THE FIRST DIVISION.

Dominion, Volume 5, Issue 1485, 6 July 1912, Page 6

THE FIRST DIVISION.

GOVERNMENT DEFEATED. BY 30 TO 33. Following was th'e'division list:— Ayes (33). Xoss (39) Atmoro Allen Brown . A ndersori . Buddo Hell . Buxton . .1. Bollard Carroll R. F. Bollard Colvin Brailney Davey Buchanan Dickie Buick . Ell .. Campbell Eorhos Coates Glover Dickson Italian , Kscntt Hindniarsh Fisher Isitt Eraser Lanrenson Guthrie M'C'alluni Han-is Mac Donald ■ Herdman T. Mackenzie Hine li. M'Kenzio Hunter .Myers Lang l.'aiata Malcolm Payne : Marnier To. Rangihiroa . Massey. Robertson ■ A. K. Xewman Russell.' E. Xswiuan Seddon Xosworthy Sidev , Okev 11.' W. Smith'. Vearce J. C. Thomson Pomaro Yeitch Reed - Ward • R. 11. Rhodes Wilford T. W. Rhodes Witty Scott F. H. Smith / Stnlham, Sykes Q, M. Thomson AYilson.' Young Messrs. Craigie (Aye) and . Lee (No) were paired. The Hon. li. M'Kenzie was in the House, but did not vote, but when Mr. Smith concluded his speech at 0.10 a.m., he explained that iie wished to be recorded with die ayes. The fellers ■ (Messrs. Guthrie and Forbes) said they dirt not see Mr. M'Kenzic or hear him give his vole. The division list was corrected to road as it is set out above.

-Mr. Poland informed a reporter, after the division, thai lie was lucked out. HOLDING ON HARD. MR. SMITH TO THE RESCUE. When members returned to their places five minutes later. Mr. Speaker proceeded tu put the no-confidonee amendment. There were calls for "Isitl." from the occupants of tho I/iberal bonches, but Mr. Isilt did not respond. •Mr; li. W. SMITH (Wnimarino) stepped info the breach. Getting lip hastily, ho told some of his colleagues, in a hasty aside "Get my stall'; it is on a chair there.'" Applauded as ho began to speak, he said that he felt that tho vote now pending was one that he did not care to face without boring said at least a Utile ou the subject in discussion. Mr: Smith was making some rather disjointed references to the Governor's Speech when Mr. Witty appeared in triumph with tho missing notes. Mr. Smith went on to say that although the Government might be faced by a slight reverse and the Reform party came in for the time being, it was not going to last. Although some members had broken their pledges that night this country was going to be governed by a Liberal Government. Opposition how! hear?! Mr. Witty: It won't be that side then! Mr. Smith dealt briefly with a number of tonics. He considered this an important division.' The position was practically what it was when the last noconfidence division _ was taken. The Leader of the Opposition was asking members to give him a blank chcf|iie. Sir. Smith declared that each of the members who had voted against the Government had committed political suicide.' When the electors of the. Bay of Islands anno to get tho "full strength of it," their member would get what he deserved. Mr. Smith went on to stato that he thought there should bo an appeal to the country. Hon. R. M'Kcnzic: Hear, hear! That is what I say! A HEATED MOMENT. "TAKE YOCR BEATING LIKE A MAN." The Hon. W. D. S. Macdonald fMinister for Public Works) followed with on expression of surprise, at the manner in which certain members had voted. Ho said that the .Leader of tho Opposition bad adopted tactics that were not worthy of a party leader. Air. NoSworthy (Ashbnrtoh): Take your beating like a man. The Hon. G. Lauronson- He will take it like a man. He is n man every inch of him—that is moro than you are. 'fCrics of protest from the Opposition benches).

Mr. Massey drew the Speaker's attention, to the Minister's remark.

I Mr. Laurenson: I said it in. the heat of the moment. If the expression is unparliamentary t withdraw it. A voices Apologise! Mr. Laurenson. I shall never apologise to you, my bov. Mr. Macdonald continued that it would not be any disappointment to him if the (rovcrnnic'jl' was counted out on the next division. THE PRIME MINISTER SPEAKS. A CRISIS IN THE HISTORY OF PARTIES. SOME INTERESTING JNTiOiJECTJONS. The PRIME MINISTER (the lion. T.-M.ackelif.ie) rose to speak-at 1.45. Ho thought, he said, that the occasion was one for tlio leaders to preservo dignity. A crisis had arrived iu (he history of parlies in this country, and it behoved thow who were to be beaten to take their beating lito men. Ho was proud of the loyalty of llioso who had stood by him in the division that had jnsl been taken, and in the division that would shortly be taken": lie was proud of the men he had led, but he wished that those who reposed confidence in him had extended that confidence on the first occasion en which he required it. lie thought, it would have been better ladies if the Opposition had not observed a policy of strict silence; there were great issues at stake, and they ought to have been fully discussed. He had every confidence in the future of hi* party, and it the Leader of the Opposition was willing to I rust the countrv. he (Mr. Mackenzie) would say on behalf of his parly that (hoy were willing l<i make Ihe nppcal, and fry concliLslous with tlin f.rsi<lcr of the Upjm»ition and his uartr. Ho him-

wlf was satisfied that tho peoplo wore desirous of Riving the Liberal Ministry .is nt present constituted nn opportunity of showing the grit th.it was iii them. " The country was progressive, and Liberal, and ho did not believe that the Loader of the Ol>J>osilion was other than progressive and Liberal, but he doubted whether his cntonglomcnfs would allow him to carry out such a policy. On the question of borrowing a groat deal of nonsense had been spoken for political purposes. 'J'hev must borrow for public works. Tho .£1,750,(H>0 of tlie five million loan that was for public works and la ml settlement was not sufficient to meet the present demands of (he country. The. .fii.OOO.OOl) for advances to settlers and workers was not sullicicnt, and now they had to limit advances to something like .£SOO. That did not afford the assistance required by the community.

The Land Question. A great ileal had been said as to his attitude towards lho Lands for Settlement Act. He had been opposed to the Lands for Settlement Act when it was introduced. There wore great areas of Crown lands unoccupied, and he thought it was time to take up country that was cultivated when these Crown areas'were brought into fertility. Likewise, ho hud objected to' the Advances 'to Settlers scheme, because there was an alternative proposal before Parliament at that time— to secure the loans to the moneylender at Home, and to see that the money was well secured on the lands on which' it was advanced. This; would have freed the scheme from political influence. He defended tho Government's land settlement policy generally, and also (he administration of this Agricultural Department. If there was ono thing he would regret more than another in leaving tho Government, it. would be his separation from the Agricultural Department. The first necessity of the country was the • settlement of the land, and the next was to increase the produdivity of the land under cultivation. He deprecated the Socialistic idea of. agitators in our cities. He said nothing of those men who fought, and fought hard, to improve the condition of the working people, having regard to tho compelitidn to which they were subject, and the market? they had to • secure. His Government had followed out the principle of graduated taxation, not in a spirit of retaliation, but solely from n desire to promote settlement. 'A great dear of nonsense had been talked about tenures. Tho statement made during the debate that there was no .security of tenure on Crown lands was entirely outside of the mark. Tho Liberal party had not gone back on the freehold. They hail increased it. and though there were leaseholders in the Cabinet it wns not a leasehold Government, because they' had stuck to the policy of freehold as well. The Government had also done line work in bringing into cultivation large areas of swamp lands, also in regard to the. establishment of fruit-farming. In (ho gum country 30 acres of that land would' now support .n family. Good work had also been done in opening ..up markets for our. fruits. .It was'the duty of tho Government 'to improve our lands in; every • way. and • to search for markets abroad.- The Government had also decided to establish light railways. "Good Gag But Not Sound Policy." Mr. R, M'Keuzie: Perfect rubbish. (Laughter.) The "Prime Minister said such- lines would act as feeders to the main lines. Mr. E. M'Kenzio: Good gag, but not sound policy. (More laughter.) The Priino Minister said such lines would bo very valuable in a place like Taranaki, where (hero were bad roads.

Mr. R. M'Kenzie: Hall-Jones tried it, and he had to pull it up and scrap it after two years.

Tho Prime Minister:. Yes, hut Hall-Jones can't haul much.

Industrial unrest, he said, was world wide, and until it happened that worker.- sot a larger shave of the wrolt.li they pioiluceil then.' would be industrial unrest nml strikes. -It was all very well to say Hint the industries in'which they were engaged would not .-(and it. Time's changed, and men were net always consistent, as they alleged. He cited inconsistencies of members of the Opposition. There inight be three-fifths men and bare majority men in the Liberal pally, freeholders and leaseholders, but they were ii grand lot of men, mid if they had been given a chance they, would have shown this country what they could do. They would get the ehanco yet. Mr. K. M'Kcnzie: I tliink you have shown it already.

The Premier next touched upon statements that the Government had pirated the policy of the Opposition and embodied it in the law of the land. If this wore so, he submitted, the Opposition should bo behind the Government.

Mr. Massey: If that is so tho Government .should bo in gaol!

The Government, .Mr. Mackenzie claimed, had done good work in removing tho duly from sugar and from kerosene. Mr. li. M'Kcnzie: I remember when you opposed removing it all the same (Laughter.)

The Prime Minister-. That must have been a mixing-up of the Mnckenzies. (Renewed laughter.) Mr. Mackenzie declared that all the faults alleged against him when he was . - onlesting the Egmont seat referred to t'le time when he was associated with Mr. Wm. Rolleston mid Sir ■Win. Russell. Mr. R. M'Kenzic: Long before that! It had been his endeavour, while leading the party, to strike the highest possible level, ne hoped to return the trust that his party had reposed in him, so that they might do the best thing for the country. He hod endeavoured to bo in action honest and in. honour clear. Tho first thing to ho dono in this country was to make the man on the land successful. Need for Population, The statesmen in charge of this country should bend their efforts on getting h population of at least two or three million souls, so that the country might bo strong enough to maintain its own independence first, and assist to maintain the, independence of the Empire later. He believed that they were witnessing the close of one political era, and the dawn of another. He did not believe that it was possible, in the present condition of parties, to carry on good government. He regretted that his opportunities of being useful in tho Department of Agriculture were likely to be curtailed. He thanked his officers and the secretaries with whom he had been associated, mid regretted parting witlwljiom. To the future he looked with faith and hope, and he believed that from what had occurred something bettor would evolvo.

Opposition: Hear! hears! Mr. Mackenzie said that he did not speak in a party sense, but in n wider sense. "After all," lie concluded, "I leave this post with a feeling of equanimity. There is an old Mackenzie motto: 'Prepared for either fate,' and any man who enters political life should bo" prewired for that. After all. the prize is in the race we run. not in the goal." (Loud applause, in which the Opposition joined.) MR. T. W. RHODES. MAKES HIS POSITION CLEAR. Mr. T. AV. RHODES (Thames) spoko of the improvement in the tone of the Vje bate as compared with that of last ses sion. He congratulated the Prime Minis tor 'on the very able speech he had just made. (Opposition hear, hears.) He also complimented the Prime Minister's work in agriculture. He referred to a remark of the Prime Minister's thai seemed to indicate him as a pledge-breaker. The Prime Minister: Oh, no. I only referred to vour programme. Mr. Rhodes: There.were only two things that I was pledged to. One more by inference than anything else was to support Sir Joseph Ward at the outset. My other pledge was for. the: freehold before anything. That, 1 believe, is more likely to'be carried out by my contemplated action than by my supporting a Ministry that has so many leaseholders iu it. Mr. Rhodes continued that it must be his aim to carry out his freehold p!»dgb. Ho had assuranco in his possession that his action would meet with Ihe approbation of some if not all of his constituents. "I have not wriggled in any wav," said Mr. Rhodes. "I was asked bv a Minister in confidence, how was 1 gain- to vole. 1 lold him that I was not going to vote with the parly. Humours have got about that T was going to vote against Ihe Government; Ihe only wov that rumour could have got about was by a breach of confidence on Ihe ntirl. of a member ol this assembly." "The only condition 1 will support Ihe present Leader of the Opposition." continued Mr. Modes, "is thai lnejnui-os of a liberal and nmErcssive eharactor. will

roceivo my support. I understand tho legislation they contemplate will bo of that character. This is all 1 want; 1 will support them on those lines." Hon. J. A. Uanaii: A leap in the dark. Not Afraid. Mr. Rhodes said ho was not afraid to make a leap in tho dark, and ho hoped ho was not making a mistake. Ho was in no way bound bv the caucus mooting m .March, which 'he had not attended, and ho had never given to any nu'inljcr of the Ministry any promise of support. lie. was quite prepared lo explain his position to his constituents, and when he told them that in his opinion he had done the hot in their interests, he thought they, would approve his action. If he had made a mistake, he was tho ono who would suffer personally. The desire of the people was lor a stable Government, and he believed that (hero' was no chance of a sable Government by (he remnants of the Liberal Government. It would bo oblaised by the coalition of certain members with the lici'orin party. lho Hon. G. W. Russell (Minister for Internal Affairs) asked on what condition Mr. lihodes would support the Heform party. Mr. Jthodes: On tho conditions I have stated—liberal and progressive legislation. • Hon. It. M'Kenzie (Motueko): sitting on the rail. Mr. Rhodes: All I hope is that tho others who sit on tho rail do not overbalance themselves more than I did. (Laughter.) Mr. lihodes said that ho hoped the result ol the division, whatever it might be, would Ire taken in the best spirit. (Applause.) •At 3.15 a.m., when Mr. lihodes had concluded, members again trooped into 'the House. The Speaker was putting llio question, mid a division seemed imminent, when

"THE DEATH SENTENCE" , AND "THE BURIAL SERVICE." MR, It, M'KEXZJE KAYS A FEW WORDS. The Hon. R. M'KEXZIE rose to speak. He was not minded, ho said, to hold tho nro from anybody's head nor to withhold (He water from drowning rats, am! he would not detain the House long. He had recognised at Ihe last general election that the great Liberal party had got into a deep rut. That night they had been standing by its grave and listening to tho burial service. "There are a few men in Hie country." said Air. Al'Konzie. "who are responsible for the position that we have got into." During the past few years, he continued, the Liberal party had suffered by reason of the class 'of-men admitted to its. ranks. Even- opportunist and rail-sitter had tacked himself on'to the tail of the Liberal party. He remembered the 'class of men Dint tho party contained when it was led by Dallance and Seddon. These leaders would not allow any wobblers to enter the party. He _ had nothing at all to say against tho.-' "present gentleman who called himself tho leader of the Liberal party," but he (Mr. M'Kenzio) must congratulate him on having mail's a very lino appeal to the electors of the country when death sentence was being passed-on him. It was like an appeal to a jury after sentence of death had been' passed. "Now, however," continued Mt. .M'Kenzic, "he imagines that we do not know his career in history, but 1 have known the lion, gentleman for' many years, and know his history intimately. The Democrats and extreme Radicals sitting behind him should know that he was file only man now in the Xow Zealand Parliament who had voted and fought against one man one vote.. Ho. was quile sure that the old Liberals ,of New Zealand would not have supported him. He referred to the old buttle about tho properly tax. Did he not. remember that ho supported Sir Harrv Atkinson, Sir John Hall, Captain liiissell, and the Hon. Wm. Rollcolxm.

The Remnants: .." Did he imagine that they had forgotten it? He rem-dUil the iiositim. (.hey had got into. TIo regretted "tho sentence passed upon the Liueral nam l;v hie vote taken a while ago, but 'his 'recognised that in this Houh-, when it met last February, the Liberal partv or the remnants of the Liberal party were about finished then. He, however, was not a "jump Jim Crow" opportunist, such as those who were prepared to take olhco lor their own advantage. Ho was one of those Liberals who' could never recognise the present so-called Liberal party as his party. While he was a colleague of the Hon. Mr. Mackenzie and recognised his good work in the Agricultural Department, he had onlv joined the party five vears a»o In fact, so far as there was 'any difference between Mr. Mackenzie and the Leader of Ihe Opposition—one to his mind was as big a Conservative and as big a lory as the other-there was no difference between them except that the l.eailei of the Opposition could be relied upon to tell what was in his mind. The position to-night must bo fought out to a finish. Personally, he recognised that catchvotes and catch-divisions wore not going to settle the question at issue before the people of New Zealand. There, were four or live gentlemen in the House who were representatives of the Labour party. Ho had been a supporter of the Labour party all his life, but if those four'members thought they were going to control the Government they were mistaken. Of the Independents he would say that there was no member of the House who could long remain an independent. Evenmembers had sooner or later j'o attach himself to one party. As soon as aii election could lie ' forced every member elected in it would be attached to one side or the oilier. Since last December he had made up his mind, but whon there was a division that evening ho had supported the Government, lie was not wedded to (he Government, nor was ho connected with it in nnv way at all. Ho had made his position' clear (luring the conference or caucus or whatever it was called. He had made his position clear (hat he disapproved of the nltiliide taken up by certain gentlemen there., lie had told them that. Mr. Millar was tlie leading member of the Lib. oral parly, and that he ought to be | chosen leader. i<-

"Stabbed in the House of His Friends." His kite lender, Sir .Joseph Ward, had been oltiirkcil unduly at the polls, but Mr. Millar was being stabbed in (lie House of bis friends. He had made up his mind that he was going to detach himself then, but to act.as lie thought best to bring about good government in this, country on sound, honourable lines. Mr. M'Kenziosaid that he did\jiotsec his way clear to lake- a position in the Administration, and any member who could not sac his way clear to join an Administration had no right to support it. Ho would sooner leave Parliament to-morrow than support Mr. Mackenzie. It'was impossible to get any. Liberal legislation or Liberal principles from the party on the Treasury benches. He- had nothing to say against its members as members of the House or as private citizens. One or two of them had bten Tories all their lives, and would be Tories eo long as they live, and he certainly could not associate himself with them. "I am out for a dissolution," continued the former Minister in explanation of his position. If there could not he a reasonable amalgamation, he wanted to force Parliament to the country as soon ns possible, lie explained that paragraphs had been published iri Ministerial journals in Wellington and Chi'istchuich that had misrepresented him, and .one of them 'published while the new Ministry was being formed, slated thai he was preventing the formation of the Mini-try because be insisted that he should he included. To make his po-ilion clear, lie lestgned., "Certain member* dc-ired a clean sweep," he added.). 1 decided in !«■( (hem have it. They got. a clean swear. and they arc gelling t'ne re-uit -■! ii to-night." From the time 1 made up my mind to send in my resignation -1 decided J Was going (a have a clear course to do what I considered best. To-uighl when (here was an attempt lo catch a division I was not going (o lend any assistance to it." Plain Talk' About Ministers. Some candid 'comment was given bv Mr. M'K'enzie on Hie comp-jtitioii of the -Min-i-try. "What right," lie asked, "lias Mr. Itii.vtnn lo 1)l> on Ihe Ticasiirv benches above the hem!': of men who have snp-p.-aled thr. Liberal pnrlv for 15 or a) vears!' Whv is Mr. Mvcrs on I lie Treasury clinches:- What lias he rwr dene I'm this country or the Liberal party? if

you subtract Mr. Myers's wealth from Mr. Myers, ho would never have l;eeu there at all. 1 hope he will not take this ;is a personal application. (Laughter.) Jlow can they expect mo or members liko me, who have strong Liberal convictions, to .support the so-called Liberal Administration. Ido not take tho slightest interest in the fate of the present (jovcrnineiil. I would as soon vote them nut as vole (hem in. There is no doubt that they have been condemned from ono end of (he country to (ho other. They' were put there as a stop-gap Administraf (km, and they knew it very well. 1 must say that they have done fairly well in administering the ah'airs of the country, so far as thu time they devoted to them allowed. Ho referred to the J'rimo Minister as a man who had voted against every Literal leader, and then during the three years he had been in the Ministry he had" got "every mother's son of us out 1 ' and attained the leadership.

MR. W. J. DICKIE. "SURPRISED AT THE TIRADE." Mr. W. J. DICKIE (Selwyn) «iid ' ho had been surprised a( tho tirade delivered by the former Minister • for • Public • Works. Mr. M'Kenzio had no right (o consider thnt ho had n' leaso of portfolios. Mr. M'Kenzie: I refused to tnke one. The Hon. G. W. Russell: Very doubt-, ful. Mr. Dickie: I don't know whether you were offered one. Possibly, Mr. M'Kenzio thought of leading.a parly, but ho would not follow such a lead. - Mr. 11. M'Kenzio: I do, not want you. He was very sorry to ben new member and sit in this House and .hear such a speech. Mr. R. M'Kenzie said he had slated at that caucus that he was perfectly indifferent who got into the Ministry, and lie was nerfeetly indifferent as to what ilu'.v did." The Hon. Mr. Millar left the room and raid he would never enter it again. He (Mr. R. M'Kenzie) said ho would follow Mr. Millar. As to pledges, he in turn might ask tho Prime Minister why he did not carry out his pledges. THE HON. J. COLVIN. HE MUST HE LOYAL. The Hon. J. COLVlN : 'said ho was appointed, on Mr. E. M'Kenzio recommendation, and if his old friend had siidi an opinion of' his leader (Hon. Thos. Mackenzie) ho hail no right to recommend him (Mr. Colvin) for a portfolio. Mr. K. M'Kenzie was tho same Cabinet with Mr. Thos. Mackenzie. Why, then,' did he' not stand by him now? (Government Hear, hears.)

Mr. Colviu said that he had never asked any man to vote for him or put him in any position. No man had any right to attack his late leader «s tho member for Motueka had done that night. Ho should have made that statement at. the caucus. (Hwr, hear.) He was astonished that the member for Motueka had made such a statement.' Mr. Colviu stated that when ho came to Wellington in March, Mr.'M'Kenzie told him that he (Mr. Colviu) should get into the Ministry, and advised him to stop in Wellington. Mr. Colviu continued that ho did not stop in Wellington, but returned to the West Coast. There ho received an offer of a Ministerial position. It was entirely unsought, so far as lie was concerned. Mr. Colvjn. recalled his former relations with Messrs. Millar and M'Kenzie, ond stated that they had impressed upon him at all times that loyalty to party was essential all the time. He hoped "that a tetter Ministry would come iii, but ho must bo loyal to the man' under whom he had served for the last three months. Ho had never found Mr. M'Kejizie engaged in any trickery or doing anything wrong, and that was where he must find fault with his kotioumble friend, the member for Motueka. He only wanted to put the leader of the parly right, and had "lilv to say that they were going out—the Ministry was going out. Jle thanked tlie ollicers of his department for the loyal and straightforward way in which they hail assisted him. Since his very early days when ho landed as a hoy in New Zealand he had fought his way unaided, and he felt sure that he could go down to tho ■•Duller: in any election and win it against any - Tmrn: He—hoped-that tho Liberal Party would be given a chanco to go the country. Do had not intended to speak,, only for-' what had bron said tint night. Friends for a Long Time. Mr. 1!. M'Kensuo said that he wa» plea«od that his old friend, tho member lor Buller, had said a few words. -.They had been friends for a very long time, and would be friends, no matter what troubles might occur. Mr. Colvin had carried out every duty entrusted to him with entire satisfaction to members of the House. His (Mr. Colvin's) memory of past events, however, was a littfo faulty. "I told him as a personal friend," said Mr. M'Kenzie, "that 1 was not likely to join the Administration, and that as he was the oldest and most experienced member he was best qualified In follow me. I said that 1 wonlmilo my best to help him in the matter. Mr. Reddon and myself went down to the Mapjurika, and saw him off. ... I recognised Unit, as a sensible, level-headed man lie ought to l)e included in the .Stop-gap Ministry, and 1 recognise that ho is ouo ■of the best men they have now." Mr. M'Kenzie objected to Mr. Colvin's statement that he had made a personal attack on the present Prime M.inisr»r. It was not n personal uttack but an attack based on the position that Mr. Mackenzie had placed himself in.

Mr. Colvin said that lie nothing to reply further than that his friend had continned what he bad said. Mr. M'Konzio had said that he (.Mr. Colvin) had said Dial lie would get into tho Ministry if he stopped in Wellington. He did not stop, and he. did get into the Ministry, tic believed that his hon. friend helped him —lie (.Mr. M'Kcn'/.io) had a good deal of influence. 'J'ho position, .Mr. Colvin continued, came to, him. 110 did not look for it. (Applause.)

SIR JOSEPH WARD. "WHY ANY WASHING OF DIUTY LINEN r" Sir Joseph WAUI) (Awarua) said he wished to say a word about the disclosure by men. as if it were an honourable thing to do of what took place at a conference, lie had never known any member of the Opposition do any such thing, ami ho had always admired tho party for it. Unfortunately ho could not say Hint about any of the several caucuses held by his party under his predecessor and.himself. But why should there be any acerbity now, why any washing of dirty linen, why any attempt by a member of Iho former Ministry to discredit a former colleague. l. All the members at the caucus, with the exception of. .Mr. Isitt and-.tho Labour members agreed to support tho lender selected by the majority vote of the conference. .The othurs all did, including the member who had just spoken. There was an attempt being made to create (rouble between Mr. Millar and himself. All those who were at the caucus must know that he had said nothing to influence., anybody for or against Mr. Millar or Mr. Mnckenl;k\ : The Hon. J!. M'Kcnzie: T never said you did. so far as I am .concerned. Sir Joseph Ward said ho was not referring ti> Hie ' lion. gentleman. When .it, lianpouod (lint two members of the parly were standing for the vacant leadership, it was inevi- | 'able that there should be a division. This division unfortunately rrriirrcd, but if surely was the duly o< lh-.-e who wove not going to support the -ibvfod loader lo s'iv -n at the caucus, am! no.' to pretend that Ibi'v were going in tMhiw anv but their mr'n choice as Irad r. He was not <ure that it was wi.-e for old cnll-agues to rceriiuinalo. but he 'en); Iho. llr,;i-e in!., his rauihlcncc lo -nv.ilinl auvoae win. was lendir.. ; .lhe party with his'-in-cere friend in it had not the best po-i----lien 'ii 'he wide world. Mr. V. M'lv'iv.ie; You and ' T never had a' falling out, anyhow. One of the Dangers. Sir Joseph Ward soul be hod alwnvs -!nnd nn for his colleague. ' He went on to say thai he hod never asked anvone lo break a pledge in his life. He' added, abo. that, no one knew that ho ron'euinlatod resiqiiimr the leadership, !wciyi>" he did not tell nuvlmdv until he ; had told 'Mi-. Millar that lie was u „ing lo make the statement to the House. He recognised thnji that (he parly's hold on office was insecure, and the'small majority was one of the dangers of the present situation. What was needed was a strong (iovcniinent. He »-»•( sorry to bear Mr. K. M'lvciuie's attack on Mr. Myers.

Mr. U. M'Kenzio: I was only 6tating tho position. Sir Joseph Ward said Mr. Myers had shewn conspicuous ability, firmness, and judgment. Jlo did not thiuk Mr. M'Kenzio should have deg/rogntod a member because ho got into the Ministry. Mr. It. M'Kenzio: Which he 'never should linvo got into. Sir Joseph Ward, in conclusion, urged flint as the wholo matter was settled thoy should lako _it as men. Let them tufco a division and go homo to hod. Let them congratulate tho Leader nf the Opposition, and at the Name, timo sympathise with him. Mr Miussey: Jlo wants both.

Sir Joseph Ward said that from his own experience, ho knew (hah Ho wished to congratulate Mr. Massey, and ho expressed the hope that ho would get a strong team of men to carry on the business of the country, because it needed strong men.

Mr. R. M'Kenzio pointed out that thorn were two resolutions at tho. caucus. Tho first .was that whoever was Prime Ministor should carry out the policy in tho Governor's Speech. He (Mr. It. M'Kenzio) protested about parts of that Speech being thrown oyer. Whore two members of tho party woro proposed for the Premiership it was urged that they should withdraw altogether in favour of someono not in the previous Government at all. Ho did not intend to bo placed in any false position,, and he stated distinctly that ho was finished with tho whole proceedings of. the caucus, and ho was finished with - tho party. Ho had acted on that' from that timo to this. He had no .disagreement with Sir Joseph Ward wliile a member of his Cabinet. As for Mr. Myers, ho looked upon him as an Independent, and not as a member of the Lilwral party at all. Mr. Myers had no right to lx> there. . The PRIME MINISTER said that what Sir .Joseph Ward had said was correct. There had never been any difference between Sir Joseph Word and himself. Ho never did suggest anything in connection with the High C'ommissionership to him. Nothing but good fooling existed between them,'

Mr. Robertson concurred -with what Sir Joseph Wnrd had slid about th. Labour . members. MR. T, M. WILFORD. "A TIME FOR MEN OF ACTION." Mr. T. M. WILFORD (Hutt) said tin speech delivered by. tho Prime Minister was a s|>eceh that never would be forgot- 1 ten. Next to winning, the best thing to do was to lose well. Ho had found the party wrecked and disintegrated when ho returned to New Zealand some weeks ago, but he could never see that ho ought to vote with the opposing party for an immediate personal advantage. Unless Mr. Massoy brought down / a liberal policy there was no chance for him. What was wonted in New Zealand was kinetic men, forceful, men. This was n time for men of action, and the Leader of tho Opposition had a magnificent opportunity if ho could rise to it.

THE F!NAL DIVISION. MAJORITY INCREASED BY TWO. OPPOSITION 41, GOVERNMENT 33. Tho division was then taken, and resulted as follows:— Ayes (41) Noes (33) Allen Atmore Anderson Drown Bell Buddo Dollnrd, J. Buxton Bollard, E. F. Carroll Bradney Colvin Buchanan Davey Buick Dickie Campbell Ell Clarke 1 Forbes Coates Glover Dickson Honan Escott Hindmarsh Fisher Isitt Eraser Lauronson Guthrio M'Calluin Harris. Mac Donald Herdman Mackenzie, T. , Hino ."'■- •" Myers 1 "* '-■' ■-■ Hunter Parata Lang Payne Malcolm Poland Marnier Te Rangihiroa Massoy . Robertson Millar • Russell Newman, A. K. Seddon Ncftvman, E. Sidcy Nosworthy Smith, R. W. Okey Thomson, J. C. Pearce Veitch l'oinaro Ward Meed Wilford Rhodes, R. H. Witty Rhodes, T. W. Scott Smith, F. H. Stathaw Rykes Thomson, G. M. Wilson Young PAIRS. Ayo: No: . ' Lea Crnigie. Mr. Massoy then 'moved in accordance with precedent that a committee, to consist of Messrs. ,T.. Allen, W. Frnser, G, -At. Thomson,'and the mover, bo set up to draft tho address to his Excellency, This was agreed to. CONGRATULATION. Mr. MASSEY (Leader of the Opposi. lion) expressed acknowledgments for kindly references made to bun in the debate, and complimented members on its temperate character. Ho expressed the liopo that whatever occurred in tho next few weeks Iwth sides would bo ready to drop Anything in tho way of party strife or' personal differences, and that they would all work together for the good of the countrv. , ' '

The PIUME MINISTER (Mr. T. Maokenzio) tendered, his hearty congratulations to tho Leader of the Opposition, Ho hoped Iho honourablo gentiemnn would worthily carry the honours shortly to bo conferred upon him. It would ipve him pleasure to assist. Mr. Masscy in every legitimate way in whatever legislative work he was engaged. (Applause.) The Houso'i-ose. at 5 A.m. until 2.30 p.nit ' on Tuesday.