EARLY CLOSING OF HOTEL BARS

Dominion, Volume 9, Issue 2716, 10 March 1916, Page 6

EARLY CLOSING OF HOTEL BARS

DEPUTATION TO THE PRIME

MINISTER

VIEWS OF METHODIST MINISTERS

WET CANTEENS OPPOSED

A request for certain restrictions on the sale of liquor during the war period was mado to the I'rime Minister yesterday by a deputation from tha Methodist . Conference which recently sat in Auckland. Briefly, the requests of the deputation were those: "That hotels all over New Zealand should be closed at 6 p.m. "That treating or shouting should be prohibited. "That no wet canteens sliould bo established at any training camps." The Rev. AA 7 . A. Sinclair presented a petition signed by 158 representatives of the conference, which claimed to represent 90,000 people in the Dominion. Tho petition was that tho Government should introduce regulations similar to those in existence in the Old Land under the Defence of the Realm Act, by which treating or shouting was prohibited in certain districts. Mr. Massey: Are you asking that similar regulations to those in force in England should apply to the whole of the Dominion, or only to parts of the Dominion? Mr. Sinclair As 1 understand it, our request applies to. the whole of tho Dominion. AA'e are asking that all the people shall be treated in the same way. We _ don't believe in singling out our 6oldiers for special, treatment. ' Mr. Massey: Hear, hear! I quito agree with you. Favoured by the People. Mr. Sinclair said that they did not believe that a great percentage of the soldiers were addicted to drink. They thought that . a very large percentage of them were teetotallers, but that unfortunately there were some wlio were addicted to drink whose efficiency as soldiers must be reduced by their indulgence in liquor. The conference had also passed unanimously resolutions in favour of the requests now being; made, AVith regard to the anti-shouting request, ho claimed that tlie men themselves acknowledged the evil of tlie shouting' system. Througli mistaken kindness an.i fiiendjh'p liquor wrnS ft reed jpon tnam very often when they preferred to be without it. He liad information to this effect, 'that a ,very large number of men would be delighted if shouting were mad) illegal. They asked also lor six o'clock closing, believing that a very large body'of publio opinion was in favour of it. In Auckland they had been sin prised to find that many men not connected with the Church had expressed opinions favourable to six o'clock closing, and he believed that this reform would bring home to the people the fact that there was a great world war in progress, that tho nation was fighting for its life. Tho third request of conference was that under no circumstances should the Minister yield to the request that liquor should bo sold in tho camps. Mr. E. Rosevear supported „ tho requests on behalf of the lajmen of nis Church. In Other Countries. The Rev. J. Cocker said that tho questions raised were not strange. Since the war began every country engaged in tho war had placed restrictions upon tho liquor trade. In England, in Franco, and in Russia, tho Governments had dccidcd that this liquor traffic should bo dedlt with in a special manner at special times. Ho urged that six o'clock closing was a little thing to ask for in comparison with what had beon done in old England, whero the hours for drinking wero from 4} to 5£ hours per day ill different areas. • In Sydney the Government had closed the hotels at. 6 o'clock, but later had oxtonded the hour to 8 o'clock. Mr. Massey: That is not in accordance with the information I have. Mr. Cocker contended that his information was correct, and that early closing had recently been decreed in Sydney. Mr. Massey: But that was on account of the riot. Mr. Cocker, in support of tho maintenance of dry canteens, said that while at Trontham Camp that day he had spoken to several soldiers on the subject, and every mail ho had spoken to had said what a delightful thing it was that drink was not there. Vordlct of Last Poll. Tho Rev. John'Davison said that tho conference had ' been unanimously in favour of the restrictions on the liquor traffic, at least during tho war period On some other occasion they mignt urge, not as a war measure, but as a permanent measure, that certain of these reforms should be adopted. Foj the present they urged that at least tho reforms wore essential while tlio war lasted. They did not come to attack tho soldiers, they rather sympathised with them. But tliey gathered that most of the troubles with the men were directly or indirectly due to drink. They believed that tho necessary .restrictions could be imposed by regulation without- recourse to Parliament. Mr. MassQy: AYith regard to antishouting, you mean? Mr. Dawson: Yes. AA r o urge that this _ should bo dono by regulation im mediately. AVe believe that tho groat body of civilians aro in favour of this reform, and would support it. AA r o may-be reminded that at last election there was a minority vote for National Prohibition and for local No-Liconse. I woulu remind you that last election was taken at a time of panic, when tho people were afraid of the revenue issue, but l ain persuaded that if public opinion were tested to-day thero would be an entirely different verdict. Now they realise what tho drinking crusade means. Tliey see what England Russia, and Prance have done, and tliev arc viewing this question from an entirely different standpoint. Six o'clock closing as a reform could be justified on economic grounds. AVhilo tliere was a general cry for economy it was a fact that in last year we paid duty on 278,5(11 gallons more liquor than in any previous year in our history. Duty was paid on 11,970,378 gallons of li-. quor, and there wore 13,378 convictions for drunkenness. \ They believed that most of the drunkenness took placo sifter six o'clock at night, and they thought, that in war time, at any rate, early closing should bo the rule. It was justifiable even as an industrial measure. "Subtlo Influences." "Tlio question of dry canteens wo had thought was sottled," said Mr. Dawson. "But we find that there aro subtle influences at work. A vcrv subtle endeavour is being made, becauso they anticipate the Government yielding to pressure for early closing, to introduce liquor into camps. This u being agitated in a very subtle, though, I hope, not very effective fashion. May I lemind \ou that our defence svsteni was built up under dry canteens? A promise was given that into no camps would liquor be allowed to come. On that promise the Defence Bill was allowed to become law, and if the promise had not been given it would have met with very strenuous opposition. AA'e suggest that however import-ant this was for Territorial camps, it is infinitely more important in Expeditionary Force camps." Mr. Dawson said that he was satisfied an honest attempt was I

being made to administer the present regulations, and that very little liquor wont into the camps. Although there wore some unseemly sights among the soldiers, they were caused by comparatively few men. While this was true now, they felt that it might be very different if liquor were brought into the camps, increasing the temptations of the men. Chaplains had said that in the military canteens in Egypt drunkenness did take place, and lie feared that it might take place hero.

PRIME MINISTER REPLIES

WHAT IS DONE ELSEWHERE.

Mr. Massey, replying, congratulated the members of the deputation on the moderation with which tliey had expressed their views. He need hardly inform tliem, ho said, that moderation, had more influence with him than perhaps the other attitude. Ho wished them to understand that he himself anct Ministers generally wero just as anxious for tho good reputation of the soldiers as the members of tho deputation, and he believed that was saying a great deal. A- point had been made that New Zealand should follow the example of other countries in placing restrictions upon the sale of liquor. .New Zealand had so far not done a great deal in this direction, but ho wished them to acknowledge this, that there was not the same necessity in New Zealand as had existed in some of the other countries mentioned. Certainly there was not the same necessity as in England or in Russia. He could not speak for France, but he thought the same arguments would apply thore. He need scarcely point out. how, in the munition works in <Engla'nd, it was impossible to find labour to get work done, owing to over-indulgence of'men in liquor. This matter had already been, before though Cabinet had not reached finality upon it. Tho deputation would agree, perhaps, that to determine what should bo done was no easy matter. Australian States. He had been inquiring from the different States of Australia, and he had received, on February 5, a telegram from the Acting-Premier of New South Wales as follows: — "There have been no restrictions or modifications in liquor Acts or in the control of tho liquor traffic in this State 6ince the outbreak of war." Sir. Massey said he did not know what restrictions had been made since that time. Of course tliey had all read of riot that took,place, and must recognise the necessity for precautions to prevent a recurrence of it. It was quite likely that, something had beer done since then. In New Zealand the Defence Minister had power to close hotels in case this should become necessary for public order. This was done during the striko of 1913 in certain places. Probably something of the sort had been done in New South AA r ales. Queensland had sent as nearly as possible the same reply to his inquiry. From A r ictoria the information was that the hours for the salo of liquor were from 9 a.m. to l 9.30 p.m., instead of from 6.30 a.m. to 11 p.m. In Tasmania the closing hour was now 10 p.m., instead of 11.30 p.m. In South Australia a very important change was made, tho closing hour being altered from 11 p.m. to 6 p.m. In AVcstcru Australia an Act had been passed giving the Government power by regulation to fix tho hours for tlio salo of liquor, but apparently nothing had been dono under that Act. Recently a measure had been passed by tho AVestern Australian. Parliament fixing the hours at 9 a.m. to 9 p.m. in tho metropolitan areas and in tlio agricultural districts. Apparently tlioro was somo other arrangement on tho goldfields. Even now Now Zealand was little, if anything, behind those States after tho alterations' mado tliero. Against tho Wet Canteen. "I am very glad to convey this'information to you," Mr. Massoy continued. "I havo it from Colonel Gibbon, Chief of _ the General Staff, that thero is less drinking among soldiers at present than there was twelve or fifteen months ago. Colonel Gibbon goes on to say that drunkenness is practically unknown in tho camps." Mr. Dawson: "That is tho dry canteen." Mr. Massey: "I don't think you need worry about tlio dry canteen. So far as I can ascertain, thero is not tho slightest chance of the wet cantecn proposal being agreed to. I havo been collecting ovidenco on. tho subject, and tho bulk of tho opinions aro decidedly against a wet canteen being established. I went so far as to ask tho military people in view of possible restrictions whether thoy would prefer a wet'canteen to an alteration of the hours, and thoy said they would not havo the wet canteen under any conditions whatever. (Hear, hear.) So I think there need be no further anxiety about that." In Praise of Our Men.- , Mr. Massey went on to say that drunkenness among soldiers was not unknown in tho cities. He had seen occasional ovidenco of it himself. He would not liko to say that he had seen evidence of misconduct, because even when a soldier indulged in alcoholic liquor ho was generally sufficient of a gentleman to conduct liimsef properly. Our men wero not plaster saints. No doubt thero wore some black sheep among them, but taking them by. and largo, and ho had seen most/'of the 50,000 who had passed through tho camps, he did not think it was. possible to find a better conducted set of young men than had been received in the camps in New Zealand. He did not think it would bo out of placo to add that he did not think it would be possiblo to find a bettor developed set of men mentally and physically than tho young New Zealanders who were representing their country on tho other side of the world. Logat Obstacles. He had consulted the Attorney-Gon-cial as to whether it would be possible ioi the Govenuneut to provide by regulation for tlie reduction of hours of sale, or for tho prohibition of shouting and tho opinion of the Crown Law Office was that the sanction of 1 arliameut was necessary before either of these thin#, could be done. AVhat could be done was this: If an hotel or a number of hotels encouraged drunkenness among soldiers, those hotels could be declared out of bounds. In that caso it would become an offenco-for a soldier to purchase liquor or for anyone to sell him liquor in any of those hotels. Certain hotels had already been proscribed in this way for a period This was all that could be done ill tho meantime until the proposals wore submitted to Parliament. With regard to the antishouting proposal, ho believed' it would be accepted with favour by a very largo proportion of the people of New Zealand. It must be understood that lie could not commit the Government to this. No Minister could commit tho Government to any such proposal, and if it wero to be submitted to Parliament it must come from tho Government as a whole. An Early' Session? "There aro the three points you have submitted,." said Mr. Massey in conclusion. "Tho canteen: I don't think the proposal'to establish a wet canteen will ever take legislative shape in this Parliament. Even if it could be. secured by regulation, I don't think there is a ehance of it. As to the other two points, early closing and anti-shouting, thoso must come hel'jre Parliament before anything can be done. It is quito likely that the House will meet earlier than usual this year, but even that depends on other circumstances which I cannot make public. Hut I shall be in a position before the House meets to tell your president or Mr. Dawson whe-

tlier these proposals will bo submitted to Parliament this session. Certain Hotelkeepors at Fault. "I have hero another report from the iolieo Department upon this subject, the report is not as satisfactory as 1 should like. It says that while there is a good number of hotelkeepers who are anxious to prevent drunkenness among soldiers and civilians, there is a proportion of them who, if they do not encourage drunkenness, wink.at it. I don't need to tell you I am very stronglv opposed to anything of that sort. 1 think that an hotelkeeper who permits drunkenness in ms house, or even a bar attendant, should he given punishment that lie would remember for a long time. I. very pleased to hear the deputation say they were not prepared to advocate preference against soldiers. If we are going to etop shouting for soldjers, then we must stop shouting for civilians. And if we are going to close hotels early for soldiers, then we must closo hotels early for civilians." Mi\ Dawson made a further request that if the Government could not see its way to close the bars earlv, it should by regulation stop the sale of liquor in bottles at 6 o'clock, or even at 5 o'clock this to prevent excessive consumption of liquor off the premises. In England no bottles could bo sold on Saturday, nor from a certain time on Friday. Mr. Massey promised to bear this point in mind. THE ESSENTIAL POINTS. (To the Editor.) Sir, —I have read with much interest the recent letters in Tins Dominion about the liquor question in relation to the soldiers. Most of your correspondents seem to. me to have missed the really essential points, either because they or their friends are sulfering from selfinterest, or else because they are riding a hobby. One important question to be settled by those in authority, before acting dither way, is: "Is alcohol beneficial or not to soldiers in training for active service?" The course of physical train, ing those men go through is practically that of an athlete training for running or football, so there should he plenty . of authority to be got on that point. If alcohol is good for the course of training proscribed it is evident that the amount consumed, and the times at which it is taken, are of great importance. Then the form of alcohol taken must be an important matter, No one who knows will allow that whisky, brandy, or gin are good to train on. Athletes who take alcohol at all mostly take beer, and that with meals, To allow athletes to drink ad. lib. at any time the opportunity offers, would be fatal to efficiency, so that from tha point of view of physical efficiency, i! alcoliol is to be allowed at all it should be supplied ill known quantity as a diet at meal times. This should bo done by the Stato to ensure purity of the liquor and a proper moderation in its use. Most correspondents have hopelessly mixed up the conditions of training in camp with those of active service, and tliey are frequently totally different. ,In camp hours are regular, meals are'regular, and conditions generally are thoso of a very healthy outdoor life; whereas on active service at the front men have many depressing circumstances to bat. tie with, and. when fighting is going on much mental distress through loss of companions and the risks of the battle. TJnder these latter conditions alcohol acts as a temporary stimulant, and by making tlio men have' a little exhilaration, gives their life a brighter colour. I have observed the effect of an issuo every second day of half a gill of rum to each man, and I am satisfied that it not only enabled tired, depressed men to eat a. good meal, ancl enjoy a restful, jolly time in camp, but that it also improved tho physical condition of the nion, and mado thorn more contented, and so assisted in maintaining discipline. But hero, again ; the issuo must be made by the authorities, and not by allowing men to obtain the amount their_ tastes demand from a canteen. Briefly, I consider that tho matter will not be sottled satisfactorily by con-' troversy; but rather that a commission of experts in physical training, authorities on camp life and active service conditions, and soldiers who have served in tho ranks in war should be appointed to report if alcoliol is advisable for troops in training, and for troops on .active service; and that if it is decided to give troops alcohol it should be supplied directly' by the State, and not through the medium of privato sellers at all. It is not a question of soldiers getting drunk. Some do, but not many. It is a question of what will produce the best results.—l am, etc., ' F. AV. MACKENZIE. March 8. TRUST THE DEFENCE AUTHORITIES. (To tho Editor.) Sir,—'That the correspondence columns of tho daily papers should, at this time, bo filled with a discussion on the subject of beer is utterly deplorable. I fear that if a plebiscite were taken to-day on the subjects of greatest interest to tho public, tho result would work out something like this:— ■ BEER. CHARLIE CHAPLIN. COST OP LIVING. The AVar. TJnder these circumstances, do you think you would be justified in inflicting upon your readers tho following reflections concerning the business of the Minister of Defence P His business is that of a ''dealer in magic and spells" ; it is "white magic." His concern is to produce every month a magic number. The last magic number was "10" ; ho is now incubating "11." These magio numbers have each to possess the property of capturing the imagination of 2500 men. These 2500 men are gathered from all parts of the Dominion— tall and short, Catholic and Protestant, saint and sinner—2soo "Johnny Raws, all corao strolling together into I'rentliam. ■ Four months later, if the magician has proved up to his job, 2500 soldiers march, transformed by tho spell of the magic number. "Number 11," says Private Brown, of that ilk; "wouf"—and metaphorically he slaps his chest—"the 10th wore ix good mob—Uncle Bill went. Well, the 10th and the 12th are shaping nil right—but the 11th—wo are tho llth, and my word, we cut sonio ice." And so tho magic works. Translated into plain English, tho business of tho Minister of Defence is to create an esprit de corps for cneh reinforcement. If ho has done this, it can bo taken for granted that ho has done everything else. (Memo. —I have seen tho "bull," but I scorn to retract it.). "Evorybody admits," I imagine a reader saying, "that this esprit do corps has been created, but that has been the work of the camp authorities." A r ery well, Mr. Reader, for the purposes of this argument it doesn't matter a jot whose' work it was. But remember this: If the camp authorities are to get the solo credit for what is good, then tliey must be given tile solo blame for what is bad. You can't havo it both ways. . I Also, how about Australia? Was t-lie dreadful slackening of discipline there —a slackening that is unthinkable here —to ho attributed to weak camp authorities, to the fact that thoso authorities were _ working under some "popular" Ministerial authority? However, it (loos not matter hist now. Tho point is that.the esprit do corps in fact exists here. This esprit de corpse's a delicate thing to maintain even in a regiment with a long record. To both create and maintain "it with a succession of raw levies must require a. very special skill. The problem is a psychological one. Suppose that the authorities dflorec4 that, every soldier

should become, say, a Presbyterian, what would happen to the esprit do corps? And what would he the effect when recruiting? I think the average reader can both supply the rest of tie argument for himself, and arrive safely at the very obvious conclusion that tho Defence authorities should be trusted to handle their own problem in their own way—l am, etc., H. C. ROBINSON. Masterton. CANTEEN^REGULATIONS We havo been asked to publish tho accompanying extract from Regulations for Wot Canteens in British Army Camps, showing the extent to which the canteens are controlled by the military authorities:— "The officer commanding a station decides the hours during which the liquor bar may be kept open for the sale of intoxicating liquor, but it will not, in any case, be open during the hours of divine service on Sundays. _ "The wet canteen is run in connection with an amy institute and other branches of the institute are kept open during such hours as the commanding officer may determine. " "A non-commissioned officer is always on duty in the canteen during the hours lin which the canteen is open. It is one of his duties to see that none of I the men become the worse for drink. A defaulter may be excluded from the canteen except during one hour only of each day to be fixed by the officer commanding. AH the premises are frequently visited by the commanding officer and the medical officer, and, daily, by the captain or subaltern of the day. "The beer is supplied by brewers under contract. Tenders are called foi this. The money paid by the tenant for the canteen rights goes into the Canteen Fund for the benefit of the soldiers. "A committee of management, conisisting of three officers, is appointed by tho officer commanding, under whose orders they will act."