LABOUR UNEASINESS

Dominion, Volume 11, Issue 257, 18 July 1918, Page 6

LABOUR UNEASINESS

"INDUSTRIAL CONSCRIPTION"

MINISTER'S ASSURANCES

NO REPRESSION OF WORKERS

A conference of representatives of Labour bodies was held in Wellington recently to consider the proposals of the Government under tho national service section of tho finance Act of last session, termed by many "Industrial Conscription." The conference declared emphatically against ally such scheme, and their protest was made to Ministers of the Crown by a deputation yesterday afternoon. The Ministers nresent were Sir James Alien (Acting Minister), Mr. Herrics, Sir William Fraseiy Mr. G. W. liussell, and Mr. W. D. S. AlacDonald.

Uncompromising Opposition, Mr. J. Roberts said that the deputation siished to know from the Government what was meant by national service as referred to in the clauses of the Act. The conference had been unanimous in the opinion that the 'operation of Clause 25 of the Act should he opposed by the Labour movement in New Zealand, and it would be opposed. The conference wished to know how it was proposed that the clause should be put into operation. Tho Labour bodies held that tho exercise of compulsion as was proposed would not havo the effect of increasing production, but rather of retarding it. The British Government had decidetl at length that co-operation was a better means of ensuring increased production than compulsion, and had abandoned compulsion. If the Bill was considered to be necessary on account of the shortage of labour, then tlie reply of Labour was that there. was no shortage of labour except in those industries whero the , wages and conditions were not good enough to attract workers to them. If it was the purpose'' of the Bill to protect that class of,employers who did not pay their workers well enough, then it would not receive any support from the workers or from the general public. If production in New Zealand was not sufficient, then the answer of Labour was that, this was proof that the organisation of industry by private employers had failed, nnd tliat this difficulty could be overcome by the handing over of tho industries to the workers in them. In the case of all other commodities the law of supply and demand operated, and in the snme way if there was a scarcity of labour the price of labour should be allowed to go up, as the price of other commodities went upi From the North -Cape to the Bluff today there was not a worker who was not opposed to national service as proposed in New Zealand. All the authorities in England had condemned it and if there were no need for it in England there should be no need for it in this country.

The Farmers and Wheat. Mr. A. Black said that tho contention of tho deputation was that the whole aim of tho Government was to suppress the workcts and to let' the farmers and the employers do whnt they pleased. Sir James Allen: That is entirely wrong, and you are not justified in making the statement.

Mr. Bl.iclc: That is the opinion throughout New Zoaland at tho present time. x

Sir .Tames Allen: I am quite sure it is not the opinion.

Mr. Black: "It is the opinion that the Government aro penalising the workers. Farmers are allowed to do what they liko with their land, they are allowed to grow what wheat they "like, or not. to grow wheat at all; they arc allowed if they please to adopt a go-slow policy." tie went on to declare that this would virtually lie a strike. Instead of adopting scientific organisation ol' industry, the Government were allowing the employers to exploit the workers. He declared also that the farmers were fattening nn tlio blood and tears of tho people at Home.

Mr. J. G. Bruce said that: the message of the conference to the Government was that tho workers would ho prepared to resist industrial conscription.

Mr. J. Elston said thnt since the war had been i.n progress Labour had been absolutely ignored by tho Government. Labour had not been consulted about regulations for conscription of labour. Sir James Allen: Because there arc no regulations.

Mr. Roberts.: What about the Jugoslavs?

Sir James Allen: That's not; national service.

Mr. MacDonnld: Are you an alien subject?

Mr. Roberts: No, I am not. Mr. Mac Donald: Theii why do you (lnnke that remark? Mr. Roberts: Because the .Tugo-Slnrs arc lieinp employed at work whero pioviously other men were employed. The Government and Labour. Sir James Allen said lie would reply first of ail to the statement that the National Government had ignored Labour ever since tho war began. He would remind them of the fact that ivhen Die National Government was formed an invitation was offered to the Labour members oT Parliament to tnke a share in the government. Was this an invitation to Labour to take part in the government of the country or not? ; Mr. Roberts: Not direct, Sir James Allen: "1 can't imagine, anything niore direct." Ite went on to say that the Government were at all times anxious to have the co-operation and advice of Labour,. He could not that national service as defined in the Act meant anything like industrial conscription. He considered that national service meant something like litis: that when the nntioii was in peril it was right that every individual should Tender service to the nation. Tho clauses in the Bill were not intended to apply to Labour alone, but to everybody. The intention of the Act was to put tho Government into the position of being • able, in ease it should be necessary, to organise industry in such manner as to give effect to their desires. Mr. Massey's Promise, Ho wished to remind the deputation of the promise made by the Prime Minister in the House—a promise which had been repeated again and again—that before any regulations were made a conference would be convened of representafives of Labour and employers with representatives of the Government. Tt would be for tho conference to go fully into the proposals of the Government. A voice: That has not been done.

Sir James Allen said that it had not been done because the regulations lied not even been considered by the Government. Ministers had been talking about regulations, with the idea of having something to put before a conference if one were eSilletl. At present the Government had nothing concrete to put before a conference. The Government had brought down some regulations to deal with the .Tugo-Slavs, but these regulations had'been made under clause 25 of (lie Finance Act only because it did not appear that there ivas any other legislation under which the regulations could be made. But these regulations to deal with Jugo-Slavs had nothing to do with ngtional service. These men were alien enemies. To compel them to do the work they had been given to do did not help the individual employer, because these men had been taken away from the individual employer and _pnt to work for the State. These aliens had been dealt with to protect our own people, to prevent t.hem from exploiting the gumfields, and so to save these gumfields for our own men. He had never dreamt, that the making of these regulations concerning .Togo-Slavs would be declared tr. bo a breach of the promise made by the I'rime Minister that Labour would be consulted. No Need for Suspicion, He knew quite well tint one of the troubles of the past and the present was that there was a great deal of suspicion between Capital and Labour on both sides. He would ask that in.the interests of our country the members of the deputation would do all they could to remove this suspicion, and to mako it possible for employer and employeo to como together in the interests of their country, He had valued very much

the loyalty of some of tho Labour people in New Zealand.

Ho hoped that he. had made it clear that the Act was not put on tho Statute Book to deal with labour onlv. It was intended to apply to the employer, the owner of the lactory or workshop, and everybody else if necessary, and when the regulations were being framed the liabilities of these classes would have to be considered. He was quite w"ll aware that it was impossible to get satisfactory work out of men who were compelled to work, and the Government did not want to compel men to work. The Government wauled the willing work of men anxious to help their nation in the time of its need. He did not Ihink any compulsion would bo necessary. The Government wero aiming not at compulsion, but rather at co-operation. There was no desire on the part of tho Government to suppress labour in any way whatever. But the Government must recognise that employers as well as workers had certain right.?. It was suggested thnt farmers were allowed to do as they Mkcd. 'Die Government had done its best to get the farmer to grow wheal, but. be would ask the deputation, who were objecting to the compulsion of labour, whether they would compel the fanner to grow wheat. The farmer was not allowed to "go slow." If a farmer grew meat instead of wheat that was not going slow. A Plea for the Farmer. The Hon. W. D. S. Mac Donald said that the Government, and Governments which, had preceded it for many years, had always done their best for all classes, including the workers. But while they were merely oil earth they must expect imperfections and troubles. The object of the Act was that if emergency arose tho Government would be in a position to require every man to give not to any employer, but to the country. Mr. Mac Donald said there was much misconception about what the fannei could do and could not do. There was an idea tlmt farmers were given privileges denied to other people. But the farmer was liable to military service like everybody else. Last year the farmer put in 297,000 acres of wheat, winch should have been enough to supply the people, but thousands of acres of the wheat was never cut. There .were fjhirkers among the farmers, but they were very leu, and* regulations were now being considered to deal with thi shirker. Just now a census was being taken on tlid subject. Seasons had been bad and farmers hud lost much money. There were farmers who could not. afford to continue making losses, men who bad heavy mortgages, and theso cases were many rather than tew. These men could not l>o blnnied for eh* ing up wheat-growing and adopting sometiling else to make money. He repeated again that tho Government had no idea of exploiting Labour or of being unfair to any section of the community. Cettainly no member of the was scheming to take advantages of Laboui, Genesis of the Clause. Tho Hon. G. W. Russell said ho was glad thac the deputation had come to clear up the facts about conscription 01 labour. Ho claimed that he was just as much a representative of Labour as tnose who called tnemaelves Labour members, lie said that the genesis of the objectionable clause was that in order to keep up production on land the Government should have power to compel retired farmers to go back 011 to the laud again. The only occupations to .which men could be put were those which were essential or partially essential, and every member of the deputation would agree that it was the duty of the Government to see that these industries were maintained. He did not agree that tho Government by legislation or administration had penalised Labour. It had been said tliut the Government favoured the farmers, but he ljelieved that it was a fact that if tho farmers could sell their meat ou «i tree market in Lnglaud they could get 4d. per lb. rnoro than the price now paid by the Imperial Government. As to tho allegations of exploitation ot pensioned returned soldiers ho said the Government was not in favour of it. In the Government service no .pensioners were employed to work at a lower pneo bv reason of their pensions. 'Mr. Roberts made some further remarks. He said that rightly or wrongly the workers were suspicious of tho Government. The question ol the Jugoslavs had been introduced because this clause hud been used to compel them to work. That matter was now explained—that. tho regulations applied only to alien enemies. Ho argued with Ministers at some little length as to the need or otherwise for the Bill. Tn reply to a question Sir .Tames Allen said that bv law any regulations made Lad to be placed before Parliament witliin fourteen days, or if Parliament was not 111 session, within fourteen days of the meeting of; Parliament. If Parliament then declared that the regulations were not to bo given effect to, they would cease to be effective.