A BONE OF CONTENTION.

Dominion, Volume 6, Issue 1817, 1 August 1913, Page 6

A BONE OF CONTENTION.

MR GARLICK'S APPOINTMENT

parties at daggers drawn. The. Hon. A. L. HEROMAN moved: "That tho statements made in Parliament by the members for Hult, Invercargill, H'urimiii, and Lytlclton respectively, and appearing in Hansard, with reference to tho appointment of tho Director of Phr-

sical Education 1m referred to a Select Committee for imjiiiry, tho committee (o have power to call for persons and papers and to report to the House within fourteen days. Tlii! committee lo consist of: Messrs. Guthrie. Malcolm, E. Newman, Poland, Sidcy, Statham, .). C. Thomson, CI. Al, Thomson, Yciteh, and the mover."

Casually Interested. Air. T. Al. WILFOIID (Hutt) said that he was casually interested in the motion, lie would submit the names of witnesses to the Minister, but would not bear tho expense of bringing them to Wellington. He was "a prisoner at the lwr,'' charged with a serious ofl'or.ce before a committee picked by his learned friend. Tlio eommitteo consisted of five Government members and four 011 tho other side. The Government members would elect one of their minilier as chairman, so that the relative odds were G to i on. Ho wished to know whether the Minister would provide tlio funds to bring witnesses from a distance. Wliilo ho was willing to give the names of witnesses, ho would not pay their railway fares. Ho wanted to bring a Swedish drill expert from Eltham, ail expert physical culturist from Auckland, 0110 witness from Alnsterton, four from Wellington city, one from Christchurch, and 0110 from the Department controlled by Air. Royd Garlick. , Air. Wilford declared that 110 was not going to lose anything except the time spent in attending tile committee and cross-examining tlio Alinister for Finance. That would be absolute "joy." He was glad the AiiUlster had set up tho inquiry, and "didn't care tuppence" what the result might bo. Ho had received shoals of letters from different parts of tho country, and from oditors of local papers, including ono from the editor of a straight-out Reform paper. Air. Wilford went 011 to stato that he knew that ho had not "Buckley's chance" of getting off the charge, but 110 knew that New Zealand was with him, and didn't care what anybody said. Why, 110 asked, had Air. Herdman brought up this motion instead of the Alinister for Education, against whom a charge was brought? Another tiling he wanted to know was why ho tliad not been allowed to pick his ow-n jury, like Mr. Fisher. Also, he had sail that Air. Allen had done a wrong and unconstitutional thing. Why was lie not charged with this? A[r. W. A, YEITC'H. (Wangnnni) asked that his name should be removed from tho committee nnd replaced by that of Air. Hindmarsh. This was agreed to. "A Farcical Proposal." . Air. Ct. W. RUSSELL (Avon) said that it must be recognised 011 both sides of the House that this proposal was a farce. What was tho order of reference? The committee, was asked to have a general row by dissecting certain passages from "Hansard." lir. Wilford had said that tho most important charge he had mado had not been included. If the Government intended that there .should be a genuine inquiry it should havo provided a clear-cut order of reference. Air. Alsssey: What is wrong with tho order of reference? Air. Russell said that lie contended that thare was no order of reference. A 9 things stood there would inevitably be ,1 quarrel as scon as tho committee assembled.

Air. Wilford: Let it go. It will be great fun.

Air. Russell said that they wero not looking for fun. It was farcical to set up a committee consisting of six Government members and four oil tho other si do of the House, and those were to bo tho judges of "this putrid scandal put upon this country by tho Alassoy Government." Ho contended that the different sides of tho House should be equally represented 011 the committee, but this tho Government dare not grant. Tho Government, whatever they did, would bo unable lo whitewash th.e Alinister or to remove an impression "that there had been a horrible measure of unconstitutional action and dishonour to the Public Servico and of this country by the action they had taken." The member for Hutt would have the time of liis life at tho inquiry, but the result would bo a farce.

Tho Press Wanted. Mr. J. A. HANAN (Invercargill) saicl that they wanted tho Houso and., tho, country to understand the position before the committee sat at all. They, wanted to know whether witnesses would be called, and whether a full public inquiry would be held. A partisan commit,teo was being set up. Ho had said and 110 re-, poated that applications should havo been called for the position conferred on Air. Royd Garlick. They wanted an inquiry at which the press would bo present. Atr. G. W. FORBES (Hurunui) objected that no attempt had been made to definitely specify fclio statements objected to. Ho considered that the Alinister. by appointing Air. Royd Garlick, had sliowu himself unfit to control tlio Department of Education.

Oil and Kerosene. Air. Jj. Al. ISITT (Christchurch North) said tliat he wanted to pour oil on troubled waters. The member's 011 his side had 110 sympathy with tho exigency of ths Government. Air. Alassoy: Is this kerosene? Mr. 'Isitt said that the Government had boon guilty of one of the most flagrant appointments ever known. If the Government held that it was ready to meet a fair trial it should refer this matter to thb Education. Committee. But the Government knew that its only chanco was to set up a packed committee.

Mr. lsitt continued the discussion--when tho House resumed after tlio dinner adjournment.' lie described Mr. Boyd Garlick as "a masseur" who had "scribbled" through a courss in Swedish drill in Australia, and had bluffed the Minister. Ho asserted, amidst a storm ci interjeotions, that Government members had for days maintained tho"silen<x> of guilt and shame" under tiro assaults of the Opposition. Mr. Isitt provoked a roar of laughter from the Government benchos by suggesting that -tlic Minister should confess that lie had made a mistake, and not waste the timo of the House ill the proposed inquiry.

Mr. A. S. MALCOLM (Clutha) urged that, as Chairman of Committees, ho should not be .asked to sit upon a committee into the proceedings of which a certain amount of party feeling was likely to be imported. The Hon. A. L. HERDMAN moved that Mr. Malcolm's name .be omitted from tlio committee, and that of Mr. E. Scott (Otogo Central) substituted.

This was agreed to. "A Cut-and-Dried Verdict." Mr. G. LAURENSON (Lyttelton) objected to tho constitution of tho committer contending that the verdict was cut and dried before tho committee had been set up. (Government denials.) Oppositionists were not soft and simple enough to bslievc that the position was otherwise than as he had stated. He went on to criticise the action of the Government ill appointill? Mr. lioyd Garlick without calling applications. Knowing pretty well what the verdict of the com.mitteo would be, Oppositionists lipid that the proposed inquiry would merely wnste the time of the House. He protested against this new departure in Parliamentary procedure in New- Zealand.

"Serving Up Garlick," The Hon. P. M. B. PISUEiR said that tho action of the Opposition was unreasonable. lie defended tho constitution of thn committee. Only 21 hours ago the member for Avon had said: "Give us the file," and had demanded an inquiry. "Wo have hoard nothing but 'Garlick,' 'Garlick,' 'Garlick.' since tho session started," declared the Minister.

The Prime Minister: Tt will bo "leek," "M;," "leek," presently.

Mr. Fisher said that the Opposition had demanded an inquiry and now tho Govornmont intended to serve up Garlick end give the Opposition the Garlick file. Thev were going to let iho Opposition see the file and every paper in it.

Mr. RusrMi: Why didn't you put mo on the Committee then?

Mr. Fisher said that the file and all papers would be placed before the Committee. Every opportunity would be given to call evidence and examine witnesses. Yet the Opposition were whining and whiriinoring. Tho Opposition had used this Gat'liolc charge against the Government. 11 was the one, appointment in twelve months 011 which they could nut their fingers. It was almost tho o'uly anpointmonl that had been used in flic House I his session. Objection was taken that the Committee included six Government members' and lour Oppositionists. This was tho usual constitution of a committee and always would tie. The case would l>o decided 011 its merits.

Mr. Itussell: There aro no merits on your side.

Then,, if there aro no merits on this side, asked Mr. Fisher, why

aro ynu afraid to go to the Committee? Would the lion, gentleman tell him what the proportion of members was on the Committee that heard tho Hino charges? ' Mr, Isitt: Two wrongs don't make a right. Mr. Fisher: I am very glad tho honourable gentleman admits that his side was wrong on that occasion. Tho honourable gentleman, he said, should remember that for 21 years the party now i:. power had had to put up with 7 to 3. Mr. Russell: When yonr party consisted of 15 members. Mr. Fisher: How many does yours consist of now? Mr. Russell: Thirty-efelit. Mr. Fisher: Tho honourable gentleman lias not got a party at all. .The Ways of Old. Now. that the matter was going to a Committee, ho continued, there would bo a clianco of going into the merits of applicants and would-be applicants to the position, and ho thought tho propor courso for tlio House to take was to allow tho nifltter to go to a Committee. Tlio merits could be discussed afterwards. Jt was not fair to discuss tlio rights and wrongs of it without having heard all the evidence. What was the causo of the agitation on tho other side of tho House? It was not an agitation against Mr. Itoyd Garliek as n man unfit for tho position, but an agitation on bphalf of tho people who didn't get tho billet.

Mr. Eussell: It's tho principle at stake. ill 1 . Fisher: Tlioro is 110 principle at stake. l)id tho honourable gentleman on tlio other side advertiso when they wanted a magistrate? Mr. lVl'Callum: Tho Judges appoint tilOlll. Mr. Fisher: Tho Judges appoint them! Why, when you wanted magistrates you took them out of your political federations. Mr. M'C'allum: Name one. ilr. Fisher: Jiamo one! J[ will name two if you like—Mr. Husolden is ono and Mr. Poynton is another. Mr. Forbes: Wore they good men? Mr. Fisher: They made good magistrates—very good indeed.' Mr. Foroes: Exactly. Mr. F'isher: Well, give Mr. Garliek a chance, and see if he does not justify his appointment. Tlio other side were always now crying for purity, but he had heard the statement made oy a member of tho late Government party, that ho was a •'labour agent, a billet-getter of the first water." That sort of tiling had been stopped. Even if this appointment should prove to be a faulty one, the' Government lind secured that no such appointment could bo made in tho, future. He hoped the evidence before the committee would be such that the committee would bo able to come to a unanimous decision.

An Amendment. Mr. H. ATMORE (Nelson) said ho would move an amendment that the namo of Mr. Guthrie be struck from tho committee, and that of Mr. Buxlon inserted in his stead. Mr, SPEAKER ruled this motion out of order, on the ground that a lator amendment had been carried. Whereupon Mr. Atrnoro nominated, first Mr. E. Newman as tho member to bo struck off tho committee, but finally named the mover, tho lion. A. L. Heraman.

The Hon. W. F. MASSEY asked whether the motion was in order. Mr. SPEAKER held that it was. Mr. W. NOSWORTHY (Ashburtonj said lie was surprised at tho Opposition making tho statements they had about this appointment. When the late Government was going out of office Sir Joseph Ward had taJcen care to put his private secretary, Mr.-Hislop, into a fat billet as Under-Secretary for internal Affairs, over and above tho heads of men who had worked for years in the Public Service. Mr. Buddo: He was senior man. Mr. Nosworthy: That's all political cant and political humbug. Wliat did the other Public Servants think of that appointment? Who made that appointment? Your lato Prime Minister, Sir Joseph Ward. Speeches in very bad taste had come from a number of mem-, bers on the other sido' of the House. They had aped a tone of" purity, but -their-party' had a"record ! of' 'political influence. A Small Party, Mr. J. PAYNE (Grey Lynn) read extracts from a, Wanganui paper in support of a contention that if considerations of merit and fitness had ruled when tho appointment was made, another person, whom he named, would have obtained t'tiu appointment. He urged the Government to set up a connnittco consisting of six Oppositionists and four of its own members.

Mr. D. BUDDO (ICaiapoi) said that tho appointment of Mr. Koyd Garlick was entirely indefensible. iiie Liovcmmcnt had not defended it, and practically admitted that an improper appointment had been made. He contended that tho Opposition had not been given its fair share of representation upon the . Committee. He defended Mr. Hislop's appointment by t'ho Ward Government as Under-Secretary for Internal Affairs. Ho stated that at tho timo when tho appointment was mado there was no officer in tho Internal Affairs Department who had seen half the service that Mr. Hislop had to his credit. It was true that tho position was not advertised. Vacancies for heads of Departments never were. Thcro wero two applicants for the position conferred upon Mr. Hislop, and ho did not believo that a better appointment could have been made. It was one of ability and seniority,and 0110 approved by tho wholn of tile Civil Service. Ho did not think that another member of the House than, the member for Ashburton would, get up and cavil at Mr. Hislop's appointment. "A Low Level." Mr. G. W. RUSSELL (Avon) said that the Junior Government Whip (Mr. Nosworthy) had placed tho case for his side upon a very low level. Ho had said that the appointmeut of Mr. Garlick was 110 worse than that of Mr. Hislop. Mr. Russell defended tho appointment of Mr. Jlislop on lines similar to thos'o taken by Mr. Buddo. Tha member for Avon strongly supported tho amendment moved by tho member for Nelson. He would not bo ablo to see tho file relating to Mr. Garlick's appointment until tho Committee had reported. . Had. Mr. Garlick, ho asked, been appointed for a term ?

Thio'Hon. Jas. Allen: Under tho Public Service ,Act.

Mr. Russell said that tlio Opposition were defending a principle. Ho asserted that in making tho appointment tho Government had gono back 011 its professed intention of doing away with nepotism. Ho went 011 to criticise the appointment in detail. Prime Minister Replies, Tho PRIME MINISTER said that tho member for Lyttelton and tho member for Avon had dono him tho honour of quoting from ono of his (tho Prime Minister's) speeches a paragraph that contained a very proper sentiment. It was that tho son of a man earning Bs. or 10s. a day had' tho samo right to an appointment in tho Public Service, other things being equal, as tho son of a Minister of the Crown or of an influential member of Parliament. This was tho principle for which tho Government had contended and which it had carried out in appointing the Public Scrvico Commission. Appointments were now mado by merit, and tho Government had dono away with all cliancs of political inilueneo or political patronage. Ho honestly believed that if the Public Service Commission had been in oflico at tlio time tlioy would have appointed Mr. Boyd Garlick, ju>t as tho Minister for Education had done, because the appointment had Ix'.Mi made on merit. He had boon asked whether ho thought that thcro was no other mail in (lie counlrv bettor fitted for (h u ) ti en ill all Air. V.cyd Garlick. Ho dud U'jt know that there wa<?. It was not hi'? busings to I soli into (he ap]'.oiiil.inc.n:t at (he timo. but from what. 110 had liwird ho did not Urfievo that there a more suitable man' to take up the position than Mr. Hoy;! Garlick. Jlr. Poyno; Absolutely, yes. Mr. ilns.-:oy said that members (in the other side affected to smile at the act ion of the Government, in setting up this eammittco, but thcro was littlo music in their mirth.

"Fair Means or Foul," Honourable members 011 tho other side had made up their minuls that, tliey would find something to dlisercdit the Government. by fair means or foul. They had found the appointment of ILr. Koy,i Garlic];, awl were cbiiix this man 'a Very serious injustice. Ho had nowt met Mi'. Garlick, but if he was a sensitive man ho must have suffered very mucli as n

| result of what had bora said in the House. Mr. Isitt: What about Cheviot? Mr. Massey said that tho member who had raised ft question about Cheviot would bo very sorry that ho had dono so, If tho honourable member had aaiythiug to say aboijt his administration ho wag quite willing to refer it .to a committee.

Milk in the Coconut. Not a member of tho Opposition sida would admit to following the niomlxT lor Avon, but ho was a self-constituted leader. . This Loader af tho Opposition had said the appointment of tho committee was "piititid"—isomclhins wry bad about it. liad tho honourable member over seen a committee of ten mom bora on which tho Government did .not liavo at least six n.embers? Tho Hino Committee had, for instance, had six Govern- ™"' supporters and four Oppositionists, illo honourable g rt .iitlcjiKUL had asked that the press should Iks present at tlio committee proceedings. To this proposal ha would not have tlie slightest objection. Mr. Forbes: Will you pay tho witliessoss«. expanses? Mr. Massey: I advise tho honourable gentleman not to say too much about W'Hiiessess expenses, becauso that brills up tfia poiiut in connection w.ith tho expenses of witnesses that appeared before the Hino Committee. Mr. Hino paid tho expenses of his own witnesses, and tlio expenses of thoso who appeared for tlio Government wore paid for bv tho taxpu *- ere of this country. " Mr. Leo; Who'paid counsel? Mr. Masse?; .said lie thought lio wa right in saying that tho law costs paid to olio firm by tho Government amounted to.over JifiOO. Mr. Hine had, of course, paid his own costs. Mr. -Massey went on to cito a case of what ho declared was "a job"—tho payment of JIGOO. J?3 3s. a day for 200 days, to a man who actal ( as assistant-groom and assistant-cook in tho camp of valuers at .Flaxbourne, when that estate was being valued for purchase by the Government. This man did no other work, but ho got nil this money from tho taxpayers. "It turned out afterwards," 1:o said, "that tho Mr. Tattle referred to had at ona time been a clerk in tho office of Sir John Findlay. X think that accounts for the milk in the coconut." Ho concluded by saving that lio thought the Committee would bo satisfied that tho Government had dono tho right thing in appointing Mr. Koyd Garliek.

Tho Wrangle Continued. Mr, R. M'CALLUM (Wairau) said that the man Tattle had not been assistantgroom or assistant-cook, lio was' in charge of the surveyors, ami in charge of tho camp, and had managed the camp exceedingly well. The witness who had Ifivoni tho cvidenco on which Mr. Massey relied had a bitter feeling against .Mr. Tattle. He (Mr. M'Calluni) was present in tho camp, and ho know all that took place. Mr. .T. A. II ANA N (Invcrcargill) saw in tho referenco to something irregular at the camp at Plnxbourne a reflection against the lato Mr. Seddon, and lio was indignant that tho Government sliould mako a charge against a dead man. Mv. G, W. FORBES (Huruuui) supported the amendment.

Tho amendment was defeated by 38 votes to 20. Following was tho division list :—

For tho amendment (20)—Atmorc, Buddo, Buxton, Colvin, Davey, Forbes, H'anan, Ilindmarsh, Isitt, Laurenson, M'Callum, Mactfonald, Parata, Russell, 1 Seddon, J. C. Thomson, Yeitch, Webb, Wilford, Witty. Against (30)—Allen, Anderson, Bell, J.

Bollard, R. F. Bollard, Bradney, Buchanan, Buicl:, Campbell, Clark, Ooates, Dickson, Escott, Fisher, Frascr, Guthrie, Harris, Ilerdnian, Herries, Kino, Lee, Malcolm, Mander, Massey, A. K. Newman, Nosworthy, Okej', Pearce, Pomare, Reed, R. 11. Rhodes, T. W. Rhodes, Scott, Sykes, Wilson, Young.

Mr. Millar Added to Committee. At 10.7 p.m., Tho Hon. A. L. lIERDMAN rose to reply. Ho said that somo comment had been mado alwut tho ' personnel of tho Committee. Ho would nvalco this offer to tho honourable gentlemen opposite, an offer .which would remove qvory possible objection, to" tho 'personnel of tho Committee—that tho Honourable Mr. Millar bo added to tho Committee. Mr. Millar was a fair man, and if lionourablo gentlemen desired- to havo tho Committea strengthened ho was perfectly willing-to increase tho number of members to eleven and to add Mr. Millar to it. Mr. G. W. RUSSELL (Avon) said tlie Opposition would accept live Minister s offer, ami he thanked the Minister for it.. Tho namo of tho Hon. J. A. Millar wa3 added to tho Committee, and tho motion as amended was carried.

A CHRISTCHURCH BILL. Mr. T. H. DAVEY (Christchurch Bast} moved tho second reading: of tho Christchurch Electrical Einpowcrinß Bill, a machinery Bill, cmpowerta'ty the Christchurch City Council 'to raiso funds and. make loans to ratonayors ill connection with tho electrical reticulation of the The Bill was road a sccontl time on the voiccs.

MR, WILFORD'S GAMING BILL. A FINAL STROKE. The next item on the Order Tnpcr vr<M the adjourned debate lijioii the second reading of Mr. T. M. Wilford's Gamins Amendment Bill.

. Tho PRIME MINISTER said that it would not bo of much use continuing tho discussion at that hour; there had been two lato nights and ho proposed to movo tho axljournmcnt. Mr. T. M. AVILFORD (Hutt) hoped that tho l'rinio Minister would not press tlio motion. They had not, had .1 very strenuous day, and ho wanted to reply to some of the misrepresentations to which the Bill had been subjected. _ He asked the Prime Minister, with his "brutal majority," to'grant say two hours in which to continue the discussion upon tlio Bill.

Tlio PRIME MINISTER said that ho did not want to treat tho hon. gentleman unfairly, but lie knew perfectly well that his Bill had 110 c.hance at that hour. Mr. Masscy added that he and other members had had tho heaviest two days of tlio session, and ho thought they would l:o wiso to adjourn and start fresh on the following day. The House mso at 10.49 p.m.