H.—2l.

R. TROUP.]

139

281. That, of course, was immediately after the sheep were stolen, and in December of the same year you said, " There was nothing to take sheep from turnips to tussock, which last was poor feed." Atkinson : I submit you cannot take the witness through his evidence in that way. i ;282. Dr. Findlay.] The evidence you gave before the Supreme Couit was correct, I understand ?— It"yvas just as the thing was then. You can understand that nineteen years afterwards I cannot remember every word I said. 283. You told Mr. Atkinson that sheep will wander, but that if sheep did wander off good feed they would soon go back to it again ?—Yes ; they will gather back and camp in their old ground. 284. There is one thing I have not asked, it is about the skins which were in the Court and which were found in Meikle's smithy ?—I saw the two skins at the Supreme Court trial. 285. How many years have you been dealing with sheep-skins ?—Since I was a boy. 286. What age are you now ?—Nearly sixty-one. 287. You saw these skins at the Supreme Court : did you look at them carefully ? —I did. 288. Can you tell us from your knowledge and experience that those skins came from sheep which had died from inflammation or exposure, or whether they came from sheep which had been killed with a knife ?—They came from sheep which had been killed in the usual way by the butcher. They were well preserved and were of a good yellow colour on the inside, and the wool upon them was tight and strong. You could not pull the wool from the skin. If they hf.d come from a sheep which had died, the wool would have come flopping off. It would have come off quite easily, because if a skin is taken off a dead sheep, the rotting process having begun on the carcase, it is well known the skin is damaged to such an extent that the wool will not adhere to it as it will should a skin from a sheep fresh killed by the butcher. 289. Were there any other signs on those skins you saw in the Court which showed that they were not taken from a dead sheep ? —They were of a good healthy yellow colour on the inside with none of the marks which appear on the skin of a sheep which has died. The skin of a sheep which has died is streaky on the surface with red blood-marks and fat perhaps adhering to it. 290. lam appealing to you as an expert. Do you tell their Honours as an expert that the skins you saw came from butcher-killed sheep ? —Yes, most decidedly. 291. Did you notice whether there were any wire-marks on those skins ?—There were no wiremarks whate\ 7 er. 292. Mr. Atkinson.] Are you absolutely clear about that, or is it because you are assuming that they were skins from the hut ?—I assume that they were hanging on the fence at the hut. 293. Ido not want you to assume that at all. I want to know whether, apart from any ques+ion of where the skins came from, you examined the skins and found that there were no wire-marks ?— Yes ; I inspected them thoroughly and saw that they were good sound skins from sheep which had been killed in the usual way, and that there were no wire-marks. 294. You refer to the fact, I understand, that if a sheep was allowed to remain long dead the skin becomes discoloured, and so on. Supposing the sheep is skinn< d directly after the animal has dl d. Supposing it has died a natural death and is skinned pretty promptly, would any of these symptoms be found on the skin ?—Well, the skin of a sheep which has died is not of the same value as that of a sheep which has been killed, because it is not a sound skin. 295. But where the skin is taken off immediately after death ?—Well, immediately after death, of course. 296. Do not these symptoms that you mention depend upon the length of time that the body is allowed to lie ? —lf the blood stays in the body before the animal is skinned, the skin is discoloured. Mr. Justice Edwards : I should not think for a moment that it could be the same because before a butcher skins a sheep he has drained off the blood, whereas in regard to the sheep you mention, it is not drained. In the case of a sheep dying, the blood is through the whole of the body. 297. Mr. Atkinson.] There is this difference you speak of whether there is an interval of time or not ?—The skin is discoloured, but to what extent all depends on how long it is between the time of death and the time it is skinned. James Danvers Leece sworn and examined. 298. Dr. Findlay.] What are you ? —I am a police constable, stationed at Roxburgh. 299. Where were you stationed in the year 1887 ? —At Mataura. 300. How many miles by road was your police-station from Meikle's farm ?—lt would be about fourteen miles. 301. Were any complaints made to you about sheep-stealing in the year 1887 ? —Yes. 302. By whom ?—By Mr. Troup. 303. Can you recollect about what time the first complaints were made to you by Troup ? —It would be about the middle of the year ; I cannot say what month. 304. Were complaints made subsequent to that date by Troup ? —Yes. 305. How long after ? —I cannot remember. It would not be very long after. 306. Ido not expect you at this distance of time to be able to give exact dates. At any rate not long after you were seen by Troup again, who complained about sheep-stealing ? —Yes. 307. Do you recollect what took place between Troup and yourself ?—Troup and myself and Cameron ? 308. Do you remember whether Troup saw you before you saw Cameron with Troup ? What was the first time you saw Troup, and what did he say ?—Troup spoke to me about the middle of the year, and he complained about sheep-stealing. I cannot exactly say what the conversation was, but he led me to believe that a number of sheep were missing on Islay Station.