Daily Times '' on May 4fch, and if he is the same person, whether he has received his discharge from the Court.

The Hon. Major Atkinson replied that the person referred to was one and the same. Mr Houghton had been recommended by the three Dunedin Commissioners. His bankruptcy had been annulled a month before his appointment. Sir W. Fox asked if it is intonded to take any and what steps to recover a sum of £3OO paid to Mr Bees under arrangements made by the late Government, on which the Controller and Auditor-General has reported that it was paid without proper authority, and that the officer paying the same cannot be legally discharged thereof. The Hon. J. Hall replied that tho expense had been incurred prior to last session, when the Public Accounts Committee dealt with the matter. The auditors had reported the course then recommended to be impracticable, and the Government has now taken steps to refer the matter baok to the Publio Accounts Committee.

Replying to Mr Turnbull, The Hon. W. Roiieston said ho had only a general knowledge of the case Regina v. Manning, tried at Timaru in December last, and when he received a report of the proceedings he would consider how far it was advisable that the law as applicable to forgery should be reconsidered with respect to that decision. Replying to Mr Reeves, The Hon. R. Olives said that a most efficient tug boat Bervics existed at Greymouth, and the Government did not intend to subsidise a service in connection with the Grey-Brunner coal line. Replying to Mr Reeves, The Hon. R. Omybb said it was calculated that it would tako £3OO to extinguish the fire in the coal seam near Canoe Creek, Greymouth, and as the quality of the coal was indifferent, it was not deemed advisable to incur the expense. NO-CONFIDENCE DEBATE. The no-confidence debate was resumed by Dr. Walmb, who strongly urgod the admission of females to political privileges, and protested against the growth of protection under the guise of encouraging Native industries. They should insist on free trade, and ' all the other items of the Liberal programme whioh Sir George Grey was the proper man ' to carry out as Premier. The Hon. W. Gisbobnb criticised the various ' political changes whioh oharaoterised the career of the member for Waitemata, Mr Reader Wood. In crying up the credit of the Ministry he cried down the credit of the colony. His speech, read on the Stock Exchange of London, would operate seriously againab the colony. Became the railways and. other publio works undertaken did not return i a certain percentage, they were to be put down. The natural result of such a process of reasoning ' would be that every system, social and political, ' would | be put together with their education schemes, &0., and in fact the hon. , member would end in putting down humanity • itself, simply because it did not return cent. per cent. Whatever errors or accidents in its administration may have occurred, the public I works policy of 1870 wasja greatstatesmanlike- J polioy, and had done much toward the advancement of the colony. The colony, what- ; ever its temporary depression might be, was • sound at heart, and would yet rise superior to temporary difficulties. A saving meant a re- ■ duction in the permanent cost of government, and not a refusal to spend this or that vote authorised by Parliament. He criticised the items set do wn in the estimates|to show that the saving for which the Government took credit ' was chiefly of this class. It meant that certain subsidies had not been paid, but these subsidies would hove to be paid. One might just ' as well grant a promissory note for his debt, ' and then claim that be had effected a money 1 saving. The real saving did not exceed some ' £7OOO or £BOOO in departmental expenses-. That was all, despite the great amount of credit 1 that the Government had taken to itself. He ' was not prepared to say that the terms of the ! conversion of the £5,000,000 Loan were too ; great. Government was not justified, however, in its arrangement for future loans. The arrangement made with the Agent-General was reprehensible. It wag not to the interests ! of tho colony that persons holding an official ■ position should be employed in the conversion of loans. The whole fiscal polioy of tho ' Government was shadowy, and not what the colony demanded at a period like this in its history. Mr Mttbbay defended the property tax as being even less inquisitorial than that of an income tax, in favor of which the other side spoke so strongly. He supported the proposals for local finance on economic principles. Localities if left to their own resources in that way would take good care not to tax higher than was absolutely neoesßary and expend it to the verj best advantage. He approved of the Native lands being taxed, but did not approve of the tax proposed to be levied on Grown lands. The inscription of stock was a most injurious procedure, and was another emendation from the fertile brain of Sir J. Vogel. The debate was interrupted by the 5.30 adjournment. EVENING SITTING. The House resumed at 7.30. NEW MEMBEE. Mr George Jones, introduced by Sir George Grey and Mr Shrimski, took his seat and the oath as member for Waitaki. NO CONFIDENCE DEBATE. The debate on the no-confidence motion was resumed by Mr MvßßAT,|who threw out as a suggestion thas the Government should be empowered to receive proposals for the purchase of the railways, and the stations on the railways. He suggested a'number of proposals by which he thought the financial position of the colony might be improved. Mr Montgomery, said that one point at least was plain from the financial statement viz., that there was a deficit of £250,000 which the Treasurer proposed to turn oyer till next year. He regretted that a question of such serious moment should be dealt with in a party spirit. Last year the Government professed that it had not had time to frame reduced estimates, promising to do so during the reoess. Now they said that the thing would occupy them until next session. Considering the pressing importance of a reduction being made, the subject ought not to have been put off from time to time in this way. All the Treasurer's promises of finanoial reform made last session had been broken. He very strongly condemned the manner in whioh the Government proposed to treat local bodies, and objected especially to the constitution and functions of the Board, which had been defined as one to encourage bribery. He differed from many of his party in thinking that all real property, including improvements, should be taxed. Such a tax would be preferable to either the land tax or the property tax as at present; but if the law was enforced, then certainly i the incomes of those whom it did not reach ) should be taxed also. Referring to the beer • tax, he said he had voted against it two , years ago as an attempt to introduce > an excise, and he would vote against it again. The objection to it being a tax on local industries was mitigated by the duty on im- • ported beer beiDg also raised. The amount 3 proposed to be levied was excessive, but he r would not vote for it or any other tax unless r be saw verj considerable reductions made in

the departmental expenditure. Not £50,000, bnt nearer £200,000 would have to be struck off, irrespective of personal or party feeling. He counselled members to lay asido party spirit and do all they possibly could to assist the colony out of its present difficulties. In the past they had been intoxicated with its prosperity, but those days had gone by and the most rigid economy would be necessary to keep things straight. If the House was true to itself in carrying out that principle, they would yet be able to pull through their difficulties and make things come out light. He rogretted that such a false issue as the present motion had beon raised, but, at the same time, when the motion came to the vote he should feel bound to vote for it.

Mr Hubst took a very gloomy viow of the financial position of tho colony. He argued with Mr Montgomery that all party considerations should be thrown aside in trying to find a remedy. He attributed tho depression under which the colony laboured only to tho two succeeding harvests which turned out bad, the low price of wool together with an indiscriminate system of free immigration. As late as February, 1879, the late Government were sending Home instructions to increase the number of immigrants during the year, and at that time the colony showed symptoms of approaching depression. Ministers had an onerous task cut out, and he believed it would be found that tho seats on tho Government Benches which they all had beon striving to gain, would not be found quite so comfortable a position as was supposed. He had been taunted with having deserted his party. On that occasion his conduct was dictated by a deep sense of duty, and he said now, as he said then, that he was deeply impressed with the position of affairs. Tho imputations against him on that occasion were most unjustifiable and unmerited on his part. He would always be found ready and willing to assist this or any other party to whom he might be attached in an honest endeavour to carry out retrenchment—not a panic retrenchment, but a settled determination to do their work effectually. Mr Satjndbbs said that he sympathised with the amendment, and would espouse it if ho could divest his mind of the idea that its real object was to bring about a change of Government. With the financial proposals brought forward he disagreed, and he hoped that they would bo in many respects modified. What he desired to soe was an honest, earnest desire to remedy the evils brought on by past extravagances. It was roally necessary that a very determined stand should be made against the horde of civil servants by whom they were surrounded. What he would advise was that as a Parliament thoy should vote a moderate amount, and say to the Government you mußt make that suffices for departmental purposes. The position of the colony was such, that any Treasurer who would bring things right again deserved the best thanks they could give him. As far as possible they should aim at utilising the taxing machinery they had at their command, instead of introducing new machinery as they had been doing. The land tax had cost as much for bringing the Act into operation as they got from the tax altogether. He was still of opinion that an income tax would be preferable to the proporty tax. They had heard that complaints had been made tkat the speeches made by mombers would alarm the outside creditors. He for one would always, and on all occasions, take the opportunity of proclaiming tho real state of affairs, and not attempt to sail with borrowed plumes. He hoped that the days of borrowing were over for ever. They must not tax the springs of industry, thoy must be careful that they did not drive away their farmers, sheep owners, and miners from their shores. The undesirability of exempting shipping had been talked of. He could imagine no tax that would be more injurious ; it would operate indirectly on almost every source of induatry, and on every artiole of consumption. Begarding what they could tax, he mentioned land, so as to make it touch the improvements as little as possible. Then again, they might tax accumulated wealth, furniture, carriages, <fcc, but when they attempted to tax machinery, the agency by which wealth was producod, they attempted a very dangerous experiment. He believed in taxing the professions. It would bo all the better if there were fewer lawyers amongst them, and also fewer parsons so that they might all be able to meet for devotional purposes without being pestered with those nice theological distinctions by which they were kept apart from each other. Then there were the doctors. He thought they would be better if there wore none of them at all. Of course he did not refer to surgeons. Another feature he did not like in tho proposals was that the subsidies payable to local bodies were not resolutely taken to be used by the colony in its almost penniless condition. These subsidies were certainly promised for five years, but he did not care. Although thoy had been promised for thirty years, they could not possibly be afforded. He did not like the proposal to tax Crown lands. He hoped they would bring down no more grand schemes. They should bring down honest proposals for retrenchment, otherwise they would drive the wealth producing classes from their shores, and the end would be repudiation and general disaster. It would be easy to drive half the people out of the oolony, and the other half could not bear the burden.

Mr Bbid said that instead of seeing the property tax continued he would favor an income tax, an extension of the land tax, or even an extension of Customs duties on luxuries. He did not agree with those who held that those sources were already taxed to their utmost limits. It was said that the tendenoy of increasing the Customs would bo to induce smuggling, but he certainly did not hold with that opinion. He did not think that the Treasurer had grasped the subject as he ought to have done. It would bo a mistake to think of reducing Ministers' salaries ; any change should be in the direction of reducing the number of Ministers. The constitution of the Legislative Council -was a matter which would have to engage the attention of the country. Last year 424 guineas were paid to members of that Chamber. The case of the Assembly was different. A Legislative Councillor was elected for life, wheroas they had oaly a limited term of ofllce. Then again, the legislative Council was a wealthy body, and as such it was wholly uniuatifiable to pay them. The Property Tax was condemned by all political writers as opposed to the progress and general welfare of the colony. It was a tax on industry and the agencies by which industrial pursuits were carried on. That tax was calculated to drivo away capital from their shores. Those who suffered by the tax were men of enterprise and men of thrift. He next referred to the various Boyal Commissions. He at first thought their appointment wrong, but since he saw the report of the Civil Service Commission he had changed his mind. The Government were bound to follow up that report. There was a great number in the service who could be well dispensed with. He also believed that the Native Industries would be a valuable report, but he had no faith in the Bailway Commission. He complained of the gold-mining interest being neglected. The Greymouth-Hokitika railway was not even kept steadily in view, and other West Coast works were similarly ignored. On Mr Macandbbw's motion the debate was adjourned till after the questions had been replied to to-morrow, and the Houbo rose at 11.15.