91

H.—2l.

E. SIMPSON.]

66. Do you order gravy beef sometimes? —Yes; E- S is having beef-tea now, and has been ever since she came out of Hospital. If a girl is sick she always has beef-tea. Sometimes the Matron has a little. 67. Have you heard the Matron speaking against Miss Mills or any other member of the staff? —No. 68. She has never discussed with you or other members of the staff some other member who is absent? —No. 69. Do you remember on one occasion when Miss Mills was discussing girls with the Matron the Matron made an unpleasant remark to Miss Mills herself ?—No. 70. This was the remark, " You may have been as bad as the girls when you came here. 1 did not put you on the reception-table. I did not know so much in those days." Do you remember that remark?—l never heard that. 71. Are you quite sure? —Yes. 72. Did you not discuss this very matter with Miss Howden, and say Miss Mills had no spirit? —I never said Miss Mills has no spirit. The first part of that remark I heard, but I have never heard the latter part before. 73. Which part did you hear?—" You may have been as bad as they when you came here." 74. What do you think the Matron meant when she said that?—l do not know. I do not think it is fair to ask me that. 75. The Commissioner.] Who said that?— The Matron. 76. To whom? —Miss Mills. 77. Were they disputing over anything?—l do not know how it came up now, but the Matron only said it in a jovial kind of way. The latter part I never heard before. It was never meant. It was said jokingly. 78. Mr. Salter.] Did you not afterwards express surprise to other members of the staff at the Matron making such a remark? —Miss Howden came to me and said if it had been made to her she would not have liked it, and I said, " Neither would I." 79. Is the Matron in the habit of speaking coarsely about the girls?— Never in my hearing. 80. It is said that the general subject of conversation at the table is about the immorality and bad ways of the girls : is that so ?—No. Sometimes we have to discuss the girls, but we only do so when it is necessary in the interests of the Home. One staff might come in and say she had had trouble with a girl, and it might be talked about; but that is not the general conversation. 81. You do not speak about what has happened to the girls before they come to the Home?-— Not as a rule, or unless it may be helpful to us. It is not the common conversation. 82. You know E- S ?—Yes. 83. When did you see her after she came back from Timaru? —On the following morning. 84. How was she looking?— Very depressed. I went in to her, and said how sorry I was to see her there, and the way she had come back. She began to cry, and said she had been very silly. I told her to take heart, and make up her mind to be good, and that we would all do what we could to help her along. 85. Did she look ill? —She was crying so much I could not see her face. 86. Did she appear to you to be in a bad state of health? —No; I did not think she was ill at all. 87. In discussing the Home and this inquiry, did the Matron ever tell you that Miss Howden was at the bottom of it?— No. She wondered who was. 88. Did she mention Miss Howden at all? —No. 89. Or that she was responsible for the letters appearing in the papers?—l do not recollect. We spoke of it generally. 90. Have you ever seen the Matron boxing other girls' ears?— Never. I have heard the girls say so. 91. The Commissioner.] Have you kept in touch with any of the girls after they have left here finally or during their periods of service? —Yes; several of them have written to me. They write very nice letters, and it seems to me as if they did not appreciate the Home until they are away from it. When they get into situations they are able to see what the Home is. They send nice messages to the Matron and the staff, and say how grateful they are for what has been done to them. But when here their whole idea is to get away. I have always got on well with the girls. 92. Have you formed the opinion, from the way they write to you and keep in touch with you, that they have really benefited, and that there is a genuine desire to be good ?—Yes. 'I know the staff do the very best for the girls, because in the evening sometimes, when we talk about them, one will say, " I wish I could do so-and-so," or " I wish I could do more." We cannot do more, because the little girls and the big girls are together. 93. Have you formed the opinion that if the worst type of .girls was separated from the others it would be better? —Oh, yes. The difference when the girls who were examined first were kept separate was noticeable even to the girls. They remarked to me at different times how nice it was without these other girls. Frederick Richard Inwood examined on oath. 1. Mr. Russell.] You are a minister of the Church of England, located at Burwood?—Yes. 2. How long have you been in close touch with the Home?— Seven or eight years. 3. And you are here pretty often? —Always once a week, and sometimes twice. 4. From your observations, are you able to form any opinion as to the way the Home is administered ?—Yes. 5. You do not go just into a room and then out again?—No; I go right through the whole institution, and see a great deal.