H.—29

95

Charles Wadley, previously sworn, was recalled and further examined. (No. 50.) 146. The Chairman] You read some of the evidence given by some of the crew of the " Tutanekai "as to wool being shipped during wet weather: you wish to make a statement? —I cannot make out what they are referring to. 147. They did" not give us any dates: they would not fix any date?--I can only remember one occasion when there were about twenty bales on the wharf. I saw a black south-wester coming up, and, as I could not get the wool aboard the ship, I had it sent back to the shed. It would take about four minutes with ten men to get it back—that is, two bales each. The hatches would be covered, and everything ready in a few minutes. 148. Mr. Foster] Did any of that wool come out of the shed again?—Yes, about three days after. 149. We have been talking about the last loading day?—The last day we started at half past 8 and knocked off at about half past 9, and started again at 1 o'clock, because it was bad weather. All the wool that came out that day was on trucks. 150. Did you take any wool off the trucks that had afterwards to be taken into the shed. Every bale you took off the trucks went into the ship?—Except a line of forty bales which was brought out and had to go back again. 151. Was that at early morning? —Yes, between half past 8 and half past 9. 152. Was there any lying on the wharf at that time? —No, none at all. 153. So you are clear that there was no wool lying on the wharf when a shower came on which forced you to take it back again?—No, only that time 1 said to the men, " Yon will have to take that back again." A black south-wester was coming up. 154. The Chairman] Was that on the last day?—No. 155. Mr. Foster] That only happened once?—Yes. 156. And you are satisfied it was not out sufficiently long to get wet?—Ten men were running it in—two bales each. They did not roll them. 157. It was too hard work for them? —One man could roll a dump along, but the truck would be faster and easier. But the wharf is always swept up after any rain, and there would not be likely to be much water on it. 158. The Commission is hearing it now; but what we understood was an agreement between those who were carrying out the observations? —What I have told you in the box is true, as I have always known that wool is liable to catch fire. We have always had that impression, and take precautions against it if possible. The Commission adjourned sine die. The Commission proceeded to Christchurch this day.

Christchurch, Tuesday, 4th September, 1906. The Commission met in the Provincial Council Chamber, Christchurch, at 10.30 a.m. Stewart Henry Willis sworn and examined. (No. 51.) 1. The Chairman] What is your name?—Stewart Henry Willis. 2. What are you?—l am surveyor to Lloyd's Register, and a master mariner. 3. The Commission understand that you have had a very extensive experience with reference to the shipping of wool and other articles, and also an intimate knowledge in regard to the stowage of these articles, and we should be glad to have the benefit of your knowledge on the matter ?— Well, I presume it is in connection with these fires that have occurred during the last few months in the different ships. Of course, it is a difficult matter without having full data in reference to theso fires for one to express a definite opinion, but a great deal of what has occurred here on different occasions both on board ships and the condition of the wool that has been found in stores has been, so far as my personal opinion is concerned, caused by spontaneous combustion in wool. 4. Can you say, in your opinion, what is the condition of the wool to which that may be due? —Well, it may be caused by several things—by the wool being packed damp, by excessive vegetable matter in the wool, and we have had several very bad cases in connection with the heating of wool of which I have some notes here. 1 may state that from 1893 up to the date the underwriters' surveyor was abolished, I was surveyor to the underwriters as well as to Lloyd's Register, and these instances came before me principally in that position. Since last June twelvemonth, of course, I have not had the same amount to do with the shipment of wool. I think the worst instance that came under my notice was in connection with a vessel that has just been burnt entirely at sea —the " Pitcairn Island." These bales were found on board shipped in a very bad condition indeed. They were stowed in the 'tween-decks, and were practically in a completelycharred condition. The pack had to a great extent disappeared, having been burnt, and the condition of the wool itself—it was very much shrunk—reminded me of a caked mass of pitch, and the heat was very great indeed. There was no other cargo stowed in the vicinity of the wool. I am not quite sure whether it was sliped wool or scoured wool, but it was one or the other. There were a number of bales of the same mark—lo3 bales on the vessel of the same mark. 5. What was the mark?—" CM.C. Ltd." And this was in January, 1896. On behalf of the underwriters I suggested that the whole of this mark should be taken out of the ship. My report in connection with the matter was as follows: "Confirming my verbal message of this morning, I beg to inform you that two bales of wool marked ' C.M.C. Ltd,' were found by me this