I.—4a.

64

SMITH LAUGHTON PATRICK FREE.

67. What would be the effect of this Bill being passed, compelling the men to change shifts at the surface ?—lt would mean this : There must be a lapse of time if you worked your shifts in so that they interleave d You could not have the men working twenty-four hours a day. 68. Will you put it in writing, so that I can see what you mean ? —Very well, I will. 69. Do you know where the miners change shifts at the Thames and on the Coromandel Peninsula ?— I know very little about those mines. 70. The capitalists at Reefton and the Coromandel Peninsula do not act in unison in regard to labour questions?—No; we act on our own initiative. 71. There is no connection between the management of the companies—the directorates?— No connection at all that I am aware of. 72. I think you said that this Bill was not specially required at Reefton ?—lt is not as far as I am aware. 73. Do you think that if it was required you would be aware of it?—l should think so. If a man whom I employed wanted anything he would ask me. 74. Do you think the president or the secretary of the miners' union would be likely to go to you to ask to get a measure like this placed on the statute-book ?—No ; but I think that if they thought the request was reasonable they would have asked the Court for it before now. 75. Do you not think they would have been more likely to have appealed to their member, Mr. Colvin ?—I do not see why they should. I may say that the relations between the men and ourselves for the last two or three years have been of the most cordial nature, and whenever any suggestions have been made by them that we could grant we have done so. 76. But do you not think that the men would be more likely to appeal to Mr. Colvin, whom they sent here, to get a measure like this passed than to you?—l thought Mr. Colvin was the representative of the whole community, and not particularly of the miners. 77. Suppose that the miners' union at Reefton asked me to try and get a measure like this passed, would you think they wanted it ?—When you are making a bargain of any sort you try to get the best terms possible. 78. You stated in evidence that you did not think this Bill was asked for by the Reefton miners. I asked you whether you thought the Reefton miners would be likely to go to you if they wanted a measure of this kind passed?—Yes; and I say that if they want a concession of this sort 79. It is not a concession ?—lt is a concession. 80. I did not say anything about it being a concession. If the miners wanted a measure like this passed, would they be more likely to go to Mr. Colvin, their representative in Parliament, than to you? —If any legislation were required, of course they would go to Mr. Colvin. I, or any other representative of the mine-owners, am quite powerless to obtain legislation. It would be absurd to apply to the mine-owners for any statutory concession, because we have no power to control Parliament. But if the men wanted this concession it could have been obtained, if deserved, without any interference of Parliament at all. 81. Now, if Mr. Colvin said that the miners did ask him to get a measure like the one now before the Committee placed on the statute-book, would that indicate that the men wanted it ?— Yes ; I should believe that Mr. Colvin was speaking the truth. 82. But would you believe that the miners wanted a measure like this placed on the statutebook ? —No; I should say that some members of the union executive, for reasons which may or may not be for the benefit of the men, wished the measure passed, but not the miners. 83. Suppose that a poll of the miners working at your mine and the other mines at Reefton was taken, and 90 per cent, said they wanted a measure of this kind passed, would you believe they wanted it ?—Yes; and if I were a miner and a poll was demanded I should certainly vote for it, because I would reckon that I should sell my labour at the best price. 84. Would you believe that the miners wanted the measure I asked ? —I believe that if you asked them whether they would like £1 a day for wages they would say " Yes." 85. The Chairman.] Do you believe the miners want this Bill passed on principle ?—They want any concession they can get. 86. Mr. Guinness.] Is it a concession ?—Yes. 87. Then they want it? —I have no doubt that in that way they do; but Ido not believe there is the slightest dissatisfaction with the present hours of labour, because the hours now, since the last award was made, are shorter than they have been at any time since the field was opened. While I think of it, I might say that the Mines Report says that the Reefton mines are the bestventilated in the colony. 88. Mr. R. McKenzie.] I think you said, in answer to Mr. Allen, that the Arbitration Court had power to fix the hours of labour ? —Yes. 89. Can you, as a solicitor, tell us whether the Arbitration Court has power to fix the hours of labour at more than eight hours and a half a day ?—The position is this : The Court has power to decide any dispute that comes before is. Every dispute is decided according to the circumstances of the case and the law of the colony for the time being. 90. The Chairman.] Mr. McKenzie asks you whether the Court can override the law of last session fixing eight hours and a half as a limit?—No, certainly it cannot. The Arbitration Court has to make its awards in conformity with the statute law of the colony. 91. Mr. R. McKenzie.] The Court cannot compel any miner to work more than eight hours and a half a day ? —No ; every Court is subject to the control of Parliament. 92. You mean that the Court can fix the hours of labour as long as they are within the statutory limit ? —Certainly ; that is why we object to an arbitrary statutory limit. 93. Have you ever heard of such a thing as " miners' complaint" at Reefton?—l have.