1.—12 a.

6

[t. w. kick

5. Do you think the germination of seed is an indication of its quality ?—lt is an indication of the results you will get from it. It might be of good appearance and yet not grow. 6. Supposing it does grow, is that an indication of its quality ? Supposing you take a swede turnip, where you may get a good bulb or a, poor bulb ? —Mere germination would not show that. 7. Is there anything in this Bill to protect the farmer in the quality of his seed even if it germinates, and after you have had an expert to check adulteration ? I want to get at the value of the Bill to the farmer ?—You want to know if after the germination you will get a good bulb. This examination will not show that. 8. To make the Bill what it ought to be, ought not that to be included?— You would have to wait until later in the season before you could tell that. 9. Would you not provide in a Bill of this sort that the seed should have a good history, and should be grown from a proper cultivation?— That is desirable, but we could not do that in a Bill of this kind. 10. Do you know anything about the growing of seed so as to obtain good results ?—Yes. 11. How would you treat your seed-plants if you were going to grow turnips?— You would examine them and take anything out that was not good and strong. 12. During what part of the year would you sow for seed ?—That would depend upon the district, and whether my land was wet or dry. I should first of all take care that my land was extremely clean. 13. Would you sow in the spring or the autumn ?—I should sow in both. 14. Turnip-seed ?—Yes, if I wished to cross-test. 15. When would you rogue it ?—As soon as I could ascertain from the appearance of my plants. 16. And when would you expect the plants ?—That I could not tell you. I have not done it on a large seale —only in experimental crops. 17. Really this is only a test for ridding the seed of impurities and ascertaining its germinatingpower ?—Yes. 18. And the germinating-power might be absolutely worthless ?—lt might be in certain cases, but it is not likely. It would certainly be valuable with grass-seed. 19. Within your knowledge huge quantities of seed come out to this colony perfectly free from adulteration, and with a statement of 98 per cent, of germinating-power, and yet that seed would show no indication of growing ?—I would not say huge quantities, but I know such seed does come. 20. Do you not think that, if you are going to protect the farmer, you want to make a good Bill and not a sham ?—To do that I think you would want more extensive machinery than you have in this Bill, and a heavy expenditure for a fully equipped seed-testing statio-n. 21. In Holland and in many of the Continental countries there are huge quantities of rape grown that come into competition with the Essex rape in England. The Essex rape is grown miles and miles from the other and has no impurities, and yet that seed is brought out here without any test, and is largely useless after it is grown ?—Yes. We should have to go much further and have a proper testing-station. 22. Is that not what you should aim at ?—Yes, but we have not the money for it. We should have to get a proper testing-station. 23. The remedy for it is that the seed should be accompanied by a certificate from the grower duly attested at Home ?—Certainly that would help. 24. Further, all these seeds should be subject to a test over twelve months in your own trial beds of the Agricultural Department ?—That would go very much further than this Bill provides. I agree with you, but to carry out the work would be much more elaborate and costly. 25. Mr. Rhodes.] I see that " seeds " includes seeds of every kind used in agriculture or horticulture. Do you propose to test horticultural seeds ? —That only means the ordinary vegetables. It was difficult to draw the exact line where you should stop in a Bill. It means seeds for the market-gardener—peas and beans, and so on. 26. Mr. Kirkbride.] You said you would defy any man going into a seed-merchant's store to detect the worst sample in the store ? Do I understand you to mean as far as germinating-power is concerned? —I mean that there is such a tremendous stock of seeds that if a man had to go in and pick his sample himself, as with the fertilisers, and go away, I would guarantee that he would not be able to find it without help from the vendor. 27. That would be only a test of the germinating-power of the seed? —Of the purity, as far as the mixture of other seeds was concerned, and the germination. 28. You could not go in the direction that Mr. Mackenzie spoke of ?—No, we do not propose that. We should have to get a proper testing-place and the equipment and staff. There is no doubt that it will come to that, and the sooner the better, but at present we have not the facilities or money for it. This Bill seems to me to be a step in the right direction, and I think it will do a great deal of good. I was sorry to hear Mr. Mackenzie say he thought the Bill would be worthless. 29. This Bill will be a threat over the heads of the different seed-merchants. They will probably be afraid of retaining bad samples of seed in their stores. You saw what the seedsmen, Messrs. Kaye and Waters, said the other day with regard to grass-seed for export ?—Yes. 30. They thought it would be unfair if there was not some discrimination used. They told us they did a large export trade in mixed seeds and so on?— Yes. 31. Is it the intention of the Department to make some discrimination ?—There is no necessity for it. I explained to them that they are supplying the samples, and they would not supply samples meant for export only.