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274. Had the men any instruction from the late Manager to prevent overcrowding?— Not to my knowledge. 275 Then it was not because of any verbal instructions that you did not protest against overcrowding?— No. 276 Hon. Mr McKenzie.] What is your principal reason for objecting to overcrowding on the motorman's platform?— Because in the event of anything coming in front of a man he is likely to be hampered in his work by having passengers round him. 277 It is necessary for him to use both hands and feet in case of an emergency?— Yes, 278. And if there is a crowd of passengers he cannot act freely?—No; he is hampered in his 279 Do you know what weight is allowed for passengers in braking the cars? —I could not say 280. Assuming that the weight for average humanity from the cradle to the grave is 10 stone — that is what they are braked for if you put 100 passengers on a car which is licensed to carry and braked for forty-nine, do you think that would be dangerous in a case of emergency? —It would have a detrimental effect," The extra weight would send the car further on when you put the brake on 281 And that would be dangerous to any one on the track? —Yes. 282 And if there was any obstruction on the track, would it not be dangerous to the passengers on the car and to the motorman himself? —I think it would. 283 Mr Hardy ] You have a great many cars in Christchurch ?—Yes. 284, Are they big cars or little cars generally? —The cars in the general traffic are big cars. 285 And the cars generally used by the public are big cars, and not little ones? —Yes. In rush times little cars are used, but in the general traffic the big ones are used. 286. Were my questions to you about the cars reasonable ones? —Yes. 287 And you answered me correctly? —Yes. 288 Hon. Mr It McKe?izie.] Do you think the cars would exceed 9 tons in weight unloaded? —I think so. 289 What do you reckon is the weight of your double-deckers? —I do not know 290 Do you think 15 tons would be near the mark?—l should think they would be more than 15 tons. 291 Do you know, as a matter of fact? —No. Jeremiah Crowi,ey examined. (No. 10.) 1 Mr llonser] What is your occupation? —Motorman, employed by the Christchurch Tramways Board. . . ' 2 What experience have you had as a motorman ? —About fave years in Uiristcliurcli. 3. And previously to that?—A year and a half in Auckland. 4. And before that? —About a year and a half in Brisbane. 3. What brake system have they in Brisbane?— Hand-brakes. They also use a track brake on some of the steeper grades. _ 6. There is a track brake and hand-brake in Auckland, too ? —Yes. 1 What office do you hold in the union?—! am one of the vice-presidents. 8. You have been deputed by the union to give evidence in favour of this Bill?— Yes. : 9. You have read it ? —Yes. 10. And considered it? —Yes. 11. Take clause 2: do you approve of that?— Yes, and consider it necessary. _ 12 Do you consider that a man with a Government certificate after examination would he eligible to drive in any service in the colony?— Yes. The equipments are very much alike, and as to the traffic, he is already used to that. There might be a slight difficulty with regard to the brakes, but that trouble would be got over in one or two days. 13 One or two days' experience would fit a man from Auckland to drive in Christehureh I :y es 14. Take your own case : did you have to go through ninety-six hours' training?—No, I went through a little training on the air brake. 15 And to learn the stops on the road?— Yes. 16. How many days were you doing that?—lt might be three or four, but only parts of days, perhaps for about a couple of hours each time. 17 That would be on the different runs each day? —Yes. 18 You would be practically learning the routes!— Yes. 19* Do you think it would raise the standard of efficiency of motormen if this Bill came into force with regard to the certificates ?—Yes, and it would keep up the efficiency If the efficiency is kept up, there will be greater safety for everybody _ 20 I want you to look at clause 3of the Bill. Do you consider it necessary for an independent officer from the Public Works Department to inspect the equipment after wear-and-tear I —Yes It is even more necessary to have an independent inspection of the equipment and appliances after they have been in use than when they are new The periodical and occasional inspection would keep up'the efficiency. Prevention is better than cure. 21 Then you think it would be better to prevent accidents rather than to wait until an accident happens and.then to inspect the equipment? —Yes. 22 Clause 5, subclause (b) You believe the licensing of cars should be m the hands of the Government?— Yes a disinterested party, I reckon, should have the licensing of the cars. The managements can, under the present system, run anything on wheels—there is nothing to stop them.