WESTPORT INQUIRY.

Dominion, Volume 6, Issue 1846, 4 September 1913, Page 4

WESTPORT INQUIRY.

HARBOUR APPOINTMENTS. THE MINISTER'S ACTION JUSTIFIED. A MINORITY REPORT. Mr. E. P. LEE, chairman of the West port Inquiry Committee, presented the report ot tnat body. Id read as follows:— "Tlio Committee appointed to inquire into and'report upon the action of the Minister for Marino in appointing Messrs. Gillen and Simpson to the Westport Harbour Board has tho honour to report that after taking evidence herein it finds:— "I. As a result of the statutory changes which have been made in tho constitution of the Westport Harbour Board, either by Act or by Order-in-Council, it devolved upon the Minister for Marino to recommend the names of threo gentlemen for appointment to tho board. "2. Tho Minister recommended tho appointment of Messrs. Greenwood, Simpson, and Gillen, and theso gentlemen were duly appointed. "3. In making theso appointments, the-Minister made tho usual inquiries as to the fitness of theso gentlemen for tho appointments. "4. At the time of the appointment of Mr. Simpson there were seven convictions against him, threo of which wero prior to 1912, and four of which wero m February, 1912. Threo of the last-mentioned convictions arose out of tho samo circumstances on one day. Tho convictions wero as follow :— l One for Sunday trading,.one foi' permitting a raffle, two for permitting drunkenness, two for obscene language, and one for assault. "5. Since these convictions, and beforo his appointment to tho Westport Harbour Board, Mr. Simpson was elected unopposed as tho representative of Karamea to tho Buller County Council. Tho .Minister visited tlio district beforo tho appointment was made, aiid discussed the appointment with Mr. Munro, chairman of tho West-port Harbour Board, Mr. Greenwood, who was for six years Mayor of Westport, and Mr. Blackburn, chairman of tho Chamber of Commerce, Karamea, and neither of these gentlemen, - nor anyone else ill. tho district, informed the. Minister that Simpson had against him, nor did they suggest that' tho appointment would bo'an improper one on that or any other' account, although somo of thorn knew of those convictions. "6. Tlio Committeo finds that, so far as the Minister knew, Mr. Simpson was a fit and propc/ person to bo appointed to tho Harbour Board. "7. On tho appointment being made, • thero was no adverse criticism in tho local newspapers on account of tho convictions recorded against Simpson. "8. Concerning the appointment of Mr. Gillon, tho Committeo finds that at tho Harbour Board election Mr. Gillen, the Labour candidate, was next on tlio poll to tho two selected candidates, and, Labour having failed to secure a seat on tho board, tho Minister recommended him on that account for appointment. "9. Tho Committeo considers that tho appointment of Mr. Gijlen was a fit and proper- one." A Minority Report. Mr. IV. M. ISITT (Christchurch North) presented what was practically a minority roport, in tho following terms: — "1. That evidence was adduced to tlio satisfaction of the committee that tho lion, member for Nelson was justified in his statement, that certain convictions wero on record against Mr. Simpson beforo his appointment. "2. That in tho opinion of this committco tho Minister for Alarino was not awaro of tlio convictions recorded against Mr. Simpson when ho appointed him. "3. That tho member for Nelson was warranted, in his criticism of the appointments to tho Westport Harbour Board, in assuming that tho Minister had ascertained tho personal character of tho man lie had appointed. "4. That in view of tho convictions recorded against Mr. Simpson., and in view of tho statement of the Minister for Marino that ho would not havo appointed Mr. Simpson had ho known of such records, the committee is of opinion that the Government bo recommended to reconsider tho appointment. I "5. That in all appointments made by Ministers of tho Crown to public positions. tho Minister appointing should satisfy himself as to tho character and reputation of tho appointee." .

An Impartial Chairman. Mr. Isitt stated that this report had been voted for by the four Opposition mombors and tho report presented by Mr. Leo lmd been voted for by six Government members. As chairman Mr. Leo had acted with absolute impartiality. Tho committco bad been set up by tlio Government for two purposes: To whitewash the Minister for Marine and tc blackwash tho member for Nelson. The' proceedings of tho committco had been an absolute waste of timo, and itsmembers would havo been better employed in playing, "high-spy" or marbles. Personally ho had readily accepted, in tho first instance, the Minister's assurance that ho was not awaro of the convictions against Mr. Simpson when he'.appointcd him. Mr. Isitt went on to deal at somo length with tho matters which gavo rise to tho inquiry. Olio question raised, 110 said, was whetlior lying, obscurity, and lawlessness wero to bo ignored, for political purposes, when appointments wero being made to a public position. He said that originally Mr. Fisher had stated that if Mr. Atmoro's statement were truo ho would ask Air. Simpson to resign. Ho blamed ■ tlio Minister for receding from this position. "Flabby licurotic sontimentalism" had been talked in defenco of Mr. Simpson's 'appointment. A man of this kind could not bo appointed to a public position without tlio wholo youth of tho country being bot-rayed and tho moral I standard being lowered. It was not ' from a spirit of charity that tho appointment had boon defended, but from i mawkish sentimentality, lie criticised : tho attitude of Mi'. Simpson beforo the committeo, and asked tho Minister for Marino whether 110 believed tho statements put forward by Mr. Simpson in defenco, notably what ho had said about tho magistrate. Mr. Rawson. Either they must cast a slur upon the magistrate or hold that Mr. Simpson had committed deliberate perjury. 110 as--1 sorted that if tho Government kept- Mr. Simpson in office they would tarnish tho reputation of tho whole House and lower tho .moral standard of ithe country. Concerning Party Politics,

Mr. H. ATMORE (Nelson) said that ho llild nover seen a greater illustration of tho folly of party politics than what occurred 011 tlio West-port Harbour Committeo. Tho chairman in his ruling had been absolutely fair, but in his voting absolutely partisan. .Mr.'Lee: I did not vote. Mr. Atmoro said that tho chairman had written in tlio draft report, in his own handwriting, that the hon. member for Nelson was quito justified in bringing tho mat-tor of thu convictions beforo the House. Mr. Lee: I say so now. Mr. Atmoro said that when the chairman came to vote he voted to strike out tho statement that thfe member for Nelson was justified in bringing up tho convictions. Mr. Lee: I did not voto on either occasion. Ho then handed the minutebook of the committeo to Mr. Atmoro. remarking, "Perhaps you would like the minute-book; then you won't make so many mistakes." . Mr. Atmoro declared that tho su>-

pointment of Simpson and Gillen t-o tlio Duard had been lor political purposes. -Alter tlioy were put on the board Mr. Mmiro, wiio was really tho Musscy candidate at last election, although nominally a Labour candidate, was'then made chairman at ,1200 a year. Ho did not blame the Prime Minister for tho appointment;; for this the Minister lor Marino must tako full responsibility, but if the Prime Minister, who should bo all powerful in his Cabinet, allowed Simpson to remain on tho board ho must share the blame, lie said that Mr. Fisher had said in tho House that if the Simpson appointed were proved to bo the man who was. convicted, as alleged, Simpson should either be removed or lie should resign. Now tho Minister said that the circumstances revealed by tho evidence modified this opinion, and he would not tako action to remove him from tho board. Tlio "chain of party" was completed by the fact that Mr. Simpson was defended by Mr. Myers, "the partner of the brains of the Ministry who sits in tiio Upper House." In tho ordinary course part- of the fee paid to him for defending Simpson -and the Reform party would go into the coffers of tho leader of tho party in tho Upper House. He would ask the- Minister whether ho had asked Simpson to resign, and, if not, why ? If tho Government did the right thing they would removo Simpson from tlio Harbour Board. '"Whitewashing" Denied. Mr. J. H. BRADNEY (Auckland West) said ho agreed with the member for Christ-church North on ono pointf only—that the chairman conducted the proceedings fairly. The convictions wero no doubt bad, but there was no other evidence as .to Simpson's charactor,, Ho was appointed on tho recommendation of the Karamea Chamber of Commerce, in his own place of rcsidcnco. It was quito wrong to say that the Minister ought to havo known of the convictions. Even tho member for the district know nothing against tho man's character. Ho repudiated the- suggestion that ho had tried to whitewash tho Minister. Ho was not ono to whitewash anybody, but neither was lie ono to blacken another man's character. In, reply to tho aspor.sions cast upon various members of the committee, himself in-' eluded, ho said: "I hope I may never get so low down as to insult my fellowmembers becauso I don't agreo / with them."

Mr. W. l 11. D'. BELL (Suburbs) said ho had not intended to speak, but ho bad to reply to -certain statements made by Mr. Atmore, to tlio effect that certain moneys to be paid to Mr. M.vers might go into tho pockets of the Minister for internal Aifairs. The fact was that over since tho Minister for Internal Affairs and himself had been in polities a minuto had. been in tho hands of the accountant of their firm instructing him t-o pay ail moneys into a separate account, which ivcro paid for appearance beforo committees of Parliament, or which wero earned in any way in connection with politics, and in these moneys neither tho Minister for Internal Aflair-i nor he shared. .Of course- thero was no virt-uo in this action. It was a courso which any member of tho House would adopt, and a courso which any member of the Houso with any sense of propriety would assume had been adopted. 110 could not say that tiio member for Nelson mado tho reference knowing it to bo untrue, and ho could only assume that tho honourable member had not such a sense of propriety as to assist him to tho conclusion that this courso would be followed. Law and Faot. Mr. R. M'CALLUM (Wairau) declared that the .Minister had acted wrongfully in making tho two appointments, and ho challenged t-lio Minister to show the authority of the Crown Law Officers which justified him in acting as he had. .Mr. C'. E. STATHAM (iiunediu Central) said it had been said that the appointment of Simpson had occasioned disgust ali over tho country, but the committee had :iot had the slightest tittle of evidence, not even a letter or a telegram, that it had occasioned disgust anywhere. He pointed out other mis-statements mado by tha member for Nelson in the Houso —that Simpson had been given threo months W get rid of his license, and that Simpson had been declared to bo unlit to hold a license in an obscuro country hot-el. These statements wero not correct, becauso the Licensing Committeo had decided nothing whatever about Simpson. If the Minister had known of Simpson's convictions, of courso ho would not havo' appointed him, but this did not mean that convictions wero to damn a man for all time, and it was in evidence that Simpson was a. popular man in his own district. There 'had been a great deal of party feeling ill tho. committee, but tlio most extraordinary. featuro of it was that tho Opposition members on it agreed to every clause in the ljeport, but when tho committee refused! to put in tho clause stating that tho-member for Nelson was justified- in bringing tho matter up in tho House as ho had, they would not agree to anything in the report. Beforo that thoy accepted tlio wholo report.

Mr. Isitt and others: No, absolutely wrong.

Government menlbers of the committee: Perfectly right.

Mr. Statham said that their only excuse was that tho wholo thing was a matter of compromise. They would agreo to certain things if the other members of tho committeo would agreo to others which they wanted. If tlioso were the political ideals they had to livo up to, ho was sorry for tho futuro of t-liis country. -Tlio Minister had acted in a case of emcrgoncy—thero was. a deadlock, and 110 was asljpd to act—and he ventured to say, in spite of tile opinion of tiio member for Waiiau, that 110 had acted 011 advice from tlio Crown Law Officers that was legally sound. Evidence had shown that. Simpson was considered a fit and proper person to bo in a public body 011 tlio West Coast, and he personally thought 110 was a fit man to be 011 the Westport Harbour Board. Mr. A. HARRIS (Waitemata) supported tho finding of tlio committee, and deplored tho action of the member forNelson in blackening a man's character for party purposes. Ho at onco exonerated Mr. Atmoro of all desire to do auy harm to Mr. Simpson. Mr. Fisher In Explanation. Tho Hon. F. M. B. FISHER said the Houso had had already his explanation. Ho had gone to tho West Coast, and thero met representative men, whom the member for Buller had sinco described as "a band of larrikins," including tlio Mayor and councillors of Westport, the chairman and members of tho Westport Harbour Board, the chairman and members of the Buller County Council, and the chairman and 1 mcirjiers of the Buller Chamber of' Commerce. Theso were "the band of larrikins." A recommendation had been mado to him that/Sir. Simpson should be appointed a member of tho Westport Harbour Board, and tho recommendation was made to him by rcputablo people. Tie' had discussed Mr. Simpson with Sir. Blackburn, chairman of the Chamber of Commerce at Karamea. Ho admitted that lie was staggered when ho heard in the House the charges of the member for Nelson. He had not heard them up till then, but the curious feature of the whole ease was that notwithstanding the fact that the affair had been mentioned in every newspaper in New Zealand, not a single witness had been brought before the committee, nnd not a letter or a telegram had reached him objecting to tho appointment of Mr. Simpson. What was the reason for it? The reason was that Mr. Simpson was a very popular and very highlyicspeeted citizen ill the district in which he lived. And although he had made the statement in the House that if (lie cbaifea wero proved to bo true he 1 would ask Mr. Simpson to roßiira. tho.

evidence at llic inquiry had modified liis opinion. Ho challenged the legal opinion of the member for Wairau thatlie had no right under the Act to mako the two appointments to the board. Ho explained also that tlic reason why tho committee had struck out of tho report the words Unit the member lor Nelson was justified in making the statement in tho House was that the order of reference of the committee was that it should inquire into the action of the Minister for Marine, and not the member for Nelson. It was not true, as had been alleged, that tho appointment was a political one. There was no Rcfonn party there, so that tho appointment could not have been a political appointment. it was not- a matter of common knowledge that Simpson had been convicted, and it was admitted by all members of tho committees that lie did not know of tho convictions at tho ti;no ho made the appointment. Ho went on to explain how he had consulted the Crown Law Offico before appointing Gillcn and Simpson, and satisfied himself that the appointments wero urgently necessary and could bo legally made.

Acted Straightforwardly. Resuming after tho dinner adjournment, Mr. Fisher spoke again of tho legality or otherwise of his action 111 appointing two members to the "Westport Harbour Board. He traversed tho law on tho subject in detail with intent to show that lie had full power to mako tho appointments ill tho way he had. Tho. appointments, it was alleged, wore to tho eternal disgrace of tho Minister for Marine. Surely it was unfair for tho member for Nelson to bring tho matter up in tho House as ho had without bringing tho mail Simpsou's character under tlio Minister s notice. Of courso if ho had known of tho convictions ho wouhr never havo appointed Simpson. Mr. Atmoro s charges woro biased, and lie thought full of malice. Mr. M'Callum: Is that parliament-

tary? , . Mr. Fislicr: I don't know, but it is | true. Ho went on to say that if ho wished to do so lie could not- now remove Simpson from the board, having 110 power to do so. To show that Simpson's appointment was not an unpopular olio ho quoted extracts irom tlio nowspapcrs of the district, one of tho two of which was opposed to tlio Government. The local bodies in tlio district had also passed resolutions in favour of Sjmpson. In the faco of such subsequent to'all that Mr. Atmore had said, one had to modify the opinions formed at the time Mr. Atmoro made the statement in the House. Ho had acted in tlio matter as straightforwardly as he possibly could. Ho was not going to search the police records to discover what a man's past had been before appointing him to a ■ publio position. Mr. J. A. HA NAN (Invercargill) said it-would come as a surprise to supporters of tlio Government to learn that the man Simpson was a fit and proper person to represent tlio Government or. tlio Wcstport Harbour Board. It had been proved 'that ho had had a discreditable past, but lie was stilly accepted as a lit man to sit oil the AVostport Harbour Board. Very few-right-thin king pcoplo would endorse tlio Government' view that a man with Simpson's record was fit to represent the country on an important publio body.The same pcoplo would applaud Mr Atmore's action in drawing public attention to the appointment.' Tho least the Government could do,- if they could not legally remove Simpson from the board, was to ask him to resign. Ho dcprccated tlio action of'the committee in refusing to allow it to go on record that Mr. Atmoro was justified in bringing tho rase before the House. Why would not tlio Government ask him to resign: Mr. Colvin's Grievance. Mr. J. COLVIN • (Buller) said his attitude in tho matter was different from that of other • members of the committeo. No placo was So much interested 111 tlio .harbour as. the town of Westport, and yet the Minister had chosen a young man, with 110 oxperienco m public lifo or public works, reared in a. public-houso in Ivarainea, 50 miles from Westport, to plant him 011 tlio Harbour Board. There were hundreds of men, good reformers, too, in Westport, who would havo boon suitable for tho appointmcnt, mid lie did not see why tlio Minister should havo appointed a man from another district. It was impossible to expect fair play from a Parliamentary committee constituted as this committee was.

Convictions and "Language." Mr. R. SCOTT (Otago Central) said the honourablo mcmbei: for Bullor always tried to bo fair. In this caso lie stopped short, of the crucial point ot wliv ho did not approve of tho appointment of Mr. Simpson. It camo out at tho committee tliat there was jealousy between AVestport and, lOuamca, ivl)icli was a port and would possibly become a competing port, and lie believed that if a man bad been appointed from AVcstport, oven if be had no hotter character than Simpson, Mr. Colvin would have raised no objection to the appointment. At tlio committee Simpson and his friends had given evidence in a straightforward, manly way, which must have appealed to unbiased members of * the committee. There had been convictions against him, but there were many other peoplo who bad convictions. Had tho 1110111ber for Cbristcliurch North 110 convictions? Tho member for AVairau? Or the member for Nelson? Much was made of tho laiifitiago used by Simpson, but lie might have had provocation. Had any of the honourable gontlemeii, the member for Cliristchurch North, ever driven bullocks? Or worked degs on a rough 'hill-side? • Or played golf? 'Mr. Ifiitt: Yes. Mr. Seott: Then I think the honourable gentleman may have said a naughty word or two. He concluded by saying that ho' was in accord with the finding of tho committee. An Amendment,

Mr. G. W. RUSSELL (Avon) said' it was a sad business altogether. It had boon suggested by Mr. Scott that the convictions against Mr. Simpson wore of. no consequence, hut although Mr. Scott had made very clover _ remarl;® on. tho subject, it was a serious matter that tho man who was now a member of the Harbour Board had been convicted of obscenc language. Hp referred to what ho called the political aspect of the case. It had bcero necessary, ho said, to gazette two men out of tho Harbour Hoard in order that two other men might be put on tho board who would vote to' make Mr. Mu.nro, tho Reform party candidate at last election, and the prospective Reform candidate at next election-, chairman of tho Harbour Hoard at £200 a year. Having decided upon this course, tho .Minister went 50 miles wivay to one of the smallest ridings in the county of Bulle-r to find a candidate. The fact was that the Ministe.r went to Karamoa one night, had a good evening there, met Simpson, and no doubt found him a jovial fellow. Flo therefore chose him as a slandaid of Reform on the West Coast. The man had never been on a local body until a few months previously, but the harbour of West-port was one of the most important in the country, and one in which tho State had a big financial interest. He said freely that ill.' Minister for Marino did not know of th;j convictions at the time he mado tlu appointment; but lie declared that tli-.' Minister ought to have produced the opinion of the Crown Law Officers to show the House on what authority ho had :u ted in removing two men from the Harbour Hoard, and appointing two (.tiler-:. He agreed that convictions should not be counted against a man for all time, but a man must at- least live convictions down before being appointed to a liijih public position. Simpson's

convictions were too recent; lie had not r o-ostu Ij ii si jot 1 himself yet as «. decent member <)1 society- Iho least the (no\crnnicnt ooulcl do was to ask Smipson (■a resign from the hoard. He moved, |,v wav of amendment, the tollowmg addition to tho report of.the commitU, o; _»Tliat in the opinion of tins House tlie rccord of Mr. W. R. Simpson makes it undesirable that he should 1 remain on tho Westpnrt Harbour Hoard as a nu'iiibw nominated by tlie (»ovenimeiit, and that tlie Government should take the necessary stops to terminate the appointment." 1 . . . Mr. J. PAYNE (Grey Lynn) seconded the amendment. Mr. (I. BORISES (Hnrunni) supported the amendment, and urged members to vote for it in the intciests of clean government. Ho did not believe thero would be tiro slightest difficulty in the way of the Minister removing Simpson from tho board if lie chose to do so. lie contended that the people of this country wero anxious that no mail should bo appointed to a. public position who had not qualilicu for it bv good. citizenship. Mr. L. M. ISITT (Christchurch North) supported the amendment. He said that ho had been accused of displaying a very uncharitable and bitter spirit in reference to tliis matter. . lie had endeavoured to avoid party bitterness and to look at the matter in a broad spirit. He could not understand tho statement of tho Minister for Marine that ho believed Mr. Simpson s testimony. Ho did not believe that tho Prime Minister or tho Minister for Justiee would accept tho-ex parte and unsupported statements of this man against tho recorded convictions of tho Magistrate. Mr. Isitt said that ho believed that Mr. Simpson, in his desire to clear himself, had committed perjury. Ho again appealed to the Prime Minister to sink party, aud to romovo tho difficulty by saying that steps would be taken to remove Mr. Simpson.- If tho Prime Minister did tliis, so far from doing his. party any harm ho would do it au infinity of good. Opposition Ccneroslty. Mr. 11. M'CALLUM (Wnirau) said that tho Opposition imputed nothing t6 the Minister for Mariuo. In this ho considered that they wero exceedingly generous. It amounted to withdrawing tlie. charges that tho Minister had removed Messrs, Foster and Hanson from tho Wcstport Harbour Board to enable Sir. Munro to obtain tho chairmanship and £200 a year. Mr. G. LAURENSON .(Lyttelton) said that tho Opposition had shown itself ready to accept a reasonable compromise, but the dominant sect-ion on the committeo had taken up an. unreasonable attitude. Tho Opposition mom berg on the oommitteo would have been satisfied if a clause had been added to tho report stating that the. member for Nelson was justified in bringing the matter up.

THE DIVISION. AMENDMENT THROWN OUT. . When tlio Speaker proceeded to put the amendment at 10.40 p.m., Mr. Lee' asked whether lio would loso tlio right to reply on tlio main question if lio spoke to the amendment. On being informed that he would, lie resumed his seat. Mr. Atinore essayed to speak as tlio Speaker called for "ayes," but was a 'shade too late, and tlio voto. was taken. A division yas called for, and apart from all that had gone before, tbo aspect of the House plainly indicated that tlio lines of party would be. sharply drawn. % The amendment was negatived by 41 votes to 26. Tlio division was announced as: 41 votes abainst tlio' amendment and 26 for it, but subsequently,, as explained below, Mr. Glover's name' was added to the "Ayes." Following was tlio division list: — Against the amendment (41): Alien, Anderson, Bell, J. Bollard, R. F. Bollard, Bradney, Buchanan, Buick, Campbell, Clark, Coatcs, Dickson, Escott, Fisher, Fraser, Guthrie, Harris, Herdman, Herries, Hine, Hunter, Lee, Malcolm, Mander, Massoy, A. If. Newman, Nosworthy, Okey, Poaree, ' Pomarc, Reed, R. H. Rhodes, T. W. Rhodes, Scott, F. H. Smith', Stathani,, Sykes, G. M. Thomson, Wilkinson, . Wilson, Young. For tlio amendment (27): Atniore, Brown, Buddo, Buxton, Colvin, Craigio, Dickie, Ell, Forbes, Glover, Hanan, Hindmarsh, Isitt, Laurenson, M'Ci>lhim, Mac Donald. .Millar, Myers, Ptyyitc, Poland, Robertson, Russell, Seddon, Sidey, Ward, Wilford, Witty. An Overlooked "Aye." before tbo House adjourned, tlio Speaker's attention was directed to the fact that Mr. A. E. Glover, although in the House at tlio time, had not recorded his vote in tbo division taken about an hour previously. Mr. Glovi'r said tbo time seemed to have oome when every member liad to voto for himself. Ho had many times obliged other members. Ex-Mmisters of the Crown had said to him: ' Albert Edward, would you kindly record my vote?" and he had always done so. He would, have voted with the Ayes. Mr. E. P. LEE (Oamaru) rose to reply on the main question as soon as tlio'result of the division had been aiij nounccd. lie said that tbo. whole ot tbo inquiry before tlio Comniittco was into tlio conduct of the Minister for Marino. , Mr. Isitt-: What about my amendment? . , , , , Mr. Leo said that it had been shown to the satisfaction of every member of the Committee and of the Housothat tlio Minister for Marino had no knowledge of the conviction against Mi. Simpson when ho made the appointment. Ho went- on-to review m detail tlio circumstances leading up to the appointment, stating that,tlio Minister made tbo usual inquiries and was informed that Simpson was a fit- and proper person to bo appointed. Opposition members had stated that Mr. Simpson had been convicted of using language of tlio grossest and foulest kind. Thero was not ono word ot evidence beforo the Committee, - however, as to what tlio language was, and tbo convicting magistrate had considered it sullicient to impose a fine of ten slnl""jlr, Isitt: Do you remember that the mail's solicitor stopped lum repeating the languago beforo tlio Committee, and said: "Don't repeat it . Mr. Leo said that- thero was no doubt that- tlio member for Nelson had been within his rights in making Jus charges, but he considered that in making them Mr. Atmoro had used ■ illiuciged language. _ . I ' Mr. Atmore: That is your opinion. No Disgrace. Mr. Lee said that the appointment was possibly 0110 that would not liavo been made with a fulf knowledge of the circumstances, but thero was 110 disgrace. Tlio member for Nelson had 110 right to say that the appointment was a disgraceful one. Tbo Opposition members on the comniittco had not said that Mr. Atmoro was justified in saying that the appointment was a disgraceful one. They had. said that his criticism of tlio apopiutmcnt was warranted. Government members held that tlio criticism was r.ot warranted. The meaning of tlio division which had just een taken was that members on tlio other side of tlicy Houso approved entirely of the report brought down,if the Government would dismiss this man. The ir ember for Christ-cliurch North had said that if Simpson' had come along and admitted his past offences he would not have pressed for his removal from the board. Mr. Isitt considered that there was nothing very serious against tlll's man. Mr. Isitt: That is not so. Mr. Lee siad that Opposition members had asked the Government to .set aside all the support that Mr. Simpson was receiving on die Coast. One of the

signatories to a petition in favour pf Simpson was a leading Prohibitionist. Mr. Isitt: Must bo a beauty—a credit to tho causo—that man. Mr. Leo said that tho member for Nelson had gono too far in an attempt to make party capital. Ho would not say that Mr. Atmoro was not man enough, but he had not tho judgment to admit it. Ho hoped that ill future when, the member for Nelson spoke ho would' think. Mr. Atinore: He is thinking of you now. No division was called for, and the motion that tho report lie oil the tablo was agreed to on the voices. THE ARBITRATION BILL, Mr. SPEAKER read to the Housi tho reasons for disagreeing with tho amendments mado in tho Industrial Conciliation Amendment Bill by the Legislative Council. Tho PRIME MINISTER said that a' dangerous position would be created if tho amendment mado by tho Legislative Council wore, agreed to. An industrial agreement affected thoso who mado it. An award affected the whole: of an industrial district and might affect tho whole Dominion. An indus-, trial agreement should not bo mado an award automatically without tho Judge and other lnembcrß of the Arbitration Court being consulted. Tho reasons wero approved, and it' was agreed that tlioy should bo trans* mitted to tho Legislative Council. The House roso at 11.37 p.m.