I.—sa,

58

[k. letham.

21. How is that? —I do not take particular notice. 22. Have I ever been to the office except on that particular occasion? —I cannot recollect it. 23. You cannot recall more than txvice? —I saidj twice—l said that before. 24. When?— Last June. 25. Was I there with anybody else in 1907? —I dare say I have seen you backwards and forwards —I do not know when. 26. Did you. ever show me into Mr. Kensington's room?— Not except on that one occasion. 27. W T ould you be astonished to know that you showed me and another gentleman into Mr. Kensington's room?—I would, yes. 28. Are you prepared to say you did not, or simply that you cannot remember it? —No, I would not do that, because it is a public room, and people come backwards and forwards. 29. How many people a day?—l never counted them. 30. And you mean to say you have such a good memory that you can remember people going in and the exact words said two months after? —I recollect this particular visit quite clearly. 31. And you cannot recollect any other person on any ether occasion? —No. 32. Or xvhether I went with any other person?— No. 33. Is that not very curious?—l do not think it. I remember you calling in by yourself after Mr. Kensington returned. 34. When xvas that ? —lt was some time in July probably. I could not say the date. I do not take any note of xvhen people call. 35. Except when you are reminded? —No, I. xvas not reminded. 36. Were you not?—No, I jvas merely asked if I could recall. 37. When xvas it first suggested to you that it xvas shortly after Mr. Kensington came back from Gisborne? —Mr. Kensington asked me the question now. 38. Was it never suggested to you before to-day? —No. 39. When did he come back from Gisborne? —He came back about the 26th April, 1907. I remember it xvas txvo days after the mayoral election of 1907. 40. When did you look up the mayoral election to see xvhat the date of it xvas?—l did look up the date, certainly. 41. When—since you xx-ere examined here the last time? —Yes. 42. Who suggested that you should look up the date of the mayoral election?—No one suggested it. 43. What was the object of it?— Just to refresh my memory. 44. On xvhat?—On your visit. I remembered it was a few days afterwards. 45. Have you seen the evidence that has been printed here?— No. 40. Why should you remember Mr. Macdonald, any more than any other person, coming with me?—l do not know that I would, but simply I can recall it. I made the remark, "It is the first time I have seen you two gentlemen together." 47. You have been txventy years in Wellington? —Not in the Lands and Survey Department. 48. Were you not in the colony in 1890?— Yes. 49. You had to be in the colony to be there?— Yes. 50. Hoxv long did we stay there ?—I cannot say. 51. Who showed us out?—l cannot tell you. 52. Were you there xvhen xve came out?— No. 53. You did not see us going out?— No. Paul Verschaffelt re-examined. (No. 15.) 1. Mr. Kensington.] What is your name?— Paul Verschaffelt. 2. What position do you hold in the Lands and Survey Department?—l am Record Clerk. 3. Are you not also a member of the Accountants' Society?— Yes. - 4. Have you passed your examination? —Y~es, but have to complete one subject for the final. I am an associate. 5. Do you remember, on the 29th April, 1907, my ringing a bell for you and asking you for some papers in connection with the derelict lands?— Yes, I remember the date. 6. When you came into my room whom did you see?— Mr. Macdonald and Mr. Hislop. 7. Which did you know?— Mr. Hislop. 8. Hoxv did you know Mr. Hislop?—The first time I knexv him was at the accountants' students' dinner, on the 21st November, 1906. Mr. Hislop xvas there. 9. Of the two gentlemen you saw, the only one you knew was Mr. Hislop?—Yes. I asked the messenger who the other gentleman xvas, and he told me it was Mr. Macdonald. 10. And you are quite positive the two were present in my room on that occasion?— Quite positive. 11. Your duty as Record Clerk is also to read all letters that come through to you from the Chief Clerk and that I write?— Yes. 12. Do you remember my writing that letter of the 29th April?— Yes. 13. It came out to you to be recorded the same day?— Yes, the same afternoon, I think it was. 14. You have been in the habit of testing my memory very often : what sort of a memory do you think I have? —For remembering correspondence going through, I should say a first-class memory. 15. Hon. Mr. Hislop.] Do you remember bringing any other records into the room when you say I xvas there? —The papers I brought in first were dealing with the Te Aro foreshore cases. 16. Do you remember any other subsequent visit?— Yes, at the time the Mayor of Miramar's land xvas concerned. It was with regard to Mr, Crawford's land.