GENERAL ASSEMBLY.

Globe, Volume VI, Issue 623, 17 June 1876, Page 3

GENERAL ASSEMBLY.

(Per Press Agency .) HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES. Friday, June 16. The Speaker took the chair at 2 p.m. MEMBERS SWORN IN. The following members were sworn in— Messrs Carrington, Reader Wood. Ballance, Gibbs, J. Kelly, Macfarlane, and Baigent. PETITIONS. Petitions were received with respect to the Bast Coast and Thames and Bast Coast Maori electoral district. NOTICES OF MOTION. 1 A number of notices of motion were given and papers laid upon the table, and Sir B. Douglas gave notice that he would move the address in reply. (Mr Bastings seconds it), PIAKO SWAMP. Sir G. Grey moved that the standing orders be suspended, in order that the following notice of motion be given, namely—- “ That the Government be requested no. to sanction the sale of any lands, or take any steps whatever under the Orders in Council of the 12th of June, 1876, published in the Gazette, making regulations for the sale of certain lands known as the Piako Swamp until the House had an opportunity of discussing the said Orders in Council.” It was not his intention to discuss the legality or illegality of the sale. Be merely wished to prevent a great public wrong being done beyond repair. Mr Stout seconded the motion. Sir J. Vogel said it was a most 'unusual time to make such a motion. There was no desire to evade discussion on the question, but there was plenty of time yet. Mr Macandrew wanted an assurance from the Government that no action would - be taken towards completing the sale for the present. . Sir J. Vogel said the matter had been dealt with by the Crown in the ordinary course, and anything that could be said could not affect the matter. After some discussion a division was called for with the following result : Ayes 3 7 Noes 28 Majority for 9 AYES, Mr Baigent Mr Macandrew „ Barflf „ Macfarlane „ Bastings „ Montgomery „ Brandon „ Murray „ J. 0. Brown „ Nahi „ Bunny „ O’Rorke „ Burns „ Rees „ Button „ Rowe „ Curtis „ Seaton '* „ DeLautour „ Shrimski „ Dignan „ Stevens „ Fisher „ Stout Sir G. Grey ~ Swanson Mr Hamlin „ Tole „ Joyce „ Thomson „ Kennedy „ Wakefield „ Larnach „ Wason „ Lusk „ R. Wood „ W. Wood NOES. Mr Andrew Sir Donald McLean „ Atkinson Mr G. McLean „ Ballance „ Moorhouse ~ Bowen „ Murray- Ayns ley „ Carrington „ Pyke „ Cox „ Reynolds „ Fitzroy „ Richardson „ Gibbs „ Richmond „ Henry „ Seymour ~ Hunter „ Sharp „ Hursthouse ~ Stafford „ Johnston „ Tawhiti ~Kelly „ Teschemaker „ Manders Sir J. Vogel Sir G. Grey moved the resolution itself.

Mr Stout seconded it. Sir J. Vogel said there appeared to be some misunderstanding in the matter. Government were quite prepared to go into the whole question, as they held themselves responsible for what had been done ; but they wanted no unfair action to be taken. If defeated, they would be in a position usually occupied by Governments who suffered a defeat. He assured the House, however, there was no necessity for precipitancy, as the question would be in precisely the same position it was now, in ten days’ time.

Mr Macandeew regretted that the Premier had not made this explanation before. Hon C. C. Bowen said it was placing the Ministry in an unfair position. It was in a manner like taking a snap shot at them. Mr Bees asked why should the Government attempt to smuggle the matter by a Gazette that some of their own supporters had not seen. He maintained that every single regulation iu connection with this

matter had been deliberately violated. He believed he was correct in stating that only within the last few weeks several thousands of acres of very valuable land adjoining the Piako Swamp had been sold. If the arrangement were just, no doubt both sides of the House would join in affirming the action of the Government. If not they would set their foot upon it, even should it involve the resignation of Ministers. Mr Button said he had heard such charges made against the Government in this matter that it was only fair to them that a thorough investigation be made. 'lf the charges were well founded Government deserved a severe reprobation ; if not, those who made such charges merited the keenest censure. He felt certain Government could give an explanation of their conduct, but although a Government supporter he would not countenance anything;that he could not see to the bottom of,and he therefore desired there should be no hoodwinking, and the whole matter ventilated, He hoped Sir G. Grey would accept the suggestion made, and postpone the matter, as many of the new arrivals in the House were without any information on the point. Hon Major Atkinson said that the remarks of the last speaker j ustified the attitude taken by the Premier. While admitting to a leaning towards the Government he was yet so influenced by lobby rumors that he as well as other followers of the Government believed the mere ex parte statements of the leader of the Opposition and had defeated the Government on the first division of the session. This motion struck at the very foundation of the Ministry, and made the question resolve itself into this—that the Ministry were or were not fit to administer the)ordinary departmental affairs of the country. Though he was in no way connected with the transaction, he had examined into it, and was prepared to say that no Government could, under the circumstances, have made a better bargain. He wished the house distinctly to understand that he would delay nothing in connection with the preparation of the Crown Grant, because of the motion of the leader of the Opposition. Mr Wakefield entirely dissented from the view taken by the Minister for Immigration, that many members had voted against the Ministry because of what had been said in the lobbies or by the leader of the Opposition. What really influenced them was the want of information, and had the Government afforded at once the information they had subsequently, the motion would not have been put, or if put, the majority would have, been reversed. He hoped the motion would be withdrawn, as it was impossible they could (get such a good discussion upon the subject at this point. Mr Joyce hoped the motion would be pressed to a division, especially after the defiant attitude of the Minister for Immigration. Mr Mason explained that he voted for the motion solely because he wanted more information upon this matter, and to which were attached some grave charges and very ugly rumors. Although he would be found a Government supporter upon the main question of policy he still hoped they would give an assurance that the matter would not be gone on with for a few days at any rate. Messrs Fisher and Labnach spoke in favour of the motion.

Mr Sharp thought the mode in which motion was put placed 3 false issue before the House.

Mr Seymour thought the last speaker hit the blot properly, for the motion seemed to him to be putting Ministers upon their trial, and with a vengeance. If the action of this sale were illegal there were ways of upsetting it, and of making the Ministry suffer for any misdoing, but it was very unwise to begin interfering at that early period of the session with what was purely departmental. Mr Swanson quoted from the journals of the House, to show that the Government had given the House the assurance that they would bring down a Bill to legalise • the Piako sale.

Mr Montgomery would not have voted for the motion if the Premier had given the explanation when first asked, that he did afterwards. He hoped the motion would be withdrawn on the assurance of the Premier that the matter would be in the same position ten or twelve days hence. Mr Wood said, according to an understanding come to last session, the matter was to be held in abeyance until the new Parliament had an opportunity for considering the whole matter. [“ Oh, oh,” from Ministerial benches.] Here was a case where the money was paid and a Crown grant to be issued in a fortnight after. Who out of the many of them who bought Government land had ever obtained a Crown grant in a fortnight? Nor did he think this Crown grant likely to be issued in the time named, and the member for Auckland City West might make his mind easy on that point and withdraw his motion. Sir Donald McLean said a very thorough investigation was made last session, and the report acquitted the Government of all blame; but notwithstanding the severe and exhaustive investigation, Government were still prepared to face an inquiry, and stand by every action of theirs in connection with this transaction. Mr Db Lautour referred to the report to show that it was susceptible of a very different interpretation to that put upon it by the Native Minister. Sir Egbert Douglas said it appeared to him the question was not the Piako Swamp at all, but as <0 whether Ministers should occupy the Government Benches.

Mr Hamlin said he had come to the House pledged to see that this matter was thoroughly sifted, and it was due to the House and the colony that the Government should not shirk any inquiry into the matter. Mr Reynolds thought the time was very inopportune for tabling such a motion.

Mr Howe thought Sir Q. Grey’s request so reasonable that he was surprised to see the Ministry opposed to it; Though very much inclined to support the Ministry generally, he yet was most anxious to see tnis matter sifted to the bottom. These dealings with the public land were considered the most important in the district he came from. Though he would regret to see Ministers leave the Government Benches, yet no threat of that kind would influence him in this matter.

Mr WOOLCOCK thought if, when the land was sold, the price was [quite adequate, it ought to be a sufficient reason to show that the transaction was fair and honorable. He hoped the motion would be withdrawn on the assurance of the Government. Sir G. Grey said be understood a positive pledge was given last session that the matter would not be dealt with by Orders in Council, but that a Bill would be brought down

this session so that the new Parliament might be enabled to discuss the whole question. He had appealed to the Governor to be enabled to legally test what he considered a most monstrous wrong to the community, and what answer did he get but the audacious publication of Orders in Council in the Gazette. They were told the price was adequate, but what has that to do with the case. It was the illegality of the transaction. They had been placed as conservators of the public interests, and they pillaged the public. They were told that the land was unfit for the settlement of small farmers; but had Government not money to make roads. How many roads had they made to the runs of friends of the Government. He denied he had any intention of shaking the position of Ministers in bringing down his motion, and after the assurance of the Premier, he begged to withdraw his motion. Mr Andrew objected, and a division was called for with the following result:— Ayes 29 Noes 29 AYES. Mr Barff Mr Montgomery ~ Brandon ~ Murray „ J. 0. Brown „ Nahi „ Burns „ O’Rorke „ Button ~ Rees ~ Curtis ~ Rowe „ De Lautour „ Seaton „ Dignan „ Shrimski „ Fisher „ Stout Sir G. Grey „ Swanson Mr Hamlin ~ Tole „ Joyce „ Thomson „ Lusk „ R G. Wood „ Macandrew „ W. Wood ~ Macfarlane NOES. Mr Andrew Mr G. McLean ~ Atkinson „ Moorhouse „ Ballance „ Murray-Aynsley „ Bowen „ Pearce „ Carrington „ Reynolds „ Cox ~ Richardson Sir R. Douglas „ Richmond Mr Gibbs „ Seymour „ Henry „ Sharp ~ Hunter „ Stafford „ Hursthouse ~ Tawhiti „ Johnston Sir J. Vogel „ Kelly Mr Williams ~ Kennedy ~ Woolcock Sir Donald McLean The Speaker gave his casting vote with the noes in order to afford further opportunity for discussion. The House adjourned at 5.30 to 7.30 p.m. ADJOURNMENT OP THE HOUSE. Upon the House resuming, Sir Julius Vogel adverted to the irregular position in which the House had placed itself in opening the business of the session as they had done. To restore things to a proper position, he moved the adjournment of the House till 7.30 p.m. on Wednesday next, and in doing so availed himself of the opportunity to give his version of the Piako Swamp transaction. This led to some sharp debate, but ended in the House adjourning at 9.45 until Wednesday. THE LATEST. The supporters of the Government, at meeting held this afternoon, urgently requested the Ministers not to resign office. The Ministers have not yet decided on their course of action.