C—4.

64

[W. R. DUNN

60. Jf that is so does it not prove that there is a lack of circulation? —Yes; but even with a current of air blowing into the face that condition might be present. 61. Mr. Parry. .] Is that the only point which will be an impediment in the fixing of a temperature?— Yes, the only thing I know of at the present time. 62. Do you think it is a serious obstacle? —Yes. 63. The Chairman.'] The centre of a man's place might be 6 ft. from his broken ground?— Yes. 64. Have you had any experience of reducing to a six-hour shift? —No, very little. The custom came in after I took charge of the Hikurangi Mine. 65. Mr. Parry.] Have you worked in hot places yourself?— Yes, but only on the goldflelds. 66. You are not in a position to give an idea of the injurious effect tliat a hot place has on a man?— Well, I am not in a position to give a solid opinion from my own knowledge. 67. If you were working in a coal-mine yourself, Mr. Dunn, would you not prefer to change at the mine? —Not unless I lived more than a mile away. We find that you cannot get the men to change—they prefer to change at home. If I lived within a mile I would prefer to change at home. 68. Do you not think it would be better to change and wash at the mine?—lt would certainly be better if they would do so conscientiously; it would be more healthy for them. 69. Is the Mining Inspector the arbiter now as regards hot places?— Yen, as far as I know. 70. Under what section of the Coal-mines Act has he that power?—l could not quote the section, but, of course, he has power to inquire into matters of dispute. 71. Do you think, Mr. Dunn, that mining is a healthy occupation?— Well, there is no reason to say it is not a healthy occupation. 72. You have not worked in hot places?—l have worked in many such places on the goldfields. 73. Have you heard men complain about their health? —No. 74. As a general thing, have you heard of miners suffering from indigestion?—No, I have had no complaints on that ground. 75. Have there been any men carried out fainting when working under you?— No. 76. Mr. Eeed.] Is it a fact that the company would be the losers by having hot places in a mine ? —Yes. 77. Does it pay to have hot places?-—No, it does not pay. 78. So it is to your advantage to keep the places cool?— That is so. We endeavour to do so. 79. You use your discretion in the matter of temperature?-—Yes. 80. You have worked yourself on the coal? —Yea, both on the coal and in gold-mining. 81. You stated that, owing to irregularity of temperature caused by the heating of the coal, it would be very difficult to fix a standard or to maintain one? —The spontaneous heating during the falls of strata would make it very difficult. 82. Would it be wise or practicable to go to the expense, when approaching a holing, of putting in a supplementary fan for that single place? —No, it would not. 83. Are you aware that that is the reason why most of the other countries do not adopt a fixed standard? —I do not know for certain, but it is a sound reason. 84. Mr. Parry.] Is it not a fact that the man who actually works in those places is the best judge of the effect it has upon him? —Yes, I should think he would be in the best position to judge. 85. The Chairman.] If a place is hot, how often do you take the temperature?—Tt is very rarely taken. You feel it, and judge from the condition of the air in the place. 86. What is to prevent you doing that from day to day? When it is up to a certain heat, how does it make any difference whether you determine the matter by the feel or by the actual temperature?—A dry place may be fit to work in up to a certain temperature higher than a moist place. It is generally the smell of the atmosphere which is coming from the fall of strata as much as the temperature that determines the matter. 87. You admitted to Mr. Reed that it is not advantageous to the company to have hot places? —Yes, I said it was not economical in the interests of the company to have hot places. - 88. Mr. Parry.] If you consider it a sound reason for fixing a maximum temperature, then it is equally a sound reason for not putting in good ventilation. Seeing that it does not pay to do one it cannot pay to do the other?—ln driving in a case like that you are generally driving for ventilation. You generally drive two headings, and one leads to the other. 89. Seeing that it is necessary to have hot places, do you not think that some different arrangements should be made for men working in such places than for other men?— Yes; but there are already recognized provisions for that. 90. You have heard the witnesses state to-day that they would sooner work in a temperature of 84° on the surface than in the same which goes to prove that working underground is the more fatiguing? —The bulk of the men have worked underground since they were boys. They are making that statement from hearsay. I suppose the surface conditions would be better. 91. Well, now, what would you sugerest as a maximum heat? —Some places are fit to work in up to 80° if the air is pure, while other places may be foul with a temperature as low as 76°. 92. Would you suggest, then, that a temperature be fixed at 75° to 77° moist and 79° dry?— Well, I have not taken a great deal of temperatures in hot places. 93. Then you tell us again that you are not in a position to suggest a maximum heat simply because you have not had sufficient practical experience?— With the reading of the thermometer. 94. The Chairman.] Are you in a position to a valid reason why a statutory standard cannot be fixed? Would such a standard be unworkable? —I have met with hot and cold places. 95. Has that given you sufficient personal experience to enable you to express an opinion?— I think so. 96. You think it is not possible to fix a statutory standard?— Well, in answer to that, I would point out that heat is not the guiding factor in deciding. 97. You think, then, it is not necessary to fix the heat?— It would be a very difficult matter to settle for a six-hour place.