57

A.—4

-25 May, 1911.] Imperial Council. [2nd Day. Sir JOSEPH WARD— cont. ment be transferred to such Parliament. I suggested that the principles of the scheme should be : (1) That Canada, Australia, South Africa, New Zealand, and Newfoundland elect to an Imperial House of Representatives for Naval Defence, one representative for each 200,000 of their respective populations; that is (approximately), Canada 37, Australia 25, South Africa 7, New Zealand 6, Newfoundland 2. That is a total of 77. Mr. MALAN : You have only taken the European population, then ? Sir JOSEPH WARD : Entirely so, the white population. Mr. MALAN : Why % The PRESIDENT : You do not make any allowance for the coloured population ? Sir JOSEPH WARD : I understood that when you were framing the South African Constitution you refused to give the coloured population there the right to vote. Speaking generally, you could hardly expect, in connection with an important proposal such as this, that a departure should be made so different to what has been carried out in South Africa, and, speaking generally, in some other countries too. However, that is a matter that can be discussed perhaps in connection with the proposals. lam dealing with the white population, and the white population only. (2) That the mode of electing the representatives be left in each case to the determination of each of the oversea Dominions. Mr. BATCHELOR : Sir Joseph, how would the Imperial Government be represented upon that ? Sir JOSEPH WARD : Perhaps if you will allow me to proceed I can explain; I must take these points in their sequence : (3) That the United Kingdom elect representatives on the same basis —that is, one for every 200,000 of the population —that is, say, 220 members. That the total members of this Imperial House of Representatives thus The PRESIDENT : What would that add up to? Sir JOSEPH WARD : 300. (4) That the term for which they are elected be five years. (5) That the United Kingdom, Canada, Australia, South Africa, New Zealand, and Newfoundland each elect two representatives to be members of an Imperial Council of Defence, thus providing a Council of 12. Sir WILFRID LAURIER : Out of that representation ? Sir JOSEPH WARD : No, I am dealing with the Senate, which is to be elected for such term and in such manner as each of these divisions of the Empire shall determine. The PRESIDENT : With a Council of 12 the United Kingdom would have two ? Sir JOSEPH WARD : Yes. The PRESIDENT : And the Dominions are to have 10. Sir JOSEPH WARD : That is the same principle as exists in all Federal Governments.