PARLIAMENT

Dominion, Volume 9, Issue 2815, 5 July 1916, Page 6

PARLIAMENT

"LIBERALS" ANNOYED SCENE OYER AN AMENDMENT THE ESTIMATES LAND AND INCOME TAX BILL The House of Representatives met at 2.30 p.m. The New Zealand'lnsurance Company Trust Bill was received from the Legislative Council, and the amendments made in tho Bill by the Council were agreed to. INTEREST RATES.; Mr. C. H. POOLE (Auckland West) asked the Minister of Finance whether his attention had been called to the increase iii the rates of interest on loans to policy-holders by Life Insurance Companies, and whether he could state reasons for this. . SIR JOSEPH ■ WARD said that the Government was responsible only for the Government Life Insuranco Department. This Department had not increased its lending rates to policy-hold-ers.. The honourable member had shown him a report of another important Life Assurance institution, which showed that this society was charging at the rate of 7 and 8 per cent, on loans It policy-holders. The Government had m control over them in any way whatever. LAND FOR SOLDIERS. The Eight Hon. W. F. . MASSE Y moved that the amendments made by the Legislative Council in the Discharged Soldiers' Settlement Amendment Bill be agreed to. The amendments were agreed to. MILITARY SERVICE BILL, The Military Service Bill was received from the Legislative Council. - The Hon. J. ALLEN (Minister of Defence) explained the purport of the amendments and moved that they be considered next sitting day. i This motion was agreed to. LAND AND INCOME TAX BILL. THIRD READING DEBATE. On the third reading of the Land and Income Tax Bill, Mr. J. PAYNL (Grey Lynn) urged the commandeering of bank balances to finance the wi\r. • Mr. R. SCOW (Tuapeka) congratulated tho Minister of Finance upon his efforts to do a fair thing by all classes of people.' . ' Mr. T. M. WILFORD - (Hntt) said there was one :■ special blemish' in tho Bill which might present thousands of pounds to somo classes. of people. One provision of the measure would hit people witli incomes 'up to .£SOO very severely. A ' vast amount of money had been lent to people to acquire their own freehold or crect their own homes. He .would ask the Minister of Finance it it was not a fact that every man who.had lent money on. mortgage and every institution that had so lent money on mortgage had: fixed the rate of interest on the.. assumption of paying the mortgage tax. Every mortgage now running,. -and fdr which interest was fixed for a definite number of years, would result in tho mortgagor paying to tho mortgagee the current rate of interest, plus the mortgage tax.

Sir Joseph Ward: Do,you oppose 'the abolition of the'mortgage tax? .

Mr. Wilt'ord: No, but X contend that a percentage should be allowed to the mortgagors- who have registered mortgages running at the present time. Mortgagees should receive a half per cent, less for their money on existing mortgages until the end of their currency. Some .£20,000,000 was lent on mortgage, and what present was the Government giving the mortgagee ly taking off the mortgage tax? Were the mortgagees going to allow the mortgagors a reduction in the rate of interest or continue to collect it,, although they do not pay it to the Government? Mr. A. H. HINDMARSH (Wellington ■South) said that the Minister of Finance would lose hundreds of thousands of pounds by the abolition of the mortgage tax, and ho strongly, protested against that abolition, ' winch he prophesied marked the disruption 'of the Liberal Party. The'Massey Party, he said, did not'dare to abolish this tax, and it remained for a Liberal/ Minister to yield to the big farmer and abolish this tax. This action meant the killing of the land tax. He upbraided tho Liberal Party for their ''supine conduct" in allowing the Massey Party to sway 'tho so-called National Ministry.

Minister's Reply. SIB JOSEPH WARD, in reply, said i that lie -wondered, why the member tor Wellington South did not join the National Government when ho had tho chance. Mr. Hindmarsh: A very good thing I didn't. .. Sir Joseph Ward said tlia.t if the honourable member had joined the Ministry he might have used, his influence to protect the principles which he now claimed 'to' hold so dear. Now the honourable member found fault with the liberal Party for., failing; as ho alleged, to adhere to tho'si principles; ' Could-it be that the Solomon of New Zealand politics was discovered?. Or' was he a Daniel? (Laughter.). So.enraged did the honourable member seem that he (Sir Joseph Ward) was almost porsuaded that he might be.serious. ,At any rate, said Sir Joseph Ward, lie wished to assure the Honourable member that not a single big fanner had asked him to abolish the mortgage tax. The proposal was made because the Government ' desired to cheapen the rates of .interest, which even the honourable member must favour. Mr. ffindmatsh: Certainly. Sir Joseph Ward-said that there was no proposal in the Bill to reduce the land tax, and if the result of the abolition of the mortgage tax should be to cause a loss of a great deal of land tax, that effect would be apparent in a year, and it could be at one© rectified by legislation. Tho House would not, and the country would not, tolerate anything of this sort. Replying to Mr. T. M. Wilford, he said that he did not think the Government should at once tear up' mortgage agreements. Mr. Wilford; No, not that. Modify them'. Sir Joseph Ward said that if the mortgagees did not reduce their lending rates by approximately one-half per cent., then possibly a case would arise for legislative interference. Referring to the complaints against the proposals for the relief of mining companies, ho said that a curions thing had happened. The proposal was put in the Bill to help the companies, and to. give the companies concessions to the 'amount of about .£IO,OOO. However, the proposal, was strongly opposed by tho mining companies, and it was possible that fitter consultation with Cabinet he would have the old provisions restored. If the companies would not have the concessions, then he would be very happy to'let them have their wav and keep the revenue. The Bill wa's read a third time, and passed. : .' AN ANGRY SCENE "LIBERALS" ANNOYED . ABOUT A CERTAIN AMENDMENT. Tho next Order of the Day was Committee of Supply. On -tho motion that Mr. Speakor do now leave tho chair, Mr. Wilford, Mr. Witty, and Mr. Wright roso to speak'. Mr. Speaker called on Mr. Wright, and there was such an outbreak of heated disorder as has not been seen in the House for mnny years. Mr. Wilford, turning to his friend, Mr. Witty, said, "Second timo; j( most unfair. A matter of arrangement. Mr. Wright did not sit down, and Mr. Witty, Mr. Wilford, Mr. Hindmarsh, Dr. 'I'liacker, aud others began to interjectnoisily various expressions of roproach, such as, "Absolutely unfair," "An absolute trick," "Contemptible," "The most barefaced thing I ever savr, Sit uond. Mr. Witty shouted, "I would be ashamed to be a Minister." Mr. Wright moved an amendment urging the Government to expedite the erection of Parliament Buildings. Ilie moving of this amendment prevented the, moving of any other, dealing, for stance, with tho oost of living. A 18H days ago Mr. Nosirorthr. moved ojie about j

the Ashbnrton School. The rage of the Oppositionists was due !o the fact that, these amendments prevented discussion on other subjects on other intercepting amendments which might have been moved, and they alleged that tho amendments were "arranged" for this purpose. The annoyed members interrupted Mr. Wriglit a good deal for it minute or two, but lie made his specch. Mr. G. WITTY (Jiiccarton) spoke after Mr. Wright, lie complained that the Government had not pin;-..! the game in trying to stop discission and legitimate criticism, of which no Government should be afraid. A Chorus of Complaint. Oti tho House resuming at 7.30, Mr. Witty continued his speech until he had. exhausted his half-hour time limit. He referred to tho cost of living, and said that the House was prevented from discussing this question. The Prime Minister: I have promised to give the House a day for discussing the cost of living. - Mr. Witty: Bah! When will we get it? i\\'U may never get it. In tilling in time in mating an effort to speaker to Mr. Wright's amendment, he declared "a portion of the new Parliament Buildings is being built of marble, a portion of brick, and a. portion of o!ay. Some of the members of the National Government are men of marble, and some are men who are only common clay, willing to do anything for solf-aggrandisc-ment." Dr. THACIvER (Christchurch East) spoke of the "insanitation" of the present Parliament Building, and sai(l that ho was taking up probably i:CO or .£7O of th.e country's money in entering his protest arainst the slow progress of the new buildings, Mr. TV. A. VEITCH (Wanganni) upbraided the Government for arranging that an amendment should ba moved to prevent, discussion of the cost of living. Mr. C. H. POOLE (Auckland West) declared that tile indignation manifested at the turn of affairs was fully justified. Ee thought that such tactics as had been adopted were unworthy of a National Government, althugh it might be excusable in a party Government. Mr. J. PAYNE (Grey Lynn) and Mr. T. IC. SIDEY (Dunedin South) protested also. Mr. Sidey suggested that Mr. Speaker ought to have called upon Mr. Wilford or Mr. Witty. Mr. Speaker Explains. Mr. SPEAKER : I am afraid the honour, able member is reflecting on the chair. I wish to Bay that I called upon the first honourable member that caught my eye on both occasions, and I can't allow any honourable member To reflect on my judgment in that way. Honourable members inust know that it is a matter of indifference to me whom I call upon. On this occasion I was perfectly well aware that there were several honourable members wishing to speak.. I looked carefully round, and the gentleman who caught my eye first, him I called upon. And I am in a better jositiou to sw than any honourable momuer.

After Mr. G. V. Pearce had spoken, to. tell the Labour member.' that their desire was rather to attack tho Government than-to discuss the cost of living, a vote was taken on the amendment, and it was lost on the voices. " Discussion then continued on the original motion, "That Mr. SpeaEer do leave the chair in order that the House may go into Committee of Supply." llr. T. M. WTLFORD (Hutt) said the Prime Minister,had prevented the House from discussing the cost of living. Lost Opportunities. The Ifight Hon. W. F. MASSEY said that so many complaints had been made about the lack of opportunities to speak on the cost of living that it was jnst about time that the other side of th« question was put before the House and tho country. It was not a fact that he had denied to the member for Hutt or any other member opportunity to discuss tho cost of living. He had never seen the House treated 60 well or so generously as the House had been treated during the present session. in regard to opportunities for free discussion. He named some of the opportunities that had occurred, such opportunities as he had made full use of when he was on the other side of the House.

Mr. Witty: There is no other side of the' House now. ; '

Mr. Massey: The honourable member did not talk like that this afternoon. Mr. Massey went on to mention some of the opportunities that had occurred. First of all there was the Budget debate, which collapsed, utterly. Next came the discussion on the first item of the Estimates. He Tiad often assisted to carry on, a first item discussion till three or four o'clock in the morning, but on this occasion there was not a discussion worth the name. Jfo amendment was moved. Another opportunity- occurred on the Imprest Bill, but it went through without debate. "An opportunity occurred on the debate on the Land and Income Tax Bill, but that opportunity was likewise lost. And if the business of the House had been allowed to go on that night, the State Coal Mines Estimates could have been reached, and members would have had an opportunity'of discussing the cost of living question in relation to coal. Ho had alrcadv "teiven a promise to the House to move a motion on the Board of Trade report which would ' allow the "House to discuss the cost of living. That promise he would keep. He had intended to bring that motion on the previous evening, but decided instead to flet 'the Land and Income Tax Bill through Committee in order that it might the sooner go on to the Upper House. Very unfair and ungenerous sugeestions had been made especiallv by the fncmber for Riccarfon, about the alleged anxiety of the Minister of Finance and himself to end t.li> session quickly in order to get Home. He could assuro the House that they h-' 1 no such desire, and he asked hono* "Up members to consider the F', .anco Minister or himself if ' they had any. wish to prolonp the session. The onlv desire of the Government, was to have the business of the country done with proper thoroughness and reason able dispatch.

THE ESTIMATES EDUCATION DEPARTMENT'S VOTE. The House eventually got into Committee at 10.48 p.m. The first class taken was education. Mr. A. H. Hindmarsh said that tho medical inspection of school children in Wellington was most perfunctory, and theri had been no proper inspection in the proper sense, of the word. This was a grave scandal, and something was wrong somewhere. He characterised the present 'svstem of medical inspection of schools as a sham. He moved that the vote for the Head Office lx> redriced by as an expression of the dissatisfac-. tio'n of tho House with the .conduct of the medical inspection work 111 Wellingto"' The Otekaike Scandal. Mr. G. J. Anderson claimed a, prior amendment, however. He moved that the item Administrative Division ■£119be reduced by JJI as a protest against the mismanagement by the administrative officers of the Otekaike Home for Montally Defective Children' The Minister declared that: ho was as desirous as anyone of seeing that proper inspections were carried out 111 wellingtoil. The medical officer had been Dr. Giesen, but he had teen-taken over by the Defence Department, and ho had now brought up Dr. Plutts, who would reside here. More medical officers were needed, and he would approach Cabinet on the matter of seenring an increased allowance for this purpose. Replying on the Otekaike Home question he said that since he had heard the 'allegations about Otekaike ho had asked the present Director of Education to prepare a full report, and ho had also asked the Public Works Department for a report. These two reports were now before Cabinet, which would consider whether a public inquiry should be "ranted. From his own observation he agreed that there had been a considerable waste of money, but uiost of the officials concerned were now out of the Department, and he thought a post-mor-tem examination would do little good. He admitted there had been exasperating delay. He thought the most important part was to deal with Hie girls, and secure proper accommodation for them. In further"' remarks, Mr. .Hanan said 6omebody would have to suffer for mismanagement at Otekaike. he would defend it no longer. They wanted to have a proper scheme, and he hoped to submit such a scheme with a proper objective next year. Tho amendment was rejected.