POST-SESSIONAL UTTERANCES

Globe, Volume VIII, Issue 832, 22 February 1877, Page 2

POST-SESSIONAL UTTERANCES

MR. L. C. J. AT CHRISTCHURCH. The following is the conclusion of our report of Mr Stevens’s speech ; Now, gentlemeu, this is the explanation why we find no balance, and a very considerable deficit, or at least that we are not in the state we ought to be. Railways were required as quick as possible by the various localities, were in fact clamoured for, and we went in to do them in a reckless manner. 1 don’t acquit the Government of the day of the responsibility of this. It is not my intention, nor have I the inclination, on this occasion to discuss whether Sir Julius Vogel was in fault or who was. I hold that the Government of the day, as the guardians of the public purse and leaders of opinion in the House, should have resisted the clamour for railways,|and the consequent increase of burdens on the public purse which it was hardly able to bear. [Cheers J They ought to have put their foot down, and even if it entailed upon them loss of office, they should have said it should not take place. [Cheers] That is my opinion. [Renewed cheers.] Sir Julius Vogel and his colleagues were in a position to know what the actual state of affairs was better than any one could, and I say that if it w as necessary for them to go out of office, consequent on the unpopularity of their refusal to push on the scheme, they ought to have done it as the guardians of the public purse, at the sacrifice of their place. [Cheers.] But they did not do it, and we have got to go on with the railways and make them productive. It is no good crying over spilt milk. [Cheers.] Now, gentlemen, having said that there is no balance, and that in future we shall have to keep our financial arrangements within limit, I will gn on to show what has been done, what amount has been charged on the Land Fund, and why it is done. There is a large amount of departmental expenditure charged to the Land Fund. There is tbc Crown Lands Department itself of course, education for the current six months, the surveys, interest on old Provincial permanent debts, the subsidies to Road Boards, .".ho £1 for £1 on general rates collected, and I per cent on the amount spent In each province by the Government on the railways. I'here is also the Hospitals, Charitable Aid, md a number of other things, making altogether the large sum of some £115,000 odd tor the six months. Now, if we except this province, there ia no large land fund even in chose which are said to be able to pay their •vay. One point about this expenditure to which I desire to call attention is that it is charged locally. It is alffiutely necessary to charge this sooty, aw<J it baa tbe jjugu*

liarity of keeping up the Provincial system of finance, and shewing how each province fails to pav up. Wellington and Nelson shew a deficiency; Hawke’s Bay a small one, though perhaps it may be made to cover its ? liability ; Marlborough comes nest, with a jj considerable deficiency ; and Westland and thereat it is considered may be able to pay their way. The amount of the deficiency comes to £146,593 in six months, and this we have to 'face next session, as well as the deficiency which, as f have said, I think will be found in the Customs. Therefore, I say that, when we go up to Wellington this next session, we shail find a deficiency of £200,000 or £250,000 on the whole year. Some people think it will be more even than this. Some say that the Customs will be worse and that the Land Revenue will run out worse than was anticipated by the Colonial Treasurer. At any rate, we cannot estimate what will be the total result until the end of the year, This unsatisfactory position, for I cannot call it anything else, I believe arises out of involving the colony in large liabilities before any revenue accrued from the railways, and the expenditure, which has been so unduly inflated from the expensive habits which have been indulged in during the past few years. [Hear, hear.] But when we come back we are told that we ought to have done something different to what we did do in getting this finance matter kept within bounds. Home persons have gone so far as to tay that we had the ball at our feet, and could have got what we liked. Now, gentlemen, it is very pleasant to have the ball at one’s foot, but I don’t happen to remember when we—that is, the Hon Mr Stafford, my bon friend the member for Akaroa, and myself—had it so; if we had no doubt we should have done differently. Let us just look fora moment or two at the things which we might have done. First, we might have made the land revenue common stock ; that is, we might have put the revenue of Canterbury and Otago into one purse, with the small remnant of the other provinces. But, gentlemen, I don’t think this would have pleased you—[Hear, bear] —and I am sure it wouldnothavedoae me. [Hear, hear.] Even had we done so it would have answered no purpose and would not have equalled the deficiency. Put aside this expedient and let me come to the next point, that of retrenchment. When you come to recollect that the greater part of the session, some three months, was occupied with the opposition to the abolition proposals, you will see at once that this could not be done then. The greater part of the financial year had expired, and if we desired to dispense with the services of officers under Government notice must have been given. Retrenchment in expenditure takes time to effect, particularly a considerable one in Government departments. The Government undertook, and it was urgently enjoined upon them, to proceed with the work of retrenchment before next session. This expedient, therefore, could not be taken by us, except so far as that the Government undertook next session to come down with considerable reductions, especially as regards defence. Another expedient, but one which I for one did not care, for reasons I will give further on, to go on with at that time, was to cutoff the subsidies to Road Boards and Municipalities, which would considerably reduce the deficiency. But, gentlemen, the question arose in my mind whether this was a just expedient, and I also considered that my constituents should be informed of what was intended, and their views learned before taking it. | Cheers.] It seemed to me that it would be a exceedingly high handed pro ceeding to calmly take off the £1 for £1 subsidy—[cheers]—and one which nothing short of absolute necessity would have induced me to take. [Cheers.] Had an absolute necessity arisen, I migut have done it ; but I incline to think that in «n ordinary case it was only right that my constituents should have notice of a considerable reduction being about to be made in revenue now coming in—[Hear, hear] —a reduction however which must come. I believe before long that the Colonial Treasurer, whoever bo may be—it may be Major Atkinson or anyone else—[laughter]—will have to make Is 6d out of Is, or take away this revenue. If the alternative were presented to me of putting on a fresh tax or parting with the subsidies to Road Boards and municipalities, I should think it my duty to the public purse to part with the subsidies. [ Cheers. | I say this plainly, and want you to understand it, so that there need be no misunderstanding if it should ever be my painful duty to do so. [Hear, bear, and laughter,] My worthy friend the Mayor says he hopes it will not come to that. He meajp.3, I suppose, that it will not come to a fresh tax. [Laughter ] I am not to-night enunciating any high principles of finance ; it is simply a matter of business. Well, gentlemen, you will see that here were three expedients to meet the difficulty, none of which could be adopted for the reasons I have stated. Another proposition was that the Government should come down with a proposition to impose an income or property tax. But, gentlemen, what would you say if they came down and said, “ There must be an income or property tax to the amount of £BOO,OOO this year, and so on next year to keep the fi a an ce-straight.” I think if a tax is to be imposed, it should not only come after the concurrence of the legislature is obtained, and after it bad been carefully and thoughtfully weighed by it but also after the people had considered it and its bearing upon the various classes and industries of the community. [Hear, bear.] Now we had no time to do this; it could not be done. At the time I was contesting the election for this constituency I was asked what kind of a tax I thought it best to put on in case of increased taxation being found to be ueces sary. I said at that time that while I hoped it would not bo necessary to increase taxation, I thought that if it were so, the best kind of tax would be a mixed one ; that is, on shares, land, &c. [Cheers.] I entertain the same opinion still, and I think that, in view of the growing industrial resources of the colony, it is better that the day of increased taxation should be nut off Let us wait and see how much the railway extensions entered iuto as I have said hastily, and without due regard to the burdens imposed thereby—will produce. I am sorry to have detained you so long on this part of my address, and Jn so dry a subject, but I have endeavored to make it as plain to you as possible; but 1 think 1 have shown you that we must have and that shortly too, a general squaring up ot accounts. Not only must we consider the subjects of audit and control, but we shall have to consider the whole subject of our revenue and expenditure, and to do so by a better light than wo had last session. The

Government of the day next session will have to give us better finance. [Cheers.] So little of a party man am I that I say that Govei'nment which will bring before us a e'ear and lucid policy of finance, and one which will put that and all matters relating to the general welfare of the colony on the broadest basis, shall have my support. [Cheers. | I will now, gentlemen, touch upon one or two more general matters, and also upon some of local interest. The Friendly Societies Bill which we had before us last session, was one which deeply interests most of you I know. It passed through the Lower House, but we found that new discoveries, or I may say new phases of the law relating to Friendly Societies, had been discovered at home, and therefore it was thought better to defer the matter until the next session, so as to enable us to put into the Bill the latest improvements in the law which had been discovered from the working of the large societies in England. Another measure in which I took intense interest, to the extent of working all day and sitting up late at night, was the Municipal Corporations Act, and 1 am glad to see that it has met with the approval of those who have the administration of it. The Rating Bill, another social measure, I also took an in tereat in. Having briefly touched upon these points, let me say a few words upon another, that of the constitution of Compensation Courts under the Act for taking land for railway purposes. It always seemed to me that the constitution of those Courts was very objectionable. I did not think that the constitution of these Compensation Courts was fair to the person whose land was to be taken, and in the new Public Works Act we have introduced a principle, which I think is far fairer, as it provides for arbitration, the party whose land is to be taken and the Government appointing one arbitrator each, a Judge of the Supreme Court to be the referee. This, I think, is by far a fairer way than before. (Cheers.) Now, gentlemen, a few words as to the Piako Swamp. You have no doubt heard and read enough about this matter, but I told you when I was before you for election that I wanted to hear more about this as a public representative. What I say is this—that the Government made an administrative mistake, and that the advice given by Dr Pollen should have been taken by them. That was that the opinion of experienced persons in the neighbourhood should have been taken as to the value of the land, and upon their report it should have been sold or not, as the circumstances warranted. I don’t therefore accuse the Government of jobbery. They made a mistake. But the proposal made, I think by an Otago member, to pay back the money paid with interest and take back the land,'was, to my mind, highly unsatisfactory, The persona who had possession of it had been so for some three years, and had spent a lot of money, and therefore it seemed to me to be an error to entertain such a proposition as the one I have referred to. Sir George Grey and his party however endeavored to make this a party question, which I could not see. If the Government had committed a land job I should have voted against them, and whether they were Provincialists, Centralists, or any other ists, if they had been a corrupt Government my vote would be against them. [Cheers] Believing this to be an administrative mistake, I gave the Governvernment the opportunity of taking all the blame of it, but I could not go to the length of voting for turning them out of office for committing a mistake only. This was my opinion; an opinion I arrived at after consultation with others, and after I had carefully considered the case in all its bearings. [Cheers.] Now, gentlemen, I come to a favorite subject of mine, and one which I believe will also ere long be a favorite one with you too. I refer to the question of triennial parliaments. Gentlemen, I say they are a public necessity in this country. The rapid growth of county, city and town, the covering of the swamps and desert places of these islands with homes, which has been going on of late years, necessitates our political institutions being as elastic as possible, and I say I would rather come before you once in three years than once in five. [Cheers. | If a constituency has a difference with its member on a question of public policy, the sooner they have it out the better, and if it ig not able to be arranged satisfactorily, they will be all the better for a change. [Cheers. | A Bill of this nature was introduced during the last session, andf will show you here that I am not a party man. I supported Sir George Grey in this, and should vote with any one whose opinions were not exactly at one with my own, if at any time they came within the scope of my views. [Cheers.] We were beaten by the previous question being carried, but I shall vote for it again; and if I sit for twenty years for this constituency I shall always vote for Triennial Parliaments whenever the question arises. [Hear, hear.] I give you this pledge unasked, and I shall redeem it whenever an opportunity occurs. Now I want to say a word or two regarding myself, and I will be brief. While I was in Wellington it was said that I made a bid for the office of Colonial Treasurer. The form which this proposal tqok, so far as I could gather, jyas that I had proposed that the children of Auckland should be educated. Now, gentlemen, if the children of Auckland required education, I should do so again, and . in doing so 1 should be in accord with you. At the election you said that primary education should be extended throughout the colony from one end to the other, hence I was but carrying out what you desired to see done. Therefore if you see this statement repeated again in print or elsewhere, you will know that I was doing what you wished me to do, and will take it at what it is worth, [Cheers,] Now a word as to the present Government. No doubt the present Government has been burdened with and has had to take much of the blame attaching to the late Government under command of Sir Julius Vogel. I have no time, nor will I detain you to go into a discussion of the question, That the Government committed grave errors there is no doubt, and also that some of the gentlemen on the Government Bench participated in these errors. But the, question is this—can you get a Government containing better administrative talent than the one now in power / The Colonial Treasurer, Major Atkinson, has deservedly achieved a high reputation, and I have no hesitation in saying is of great value to the country [Hear, hear.] You can always depend upon what he says, which is plain and straightforward. If he makes a mistake, he will tell you next day that he has done so. There is no public man that I know—and I have, had some little experience—who is more straightforward or clear in hia statements ; and though he does not mix up figures in an elaborate manner, be has a good and solid

knowledge of the finance of the colony, which is what is wanted. Mr Ormond, who is in charge of the Public Works department, is a manof considerableadministrativebdcnt, and one whodesemdly commands high respect. Mr Donald Reid, who has recently joined the Ministry is a man who has made his mark, and who will be a great acquisition to the councils of the colony. \ Hear, hear.] I say therefore that we should pause before getting rid of a Government such as this, unless they commit graver faults than they have done, or it is likely they will do. lam not one to rail against the Government. I say that we should get the best Government we can for the colony, and give all an opportunity of getting on. [Cheers. | The fact is that there are no parties now. Abolition has removed all that, and it was perfectly free to us working with the Government to act in opposition if we felt it right to do so, but I do not think it would be fair to do this so long as the Government conduct finance properly. Since the removal of the incubus of provincialism we have to consider, not only the great subject of finance, but the question of the departments of Government from one end of the colony to the other. lam not despondent of (he future of the colony ; far from it, and I hope the Government will be able to deal with the weighty and important matters before it. I trust that every effort they make towards retrenchment, and the placi g of the finances of the colony on a more solid basis, together with any measures for the general good, will meet with cordial support from every colonist of New Zealand. [Loud and continued cheering, j His Worship the Mayor asked if any gentleman desired to put a question to Mr Stevens.

Captain Wilson said there was one question of considerable importance upon which he desired to hear the views of Mr Stevens, It was what he thought as regarded a change in the constitution of the Upper House. Did Mr Stevens think it should be elective or otherwise 1

Mr Stevens—l am very glad Captain Wilson has asked the question. It wag put to me at the time of my election, and I then stated that I thought that it would conduce to the best interests of the colony if the Legislative Council was an elective body. I adhere to the same opinion still, but with this reservation, that we cannot afford to part with old and experienced politicians from our House. If the Legislative Council were elective, you would tind Mr Stafford and other gentlemen of experience migrating to the cooler shades of the Upper House, where the work would be lighter and the power greater. In fact, you would find, if I may use the expresssion, the strongest birds taking wing thither. The public would thus be deprived of the services of men whose longexperience and political knowledge would be invaluable. If there was a greater chance of public men coming forward, or we had a wider selection, I should not make this reservation, and would say let us make the Upper House elective. My idea is that if the Upper House be made elective it should be co equal in power with the Lower. I don’t see if it is made elective why it should not have all the power of reviewing the financial measures of the Government in the same way as the Lower House. I see no object in making it elective, unless it has. One of the audience asked Mr Stevens whether he thought fresh taxation would be required. Mr Stevens—l arn very glad that the gentleman has reminded me, by his question, of a part of my speech which I omitted to refer to. Sir Julius Yogel’s first proposition was to raise a loan of two millions, which would enable us to proceed with the construction of an increased amount of public works, but—and here I think we can take some credit to ourselves—we were able to get the Government to reduce that, so that one million only should be borrowed. That million will not be borrowed in London this year, and 1 hope it will not next. We shall of course have to go ou the London market at some time with our bonds, but I hope that the rest which we shall be enabled to give to our colonial credit will put us in a position to make a better appearance. It came to the knowledge of some members of the House that the confidential agents of the Government at home were of opinion that it woufd be an unfavorable period to put our bonds upon the market, and they therefore wisely refrained from doing so. I have examined the figures relative to the amount necessary to complete the railways, and I find that we shall have about £400,000 to go on with at the end of the year, which can be appropriated towards the works mentioned in the schedule of the Act. This, together with the whole appropriation remaining, would give us an amount of £l-133,000, which would be required to complete the works Whether we shall require more money will depend upon the decision of the House as to the construction of more railways. I consider that now we should complete communication with the commercial centres, but has come when we must draw in our expenditure, and put it altogether on a more sound footing. [Cheers] His Worship the Mayor asked if any further questions had to be put to Mr Stevens.

Mr William Montgomery, who, on rising, was received with loud cheers, said—As one of Mr Stevens’s constituents, he had very much pleasure in pcoposing,a cordial vote of thanks to him for his able and lucid address that evening, They had in Mr Stevens not only a sound politician but a member who could not be bought, [Cheers,] He raight take oflice at some future time, but it would not be for money. It would be irom a laudable desire to eerv-0 his generation. [Loud cheers.] It was a great thing for Christchurch that they hai sash a member, and one also who possessed their entire confidence. He begged to move—“ That this meeting desires to record a cordial and hearty vote of thanks to Mr Stevens for his able and lucid address this evening, and begs to assure him of their entire confidence in him as thei? representative, j Cheers. 1 Captain Wilson seconded the motion, which was carried unanimously, amid loud cheers.

Mr Stevens said he desired to thank them for the cordial manner in which they had passed the resolution. He could assure them, and it was no mere figure of speech, that he felt most deeply this mark of their confi deuce, tio loug as he had health it would be his highest ambition to serve them in Parliament, and it was the height of bis ambition to possess the confidence of thatconstiluencv and to represent them in the Parliament ol the colony. [Cheers.] A vote of thanks to the Mityor, proposed by Mr Steveue, concluded the paeetiug.