MR. MASSEY'S STATEMENT.

Dominion, Volume 5, Issue 1372, 24 February 1912, Page 8

MR. MASSEY'S STATEMENT.

"EVERY WORD 1 RECOLLECT." "THE STORY IN AUCKLAND." Mr. MASSEY said that ho would now say where ho had como into this matter. On that day fortnight he trnvolled to Auckland by the early morning train, and, immediately on arriving, went to the Public Works buildings to transact some business for his constituents. While ho was in the Public Works building, Messrs. Payne and Dickson came over. Tho latter told. him that Mr. Payno had como to Auckland particularly to see him (Mr. Massey), and asked for a quiet conversation. They went, to Mr. Dickson's office, and tho latter informed him, when they got there, that Mr. Payne was inclined to break Ms election pledges. They proceeded to discuss tho question. Mr. Payne: What did I reply, please? Mr. Massey: "I am'going to ropeat every word, so far as I can recollect, that passed between us." He continued that he tried to point out to the member for Grey Lvnn what a'serious thing it was for a member of Parliament to break his pledges to his constituents. Then ho told Mr. Payne about' a rumour" current- in Auckland. He (Mr. Massey) had heard about it from at least a dozen sources. It was to the effect that Mr. Payne had gone over to the Ward Government, and that ho had been "squared." He told Mr. Payne that some of the people of Auckland were saying this, and that if ho "went over" all of them would say it. Mr. Payne said: "Where was I 'squared'?" Ho (Mr. Massey) .replied that the story in Auckland was that Mr. Payne had been "squared" by Mr. Vigor Brown and Sir Joseph Ward at Napier. Mr. Payne said that he intended to see the chairman and secretary of his committee, and suggested that they should meet again in the afternoon. Mr. Ell: Why didn't you tell the Primo Minister about that?

The Proper Thing to Do. ,Mr. Massey continued that ho agreed to Mr. Payne's suggestion, and thnt he met Messrs. Dickson and Payne again at Mr. Dickson's office at 2.30 p.m. Mr. Payne said that his chairman and secretary were quite agreed that the proper thing for him to do was to stick to his pledges. Ho said to., Mr. Payne: "Well, I think it is the proper thing for you to do." ' On the day after he came to Wellington Mr. Payne came to see. him in his room, at the other end of the building. Mr,. Dickson was present. They again proceeded to discuss matters, and Mr. Payne told him that ho had again changed his mind and felt inclined to go over to the Ward Government. He told Mr. Payne that to do so would bo to disgrace himself, to disgrace his constituents, and to disgrace him (Mr. Massey), because he had recommended Mr. Payne to his friends as one worthy of their support. Mr. Payne went away without making any definite statement on that occasion, but promised to come back and inform Mr. Massey before ho made up his mind what to do. "Since then," said Mr. Massey, "I have had no conversation with the member for Grey Lynn. He has gone his way and I have gone mino. I have brought no pressure to bear upon Mr. Payne."

"Either £500 or £1000." Answering an interjection, Mr. Massoy stated that in his presence Mr. Dickson asked Mr. Payne if he had been offered money. Mr. Payne replied, "I was called into a business man's office in Queen Strcot, and I was offered either .£SOO ot .21000." Mr. Massey added that he took no part in this conversation, but he had distinctly heard Mr. Payno say that he had been offered the sum of .£SOO or to break his pledge and vote for tho Ward Government. "I asked no questions," said tho Leader of the Opposition. "I don't want to be mixed up in any question of that sort." A. Government member: Yon are mixed up in it now. Mr. Massey: I made no offer. Dr. Te Rangibiroa: You used the rumour to influence his vote. Mr. Massey: I told him what tho people were saying. He added that ho had only met Mr. M'Mastera two or three time 9 in his life. Mr. Payne: Did he say something about a post office last timo you met? Mr. Massoy: I have no recollection of it. I only knew Mr. M'Masters as Mr. Payne's secretary of committee. Mr. Ma"ssey then read the following letter "from a very well-known man in Auckland :— You may remomber my introducing you to young , son of , one of my party who do not follow Ward. Ho worked hard and loyally for us in Parnell, Ponsonby, and especially in Grey Lynn. Ho now assures mo that Payne has been squared, JJIOOO, to support Ward on a confidence motion. So sure is ho of tho correctness of the information that his dad has offered level money up to .£IOO on Payne voting against you, and does not waste money on bets without some reason. Mr. Massey stated that, after receiving the letter, he showed it, or at least, read it, to Air. Payne. Mr. Payno; I .have never seen that tetter before. Mr. Massey:. Does Mr.'Payne say that I did not read that letter to hiw in my room? Mr. Payne remained silent. ,Mr. Massey:-Then I'ask'Mr. Dickson whether I read it? Mr. Dickson: Yes. Mr. Massey concluded by stating that ho was very, very sorry that he.had ever become acquainted with Mr. John Payne, the .member for Grey Lynn.

REMARKS BY THE PREMIER. COMMENTS ON THE LETTEB. Sir Joseph Ward said that.tho letter was a copy with blanks where the signatures and names should be. These blanks should be filled in. Mr. Massey replied that it was only a copy. He had not the original there. Sir Joseph Ward contended that tho original should be produced; Mr. Speaker: You a'ro entitled to tho document, that was read. Sir Joseph Ward asked for the blank document in tho meantime, and it was brought to-him by a messenger. Mr. Massey asked whether it was not a rule that private letters need not be laid on the table? Mr. Speaker concurred, but added that it was questionable whether a letter referring, as this one did, to members could bo considered a private letter. Sir Joseph Ward, holding tho paper in:his hand, said it was a letter written •in pencil, not addressed to anybody, and dated the 17th of February. He* then read it, laying stress on the blanks, and reiterating- that it was written in leadpencil, and ho added that there was no signature to the letter. Mr. W. C. Buchanan: Yon ruled, Mr. Speaker, that nothing that has not been road to the House need be put on the table. Is not the Prime Minister questioning your ruling when he asks for something more than what was read to be laid on the table? , , ± , „ The Speaker: I understood the Eight Hon. the Premier to bo commenting on the document'arid the way if was worded. Sir Joseph Ward: Yes. The Leader of the Opposition must recognise that this letter in blank contains a most serious charge against a member of tho Houso. Mr. Allen: What is the chargo? The 'Premier: That somebody offered him a thousand' pounds to change his Mr. Allen: Don't misinterpret. That's uot'a charge'against him. The Premier: Tin; writer' a?sevts that Mr. Pa.vue bus beeu squared '.o vute for the G'jwnuwnt. It is the duly of the Lcvlrv of the Opposition---not * matter

of sentiment, but of duty—to statd where ho received the letter from, in fairness to a member of this House, and to the Houso and the country, and to produco the lettor. (.Ministerial applause.) Auy ono of lis may receive a letter reflecting on another member of the House. 1 myself have received any number of them, but I have never made" any use of them. What would they say if 1 were to say, if - I. were to come here with a blank pencilled letter, and what would they say if I refused to produce the original? Ministerialists: "What would they say f" "They would say you were a coward."

Emphatic Denials. Tho Premier: And I ask what member of this House is sat'o if this sort of thing can bo done, and can bo received with equanimity and without dissent. Hero is a reflection on somo firm of merchants in Auckland in whoso. office somebody is said to have mado an offer. I take the opportunity of saying, as my name is mentioned and Mr. Vigor Brown's name is mentioned, and it is said that the lion, member was squared by Mr. Vigor Brown when in Napier. I want to ask Mr. Payno and Mr. Brown, in the presence of Parliament, when we were together. I was in Napier a day and a night on my way to Taupo, and I only saw Mr. Payne on thiop occasions, and I will tako my oath outside the House that 1 never so much as asked him what his political leanings were. Mr. Laurenson: You are too much of a gentleman. Tho Premier: I never suggested that he should support the Government, or what he should do. I never attempted to intluence him directly or indirectly, and no man in this House can say I ever offered a sum of money to anybody to support the Government, directly or indirectly. This letter has come from Napier. The Leader of tho Opposition says it originated in Napier. Mr. Massey: Says what did? The Premier: Tho rumour. Mr. Massey: Yes, tho rumour. The Premier: I never asked anyone in the country to offer a member money; a single shilling, to get his vote. (Hear, hear.) I would consider it far worse than to offer to any man who was in doubt as to what party he would support to make a line of railway in the event Of my getting back into office, and I would look on it as a huge political bribe, detestable in the extreme. You can't find any man to whom I ever said that in the evont of my coming into office I would have a line of railway made, or any other public work to induce him to support me. Can the Leader of the Opposition say the same? ' llr. Massey: I can. I never offered a bribe in my life. The Premier: I did not say a bribe. Tho proceedings were here interrupted by tho 5.30 adjournment.