91

A.—4

£9 Bs. 3d.; Western Australia, £15 ss. IOd. ; New Zealand, £6 16s. 6d.; Victoria, £6 ss. 10d.; and Tasmania, £4 17s. The mean is £7 10s. lid., against our £6 16s. 6d. To that has to be added the cost of the Commonwealth Government, so that it seems that the public expenditure •will be increased rather than diminished ?—lt looks as if it will for the time being. 1514. You were under the impression that we would get money cheaper as a Commonwealth than as individual States : how much cheaper?—l cannot say. 1515. What is the rate of interest of English Consols?— Even that I cannot say. Ido not appear as a financier. 1516. But you state we would get money cheaper: a good many say that, and I want to clear my mind on that point ?—lt is only an idea. 1517. You know the nominal rate of the last loan raised by New Zealand was 3 per cent. ?— Yes. 1518. If Consols at the present moment are at 2f per cent., is it likely there will be a very material decrease in the rate of interest the Commonwealth will have to pay?— Well, perhaps not. 1519. Then, under these circumstances, the difference we could borrow at as a separate State and as a State of the Commonwealth would be insignificant ? —lt would be, approximately. 1520. And it is by no means proved that there would be any difference ?—No, it is not proved. As I said, it is just an idea of mine. 1521. Sometimes we have reasons for our ideas ? —Sometimes we have, and sometimes we have not. 1522. Hon. the Chairman.] Do you mean that we could borrow cheaper in the matter of the local loans of the individual State of New Zealand ?—Yes, that was my idea on the subject. 1523. Do you think the Commonwealth would guarantee the loans of each individual State ? —Well, the security might be looked upon as being better through our being part of the Commonwealth. 1524. That was not so with the old provincial loans. It was expressly stated that the colony was not responsible for any of those ?—Still, the security might be looked upon as being better even supposing there was no guarantee from the Commonwealth. 1525. But do you think in all probability that it would be?—l think so. Joseph Spaeeow examined. (No. 35.) 1526. Hon. the Chairman.] What is your name ? —Joseph Sparrow. 1527. What is your occupation ?—General engineer and ironfounder. 1528. How long have you resided in New Zealand ? —Thirty-two years. 1529. Have you resided in Australia at all ?—No; I have only visited it. 1530. Can you favour the Commission with your opinions as to the advantage or disadvantage of New Zealand federating with Australia?—l must explain, sir, that I have never considered the whole question sufficiently to be able to give an intelligent opinion any further than what the effect would be on myself. Under the more favourable laws that they have in Australia, by which a 'man can get paid for his work when it is done, I would not be afraid of Australian competition. I would be more afraid of America and Germany. But under the present system we are handicapped with laws which would cause federation to affect us very seriously. It does now. I have done a considerable amount of work for Sydney, being a free port, but I cannot do anything with Victoria on account of the tariff; but Victorians can work for New Zealand,' because they can land their goods on the wharf and get paid for them so soon as they send them over. Here we have to give credit for thirty-one days, according to the laws of New Zealand. Consequently, we must look for larger profits, which more than overbalance the 5-per-cent. duty and cost of freight. If that Act were done away with, and we had the same hours of labour and the same wages as other places, I do not know that I would have anything to fear from competition. In slack times here it would be worth one's while to cast an eye over to the other side, and pick up contracts. I have known that done, and people here contract for work in the iron line over in Australia, and make a good thing out of it. I have known steamers built here, and sent over to Sydney. The " Port Jackson " was one. She was a good boat, and the owners are well pleased with her. 1531. You say you are not afraid to compete with Australia : can you tell us of any advantages that would accrue to this colony through federating with Australia ?—We would have a larger field, and we would look to Australia for work. 1532. Can you speak of other industries in New Zealand ?—No; but there is no doubt that some industries must suffer, and that others would be benefited. I think it would regulate itself; but I have not gone sufficiently into the facts of the case. 1533. What industries do you think might be benefited by federation ?—I think that farming would be benefited by having an open market for the produce. 1534. But manufacturing industries ?—I do not know outside of my own, but there is no doubt there might be others that would be benefited. 1535. Have you considered the question in any way except as it affects the industries of New Zealand?— No. 1536. Mr. Millar.] You said that you believed that under federation we could compete with the other side ?—ln many cases, not in everything. 1537. Have we not got competition from the other side now ? —Yes; but that is because they have better laws than we have, and they get paid for their work when it is done. But for that I do not think they could compete with us. 1538. Under the Workmen's Wages Act you have to lie out of money for thirty-one days or a month ?—That is, before we can ask for it. If the article remains in our hands until the money was paid it would be safer, but it has gone out of our hands before we can apply for payment.