W. L. WILLIAMS.]

5

Or.— s.

135. And he would have full authority to do as lie thought proper?— Yes. 136. With regard to the scholars who have attended this school, have the trustees or have you watched their career after they left to see whether their education has been of material advantage to them? —I do not think the trustees generally have watched them. They come from all parts of the colony, you see. We know some of them, but we cannot keep count of the great number of them, because some come from the extreme north and from the extreme south. Formerly we had one from the Chatham Islands. 137.. From your own knowledge you are not able to give any individual illustrations of pupils who have succeeded in after-life after finishing their education at the College?— There is one sitting before you, Mr. Ngata. 138. I mean, beyond Mr. Ngata?—There are several others. Dr. Pomare is another. There is also Peter Buck, who passed-his medical examinations in Dunedin not long ago. The Rev. Mr. Hawkins, at Auckland, is another, and there is a medical student now at Dunedin, Tutere Wi Repa. There is another as assistant at the Theological College at Te Rau, Gisborne. He went for some time to the Canterbury College, but he did not take his degree. 139. What is about the average number who attend Te Aute College?—l think the number at present is eighty. 140. But outside those who have qualified in the learned professions, do you know of any who in commercial life have been successful ?—No, I cannot say I do. 141. Mr. Lee.] May I ask what Archdeacon Williams has done for Te Aute out of his own means? —I cannot tell you. 142. Has he put up any particular buildings or done any special work?— His great outlay was in the improvement of the property. 143. In what way?—ln bringing it into productive condition. 144. By paying wages and that sort of thing?— Yes, and spending a great deal of money on fencing and improving the property generally. 145. You mean generally that he has spent more money than he has accounted for in his balance-sheets ?—Yes. 146. Is any portion of the income of £2,200 diverted to any other purpose than the maintenance of the schools and the upkeep of the property ?—No. 147. You did not consider the cutting-up of the property when you re-leased it, but did it not occur to you to call for tenders when letting such a large property as that? —No. In our opinion we considered it better to do as we did. 148. Of course, you knew and trusted Archdeacon Williams, and thought he would be the best tenant? —Yes. 149. You say you asked Mr. Horace Baker to give you an estimate of what would be a fair rent: was any other gentleman's estimate of the value of the property taken into consideration? — No, I think not. 150. You depended largely on Mr. Horace Baker? —Yes. 151. Mr. Eliott.] Can you tell us whether any leases at any time were offered by public auction or tender, or, in granting the last lease, were you just following the usual practice?—l am not aware of any leases being advertised. I have only been connected with the trust for the last eleven years, and this is the only lease that has been negotiated within that time. 152. You spoke of a power of attorney to Archdeacon Williams: is that still in force, or has it been revoked by the present trustees? —It. has not been revoked. 153. He can act under lhat power of attorney? —Yes. 154. In regard to the moneys that have been advanced by Archdeacon Williams outside of the receipts, do the trustees look on these as a free gift, or are they a charge on the property ?—They were free gifts. 155. I would like your opinion as a guide in reference to paragraph No. 6 of our order of reference, as to " whether the school or schools are so conducted as to give to the children contemplated in the trust the greatest benefit"? —1 think they are so conducted as to give them as much benefit as we can. 156. And "especially whether there is sufficient provision for manual and technical education of the children of both races " ?—ln my opinion; 1 think so. 157. Would it be possible to form agricultural classes as well as technical classes?— Well, the trustees have not thought agricultural classes advisable. The parents of the children rather object to very much of that kind of work. 158. But the trustees would be in favour of it?—W T e rather consider the opinion of the parents in the matter. 159. The Chairman.] I suppose the wishes of the parents of the children are entitled to be considered, whether ihey want their boy to be made a farmer, or a lawyer, or a member of Parliament? ■ —I think so. They manage their agricultural operations very well in most parts of the country. 160. I suppose if agriculture could be taught at the institution it might be of advantage to the rising generation?—To a certain extent, perhaps. 161. Anything that would, tend to promote the welfare of these people?— Yes. Other branches of technical education probably would be more valuable to them than agriculture. 162. There is one question I omitted to ask. Two of the grants are for the benefit of the aboriginal inhabitants, and the other two are for the benefit of the aboriginal inhabitants and the Europeans, but I understand the whole of the trust has been worked as one? —Yes; it has alwaj's been worked as one. 163. So you allow European boys to go to the school just the same as Maoris?— Yes. There are some European boys there now. 164. Do they pay school fees?— Some of them do. 165. And as regards the Maoris? —They do not pay fees generally. They are free. Of course, the Government scholars come with Government assistance.