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258. Is it in a good place to put a shot ?—No. 259. Do you think, from the indications you saw, you could say whether it was a new or an old shot-hole ?—I do not know. 260. In your experience have you had a blown-out shot ?—I have seen them. 261. Is it possible to prevent them in practice ?—I hardly think it is, because you might get a blown-out shot at any time. 262. What did you tamp with in the Brunner Mine?— Principally fireclay and damp slack. 263. Did you ever have any place where you could obtain fireclay to tamp with ?—We used to get the fireclay ourselves. 264. If any fireclay did not happen to be on the floor, what did you use ? —We used to go for it. 265. Say, for instance, that two men were going to change their place, and one of them went along to fire that shot, do you think he would bring his tools with him ? —Certainly he would. 265 a. What tools would he require?—A pick and shovel to " hole " it and make it. 266. The Chairman.] But assuming the hole was already made ?—lf he went to fire that hole he would want to take his fuse and powder and tamping-iron, and he would require to scrape it out. Nobody would fire that hole if they wanted to get coal. 267. Mr. Joyce.] Why ?—Because they would not get any coal by firing it. 268. Do you consider that shot-hole was put in when the bord was being made ?—When the bord was being driven. They were driving that bord too wide, and it is my opinion that the overman had come along and refused to allow them to fire it, because a little further back you can see where there are holes in a line along the bord. 269. You think the overman came along and stopped them firing it ?—Yes; when they were driving the bord. 270. Does the fact that no tools or bodies were found in the vicinity of that hole suggest any doubt to you as to the shot being fired on the 26th of March ?—I do not think there were any bodies found there. I think the nearest found was in the incline. I think it was the body of O'Loughlin. It would be quite likely that some would be found in the bord above. 271. What do you think of gunpowder as an explosive for use in a mine ? It is gunpowder you have seen used ?—Yes. 272. Have you ever seen any other explosive used ?—Gelanite, roburite, dynamite. 273. Is roburite, in your opinion, a better or worse explosive than powder?—l did not like roburite on account of the fumes. 274. Does it produce any flame ?—I never saw any used. 275. With reference to the firing of shots, do you not think they could be fired by electricity ? —I do not think it is necessary. 276. In view of coal-dust being such a dangerous explosive as we are told it is, do you think it is safe to use any ordinary light to fire shots?— Yes ; but I am not of the opinion that coal-dust is such a dangerous thing as represented, and especially in this mine. 277. Why should it not be so dangerous in this mine ? —lt is not a dry mine ; it is damp. 278. Do you mean by that, simply damp over the surface or damp all through ? —lt is damp in most places. 279. In most places is it thoroughly damp ?—Not thoroughly damp; some parts have water running down, and some parts are only damp. 280. What was the ventilation of the mine like when you worked in it ?—Not very good where I. was. 281. What was wrong with it ?—The smoke used to hang there. 282. Was the ventilation sufficiently good to clear out the gas?— Not at all times; that is the reason we used the lamps. 283. Did you use lamps all the time ?—No. 284. Was the ventilation at that time the same as it was shortly before the explosion ?—I was not working in the Brunner Mine previous, and did not know what changes were made in the ventilation. 285. There was the same intake, and the same fan?— Yes; they did not change them. 286. Have you been through the air-return ? —Yes. 287. Do you consider that widening that return would have made the ventilation better?—l think if it was wider in places it would make it better. I would have given it more room overhead. 288. Was the air always led round the faces when you were there ?—Yes ; and the brattice was run up close to the face. If it was required, they would brattice close to the face—that was, if you had gas in your place. 289. In all cases when there was indications of gas in your time, did they put the brattice close up ?—Yes. 290. From the fact of safety-lamps having been found in Brislane and Roberts's bord, would you say that there was gas there for some time ?—Yes. 291. Assuming that there was no report in the time-book of gas having been found there previous to the 26th, do you consider that gas was found there on the 26th ?—Yes ; I never knew Morris to give lamps to anybody unless there was gas. He was a very reliable man. 292. Did you ever know lamps to be given where gas was not found ?—No. 293. Of course you cannot say whether the miners always reported gas ? —I did myself ;I do not know about other miners. 294. Do you think it is safe to use safety-lamps in one bord and in the bord immediately below use naked lights ? —Not in Brislane's bord. I think he was not coming to fresh coal. 295. Your answer is that you considered that it would be safe if safety-lamps were being used in Brislane's bord to use naked lights lower down ?—Yes. 296. And there would have been no danger at all?— There has been danger there as it appears.