33

G.—2

land was to be at Ohau, inland of the railway. It may have been shown on the plan—l think it was. When we first went into Mangakahia's Court there were three divisions shown upon our plan. The 1,200-acre lot was then all east of the railway. I believe the tribe saw the plan before we took it into Mangakahia's Court. Before we went into Court the objection to the Ohau section was made, and I agreed to alter the locality to Eaumatangi. The alternative section of Eaumatangi was shown on the plan we took into Court. There were therefore four sections in all on the plan. All the divisions were discussed by the tribe. They knew that Pomare had objected. They were there, and heard what was said. [Appellate Book, Otaki, page 73.] I admit that I cut off No. 14. I brought it before the tribe, and they consented. It was in the Court that Nicholson made his objection. I don't remember his objecting outside the Court. [Horowhenua Commission, page 28, questions 115,116, read out.] I repeat, the only objection that I heard Nicholson make was in Court. When we were talking outside Pomare, Heni Kipa, Nicholson, Eu Eeweti, Waretini, Watene, and others were present. I don't remember exactly what was said. The land at Ohau was the only piece of land objected to by the descendants of Whatanui. There are no 'stones at Raumatangi. It was the sand that was objected to there. [Horowhenua Commission, page 32, questions 204, 205, read out.] They must have put in the part about the land being cut off in Court. I did not say it. [Appellate Book, Otaki, page 73, read.] I admit the correctness of those minutes ; but they do not say I cut off the land in Court. I have stated that after I had agreed to place the 1,200 acres at Eaumatangi Lewis came up and reminded me that the land was to be near the lake. [Appellate Book, Otaki, page 78, read out.] Mr. Morison was very severe on me, and I replied evasively, You know all about it. Morison was endeavouring to injure me. It was outside the Court the misunderstanding arose between McDonald and myself, when No. 4 division was awarded, some days after the railway block was ordered. I think it was at the time of Kahui's Court. The tribe gave me No. 14 after No. 4 was ordered. I cannot fix the hour or day. It was when the numbers allotted approached near to 14 that I asked the tribe to consent to my having No. 14, and they did. [Horowhenua Commission, page 32, questions 215 to 218, read out.] That is wrong. McDonald asked me if I was a trustee, and I said No, that the land was mine, and I could put whom I chose into it. [Horowhenua Commission, page 32, question 320, read out.] I say myself that No. 14 is mine alone. The tribe know it also. It is mine by mana, chieftainship, and ancestry. You will find my genealogy in the Court minute-book for 1872. Kupe is my ancestor, —but lam not going to give my genealogy. I have a claim to this land from Puakiteao, through Eiunga. I cut off No. 6 out of my own land for the rerewaho. I was trustee for them. I was pui into No. 9as a trustee In No. 11 lam also a trustee. I understood that I could put any one I chose in it. I said that No. 11 was for the whole of my people. When I threatened to keep out any of those who sold in No. 3 I only intended it as a warning. I would not have adhered to it. [Horowhenua Commission, page 193, question 280, read out.] That evidence is true. The first caveat that I know of against this land Horowhenua was lodged by Mr. Edwards under instructions from us. I consented to lease Papaitonga to Sir Walter Buller when he asked me to do so. At the time I was the only certificated owner of Horowhenua. There was nothing definite done before Sir Walter Buller went to England. When Sir Walter Buller returned from England he continued to act as my solicitor. At least, he has done so lately. I do not remember how long after he returned from England he commenced to act for me. He was not acting for me in 1894. He was when deed of release was signed. I have given leases of part of No. 14 to Sir Walter Buller— the part near the lake. Sir Walter Buller did ask me who I held No. 14 for. I told him it was my own. This was when the lease was being negotiated. He made the usual inquiries. Ido not remember Sir Walter Buller making any inquiries beyond those contained in the statutory declaration. There was no reason for Sir Walter Buller to ask me if I was a trustee, because the land was my own. Sir Walter Buller asked me if I was a trustee, and I said, " No, the land is my own." This was when lease was taken to be signed. [Horowhenua Commission, page 254, question 185, read out.] Sir Walter Buller did ask me if I was a trustee, and I told him I was not. Possibly Sir Walter Buller did not hear, or has forgotten. McDonald told me that I would get into trouble. I went to Sir Walter Buller and he advised me to get a deed of release signed. McDonald was acting for the Hunias when he told me I would get into trouble. It was when we were in Wellington petitioning about this land —not the first petition. Sir Walter Buller prepared the deed of release at that time. I do not remember whether McDonald's warning was before I signed first lease to Sir Walter Buller. Sir Walter Buller got the deed of release signed. He was then acting as my solicitor. He brought it up to me and read it over to me. The Court adjourned till the 11th instant.

Thursday, 11th March, 1897. The Court opened at 10 a.m. Present: The same. No. 1, Horowhenua No. 14, resumed. Keepa te Eangihiwinui cross-examined by Henare Apatari. Witness : My father was at Horowhenua when this land was being fought over by Te Eauparaha. I was here also, but was too young to remember. The first battle was Ohau. I know who burned Watene's house —Kawana Hunia, Mohi Mohi, and others of Muaupoko. Watene was alone. When Ngatiraukawa came in a body Kawana Hunia ran away. It was not a courageous act to burn Te Watene's house. When courage was required your party ran away and left the Muaupoko to their fate. Paki te Hunga is a descendant of Te Eiunga. I have never disputed it. He has rights in Horowhenua. I said before the Eoyal Commission that he had better

5—G. 2.