GENERAL ASSEMBLY.

Globe, Volume XXI, Issue 1762, 13 October 1879, Page 3

GENERAL ASSEMBLY.

HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES. Feiday, Octobbe 10. The following is the concluding portion of Friday’s proceedings, as reported in the “ New Zealand Times ” : The House resumed at 7.30. Mr Kbiby resumed the debate. He thought it was very evident that the Government should have time given them to enunciate a policy, and he deprecated obstructive tactics on the part of the Opposition. He wanted to know what the financial and land policies of the new Government were, and thought he should not bo called upon to pronounce judgment upon the Government before their policy was known. He referred to the unsettled state of affairs at the West Coast, and thought Native affairs should bo dealt with with a firm hand. He appealed to hon. gentlemen to act in an independent manner in voting upon the question, and not to be deluded by either side. Mr Aoton Adams pointed out that the result of the general election had been against the Government, and the hon. member for Port Chalmers should accept that verdict, and not waste the time of the country further. He thought the Government should have an opportunity of -showing what their policy was. Ho deprecated the idea of the motion being treated as one of no confidence, for it did not express anything cf the kind. He contendad for a fair trial being given to tho now Government. Ho had never seen or read of sueh an improper proceeding as tabling a notice of a want of confidence motion before the new Ministers had taken their seats. [Hear, hear.] He quoted from authorities in support of the contention that no vote of want of confidence should be given until a fair trial had been granted Ministers. He thought now or never, when all parties were agreed upon the subject, was the time for passing liberal measures. He thought the question being debated should be treated as a matter of principle and not one of party. How would members explain their conduct to their constituents if they voted against the second reading of the Triennial Parliaments Bill ? If they voted for the postponement of the measure they would have something to answer for, and he hoped members would carefully consider tho subject before doing so. It was a sham and a delusion to say that the new Government had no intention of carrying out Liberal measures. The Hon. Mr

Hall had brought down one of the most important measures of the liberal programme, and the speaker would not be a party to putting that hon. member’s Government out of office until he saw whether they were m earnest over these measures or not. Mr Saunders spoke against the adjournment, and said he would take no part in ohitructional proceedings, but he had risen to offer his vote to one party or the _ other. They had heard Ministers desired to investigate certain matters which were said to be discreditable to the late Government, and late Ministers said, “ Let us get back into office before you are are able to do bo. m Me (Mr Saunders) thought it waa discreditable that Ministers should not be allowed to investigate those charges. The late Government, if they were honest, should give them every opportunity of fully investigating the matter, and making them either prove what they said or retract it, [Hear, hear.] Ho concluded by saying that he for one would give Ministers every opportunity of fully enquiring into the matter, and if they could not prove what they said, his vote would go against them. [Applause.] The question was then put to the vote, and was about to be declared by the Speaker when Mr Wakbeibld rose to address the House, but the Speaker ruled teat ho had risen too late. The House then divided on the question that the debate be adjourned, with the following result:— Axes—3B. Messrs Andrews Messrs McDonald Ballance Montgomery Barron Pyke Brown Beeves Bunny Eeid DeLautour Seddon Finn Sheehan (teller) J. B. Fisher Shephard J, T. Fisher Shrimski George (teller) Speight Gisborne Stewart Sir G. Grey Swanson Messrs Hamlin Tainni Harris Tawhai Hislop Te Wheoro Hutchison Thomson Ireland Tole London Turnbull Macaudrew Wood Noes—36. Messrs Adams Messrs McCaughan Allwright Moorhonse Atkinson Murray (teller) Bain Oliver Beetham 1 1 Pitt Bowen ' Bichmond Brandon Bolleston Bryce Saunders Fulton Seymour Gibbs Stevens Hall Sutton Hirst Tomoana Hurstbonso Trimble Johnston Wakefield Kelly Whitaker Kenny _ (teller) Levin Willis Masters Wright McLean j Pairs. For— I Against— Messrs Colbeck I White Wallis I Driver Moss I Dick Shanks I Mason Hurst J Studholme The result was received with cheers by the Opposition. The Hon. John Hall said that two gentlemen had just entered the House who were supporters of the Government, hut who had not been present during the division, and who were not paired. Mr Allwriqht rose in explanation of his vote against the adjournment, on the ground that he was pledged to support the Triennial Parliaments Bill. When, however, the motion of want of confidence was brought forward by the member for Port Chalmers, he would probably vote for it.

The Hon. J. Shbbhan moved that the debate be adjourned until Tuesday next, and in doing so his party intended to give the Ministry fair play. [lronical cheers.]

Mr Waxekeid then rose to address the House, and in doing so referred in ironical terms to the number of members of the great Liberal party who had stopped his mouth before the division. The member for Akaroa had shouted, “ No, you can’t speak now,” os if he was afraid he (Mr Wakefield) was going to say something shocking about him. [Laughter.] He then referred to a speech of Sir George Grey’s, in which that hon. gentleman had said that if he found there was a majority of members against him after the election he would not wait for the meeting of the House, hut would at once resign, so that the new men might get to work as speedily as possible. When he heard Sir George say this he felt that there was still something in that hon. gentleman that he could admire, and his heart warmed towards him. He thought Sir George Grey by doing this would be setting a bright example, which ought to be followed by all public men in the future. [Mr Wakefield here complained of the interruptions of the member for Auckland City East, Mr Speight.] Order having been restored, ho proceeded to say that upon the meeting of Parliament he had felt that Sir George Grey was going to carry out this pledge when the amendment was moved to the Address in Reply, but he now found, judging from the present tactics of Sir George’s party, that they were not prepared to carry out that view. He referred to what appeared to be the disorganised state of the Opposition, as they appeared to have several leaders, and each was jealous of the other. Every dog had his day, and every leader of the Opposition should be allowed to have his day. He quoted from a speech of Mr Sheehan’s made two years ago, to the effect that the order of Government business should not be interfered with; and also quoted from other sayings of the same hon. gentleman to the effect that it was unwise to stop public business in order to press forward a want-of-confidence motion. The hon. gentleman had gone right round the compass since then, and now appeared to hold opinions exactly the opposite, but he (Mr Wakefield) thought now as he had always done upon the subject. He referred to the fact that some members who had voted for his party on the no-confidence vote, who had attended the caucuses of the party, and who had even been present at their banquet—[laughter]—were now voting on the other side. Ho said,'however, that those members would come back again were the same consideration offered them as that which had made deserters of them. Referring especially to one hon. member, Mr Wakefield said he would oscillate between the two parties until his political career came to an ignominious termination. He thought the result of the elections was pretty conclusive. The late Government got a dissolution under extraordinary circumstances, and the elections, carried on under their auspices, had resulted in a majority being returned against them. The House had the measures and policy of the late Government before it for two years, and knew as much about them as it was likely to know. He referred to the course taken by the Government which preceded the Stafford Government, and was proceeding to enlarge upon the subject, when

The Spbakbe drew the hon. member’s attention to the fact that he was travelling away from the subject. Mr Wakefield bowed to the ruling of the Speaker, but said he was happy to believe that his observations had been so far interesting as to have led the Speaker to listen to them for so long a time while they were out of order. Ho continued to say that the present Ministry had been entrusted with the power of carrying on the business of the country, and they should not be obstructed. The reason for the violent course taken by the Opposition was because they knew that in a week hence they would have no majority, for by that time the spirit of fair play would assert itself in a number of the present members of the Opposition. Ministers wore not the men ho took them to be if they were going to be jockeyed, and they should not “budge” from their seats until it suited them. He was however sure that the hon, member for Selwyn would not stay in office in the face of an adverse vote, but he would hold office until he had had an opportunity of bringing down his policy. He had observed with regret that some of the gentlemen in that House had lent themselves to absolute obstruction, although he was not surprised to find such conduct in other hon. members. Had every member acted as conscientiously as the member for Lyttelton, the Bill which was now being obstructed would have passed. Mr Speight thought if gentlemen were sincere in their desire to carry on the business of the country, they should have the question at once decided of who should occupy the Ministerial benches. The other side asked for a fair trial for Ministers —a fair trial for what ? Why, to mutilate the measures of the late Government, and make them so that their own sponsors would not know them. In reply to Mr Wakefield, he said the Oppo-

sition were not in a disorganised state, as would be inferred from his remark about the several leaders of the Opposition. He thought it only required the proper inducement to be held out to the hon. member for Geraldine to find him in the ranks of the Opposition to-morrow. If the hon. member thought that because members had put their legs under the same mahogany with members of the Opposition they were bound to vote with them, he (MrSpeight) thought they were mistaken. He hoped hon. members would not be intimidated by the threats of the hon. member not to give them any more invitations if they did not vote for the Government, but that they would vote according to their convictions, irrespective of such considerations. Speaking of the Bill before the House, he said the Opposition were determined it should become law this session. In regard to what had fallen from a previous speaker, he could only say that his (Mr Speight’s) party were not prepared to swallow his faults with, his virtues.

Mr ROM.E3TON said it was perfectly clear that the late Ministry decidedly declined to admit that they were prepared to join any coalition, or submit to any reconstruction. That had been distinctly stated. The hon. gentleman denied the accusation which had been brought against the member for Bruce. He (Mr Rolleston) had long known and fought alongside of Mr Murray, and for two years had found him a good party man, and a man who had a clear conception of his duty. Mr Stewaet said that his vote was perfectly in accord with his conscience. _ He came to Parliament with the distinct intention of voting against and endeavoring to oust the late Premier. He would not commit himself to any definite course for the future. He claimed the right, as soon aa the want of confidence was taken, to support any man whom he thought fit to lead the House. He thought it was the duty of Mr Hall to have confessed his inability to construct a Ministry. He objected to precedents being quoted. He considered that the voice of the House was supreme, and was not bound by any precedent. He was sorry to hear threats which might be fortified by extraneous expressions of opinion regarding what might or might not be done under certain circumstances. Mr Mtjbeay defended himself from the aspersions cast upon him. Mr Macahdesw hoped that hon. members would allow the adjournment to take place without further discussion. This was agreed to, and the House adjourned at 9.30 p m.