I.—loa.

86

[a. guild

40. If that association had that power or a similar body had such powers they would then be able to take this matter in hand, and they would be able to supervise ? —Do you mean supervise the shipping ? 41. Yes ?—But that is not sufficient, sir. They require more power than that, and I submit they must have legislation behind them in order to satisfactorily tackle with the whole question of shipping. 42. The regulation of the shipping as well as the regulating of shipping-space comes into the question of control —two parts of the Bill ? —Quite so. 43. So if you want to supervise or arrange for regular shipments you must have the control part of the Bill in operation ?—Yes. 44. Mr. Burnett.] The district you represent is mostly a dairying district ? —Mainly. 45. You are of opinion that the industry is capable of a big development ? —lt is developing every day. As a matter of fact it has made considerable strides during last year, so much so that each individual company has had a greater output. 46. In other words the dairying industry is creeping out to country where formerly we did not think it could possibly be carried on ? —That is so. 47. There is every prospect of the output increasing two- or three-fold ?—Yes. 48. I take it that you have found, in moving about the various districts as you have done, that the settlers are practically unanimous in the desire for this Bill ? —ln my own particular district I have not heard a settler who has sopken against it either in the course, of conversation or at a meeting, i 49. You have heard of the idea of taking a plebiscite amongst all those in the industry : are you prepared to take a vote for the purpose of deciding this question ?—That reverts to the question of a referendum. 50. Yes ?—Well, I can answer that question two ways, Yes and No, because I do not think the average elector in New Zealand is competent to deal with big questions other than the electing of their representatives for Parliament. 1 am not in favour of a referendum, because it is not the customary method of passing legislation. 51. You think, then, that it comes within the province of Parliament to decide the question as to the wisdom or otherwise of this Bill ? —That, sir, is what you are here for and what you are paid your salaries to do. 52. Do you think that the Meat Control Board is received with disfavour in a mixed district like yours ? —I think the Board as a whole has been received with favour. I submit that a portion of the district which-1 represent —namely, Timaru —formed the hottest opposition throughout New Zealand to the Meat Control Board, but the reason for the opposition to the Meat Control Bill was not very hard to find, because it has been stated that the proprietary interests were at stake-. 53. Do you find that the fiercest opposition comes from the proprietary concerns and those persons who hold big wads of shares in those concerns ? —Yes, in my own particular district I find that that is so. 54. You see no reason why this dairy control should not be a success ? —I think, sir, it should be a huge success. 55. Mr. Langstone.] I suppose without statutory powers to levy taxation it would not be much availed of ? —No, it would not be. As a matter of fact we pay land-tax, income-tax, and various other forms of taxes which we are forced to pay. We simply pay because we are forced to pay. I think these taxes are in the interests of the country. 56. Therefore, if you have statutory power to levy, a rate on butter and cheese will be for the ultimate good of the industry as a whole ?—Yes. 57. The proprietary concerns are always telling us of the mistakes and the incompetency of the various co-operative undertakings : I suppose they never fall into any pitfalls and make mistakes themselves ?—Even if they did there is no one to tell them about it. They do not need to have a balance-sheet, and they have not a group of suppliers to tell them about anything that goes wrong, and consequently you do not hear of the mistakes they make. Thomas Cuddie Brash examined. (No. 23.) 1. The Chairman.] What are you, Mr. Brash ?—I am secretary of the National Dairy Association. 2. You wish to make a statement to this Committee, do you not ?—Yes. I wish, first of all, to confine my few remarks to the disabilities of the present position with regard to shipping, and shortly to the impossibility of dealing with the shipping without having the control of the produce. In doing so I must of necessity refer to the two Dairy Associations, and I regret having to do so because they have been before you a good deal already mostly by way of criticism, and no doubt you are somewhat weary of hearing about the matter. My remarks with respect to the National Dairy Association apply to the South Island Association because it is a kindred association. The National Dairy Association is composed of dairy companies in the North Island, also Nelson, Marlborough, and Westland. Westland will now merge into the South Island Dairy Association because of the tunnel connection with Lyttelton, and due to the fact that the produce will be going in that direction. I think, in the South Island every dairy company is a member of the Dairy Association there. In the North Island, I think there are two factories which are not members of the National Dairy Association. The business of the association is managed by ten directors, and they are appointed directly by the dairy companies who are members of the association. I would like to take this opportunity of mentioning how the voting is carried out in connection with the association in question as it has been referred to, and wish to point out that the interests of the smaller factories are safeguarded as against