POOR PRISONERS' DEFENCE

Dominion, Volume 6, Issue 1557, 28 September 1912, Page 6

POOR PRISONERS' DEFENCE

A NEW PROPOSAL. Tho Hon. A. L. lIERDMAN moved the second reading of. the Justices of the Peace Amendment; Bill. It empowers Justices of the Peace, under certain circumstances, to provide counsel for accused persons 011 tlieir being committed for trial. The Bill also empowers Judges of tho Supreme . Court to assign counsel to neensed persons. Mr Herdman said that he had introduced the Bill at tho suggestion of Mr. Hanan. Messrs. G. WITTY and G. W. RUSSELL congratulated the Government upon introducing the Bill. Mr. Russell said that the Bill did not go so far as he would lilco to see it go,- but was nevertheless a substantial step forward. Sir JOSEPH WAJRD (Awaruo) abo £ct

licitated the Minister on having adopted suggestion contained in the Governor's Speech of the February session. Tho reversal of the Minister's opinion was most interesting to him, /'an innocent observer." He declared that the Government Bill would put into effect the proposal put forward then by tho Ward Government.

Mr. Bell: Oh, 110. This wasn't your pvoposal..

Sir Joseph Ward went on to quote certain facetious references made by Mr. Hcrdman when in Opposition on this clause of tho Governor's Speech. Now tilo Minister was of another opinion, and ii W r% la 11,111 earnest." That was tho difference between irresponsibility and tho responsibility of office. He thought tho Government should go further and set up a Bureau of Justice in tho larger i?-n ns ' /, u tllo Meantime ho accepted the iJUI on tho principle that half a loaf waa better than no bread, and he would support it heartily. ~s ' r - ' T- (Grey Lynn) olso urged that tho Bill should provide more facilities for poorer people to get justice from the Courts.

Jf'CALLUM (Wairauj said that the Bill should provide for Crown defenders in the lower court as in the upper (X3nrl. Frequently irreparable errors were made by undefended prisoners in the lower xY aml cou . nsel could not do anything the case in the upper court. Jl T - T i; (Hutt) said that although there had previously been no law on tho Statute Book like the one under ,renew, it had been tho practice for judges to ask counsel to defend, prisoners who needed assistance. - And no counsel would ever refuse to act under such circumstances or to ask for a fee for his service, it was accounted an honour to be asked by a, judg;e to act. lie did not think the legal bureau scheme would work out well. i (Palmerston) said he was pleased to hear from the honourable gentleman that there was a fine esprit dc corps among lawyers, and he hoped tho Bm would not detract from that fino 6pint.

The Hon. A. L. HERDMAN, in reply, repudiated the statement that he had now advocated anything like the proposal put , - v , Government. This 1 did not embody their scheme, which P r ®®tically. to establish legal bureaus, llio Bill was read a' second- time on the voices. ' PHARMACY BILL. NOT FOR HERBALISTS. ■ The Hon. R. H. RHODES (Postmasterveneral) moved the second reading of the Pharmacy Amendment Bill. Ho explained that the effect _of the Bill was to ensure that only qualified chemists would be able to dispense prescriptions. The age at •which a chemist could qualify by examination was to be reduced, and certain anomalies existing under the principal Act were removed. The Bill did not provide for herbalists. jA I- WipORD (Hutt) said that m 1910 he introduced a Bill on behalf of herbalists. At the time a, promise was made that provision wonld be made for tho recognition of herbalists in a Government,Bill. This was not done. There wore many, reputable herbalists, and herbal remedies had a recognised value. Ihe profession of herbalist, had received partial recognition in a previous Pharma v y j • ~ ®- e as k?d the Minister to embody in the previous Bill the proviof rejected Herbalists Bill of 1910, which provided for the registration ot herbalists upon stated conditions. ?'[, JOSEPH WARD (Awarua) asked Whether the reciprocal arrangement mentioned in tho -Bill applied to coloured people in some parts of tho British Empire. He-approved of the clauso.exemptingchemists from attendanco-on juries. ?j' L ®AVEY (Christchurch. East) asked whether the Minister would accept an amendment to prevent a doctor accepting commissions from any chemist, and also to prevent a doctor telling a patient to get a prescription mado up bv anv particular chemist. , '

Dr. TE RAIvGIHIRO A sounded, a warning note in regard to the plea for herbalists put forward by tho member for Hutt. Jf the door were opened it would be opened veryswide. It seemed to him that tho urugs sold by herbalists were largely those which were-rpjected: irregular prac•wis'l lto labour tho point, but if tho door was ,to bo opened to the European herbalist, the Government, to be consistent, must also open the door to coloured herbalists, including the Maori, tohunga, who had been suppressed by special legislation. He did not, however, disapprove of the suppression of the Maori tohunga. 1. r i §" THOMSON (Dunedin North) hoped the Minister would not consider for one moment the proposal to include herbalists within the scope of .the Act. Some herbalists were all very well, but most of their so-called prescriptions were quite useless. But their work was purely emPmcnl. and the work of tho qualified chemist was that of an exact science. J 11" 4;- (Waikato) likewise urged the Minister to .take no heed of the plea put forward on behalf of the herbalists. He also urged that doctors should not be allowed to give secret prescriptions, which could not be made up oxcept by a particular demist. He hoped the Min-. ister would introduce an amendment to deal with this practice, which was especially frequently used by doctors' doing friendly societies' practice. The Hon. R. H. RHODES, in' Teply, informed the member for Hutt that he had no intention of including herbalists within the scope of the Bill. He did not think it was the general practice for a doctor to accept a commission from a chemist in return for his stipulating at which establishment prescriptions should be made up. If Mr. Davey, who had made the suggestion, wished to introduce an amendment to prevent anything of this sort occurring he could do so in committee, and the amendment would then have proper consideration. The second reading was carried on the voices.