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. 1000. No ; other bords ? Are the conditions in other bords the same as they would be if it had been a gas explosion accelerated by coal-dust ?—I should think so. My idea is that a great proportion of the explosions we have had in past times'have been greatly intensified by coal-dust. 1001. Leaving out the blown-out shot bord, are the conditions in other bords of the incline the same as would be produced by a firedamp explosion accelerated by coal-dust ? —I never saw a firedamp explosion that was started by coal-dust; and never having had that experience, I cannot say what the conditions would be. 1002. But you think they would be the same ? —I should think so, from the quantity of charred coal-dust; but that is only surmise. I cannot say from actual experience that it is so. 1003. I suppose that blown-out shots are common occurrences in mines?— Not by any means. 1004. Do you know that most of the English authorities go to show that blown-out shots have produced a great number of explosions since 1881 ?—They blow out; but still every blown-out shot does not produce an explosion. 1005. Certainly, under certain conditions ?—There are many conditions required to be exactly fulfilled before you get the right thing. 1006. In your opinion, would you get a better result if you used roburite and nitro-glycerine for blasting?—l have tried and have been somewhat unfortunate. We tried roburite. We had two ranges blown up in one week in Wellington through carelessness on the part of the miners in allowing the detonators of the dynamite cartridges to get away in the coal. 1007. What were you using at the time?— Dynamite. 1008. Does roburite blast well ?—We were not very well skilled, and had not a general success with it. We got one good shot out of half a dozen. 1009. I believe that you did not have a very good quality of roburite ? —That might have been so. 1010. Do you think it necessary that the fireman or some other responsible person should see that the shot is properly holed and undercut, and should fire the shot himself ?—I handed in some rules and you will see what we have done. 1011. I saw them. Do you think there is an element of danger in allowing each miner to fire his own shot ?—Yes, and there has always been. 1012. Do you not think that the man who fired that shot was negligent or careless, presuming a shot was fired?—l have seen worse shots than that fired in my place. I have seen them strike into the solid coal, and I have sacked the men for it. 1013. Do you not think this man was grossly careless? —He has not known the danger attending it. 1014. You said that you only saw gas in a couple of places; that would be a small amount of gas you would get in your lamp ? —Yes. 1015. Do you think the Davy-lamp is as good a tester for gas as you could have ?—lt is all right for an accumulation of gas ; for telling the percentage of firedamp that is in the atmosphere below the explosive point, it will not do anything of the kind. 1016. It would take you all your time to find 3 per cent, with a Davy ?—I should think it would. 1017. Do you know what percentage of firedamp and coal-dust will produce a very heavy explosion ?—We can have an explosion from coal-dust without firedamp. 1018. I understand that there are no means in New Zealand of finding 1 per cent, of gas ?—- The Mines Department have an instrument, but it is not a great success ; there are lamps in Great Britain indicating a -J- per cent. 1019. Do you not think it is necessary, in view of the explosion at Brunner, to have some means indicating a small percentage of gas ?—I certainly think so. 1020. Do you think that the stoppings were as good as could be made ?—They were the criblog stoppings. 1021. Did you see any deal-board stoppings in the Brunner Mine? —I did not notice any ;at my place we use nothing else but deal boards. There is no necessity for anything else. What you want is wind, and to carry it well. 1022. We have it in evidence that in Brislane's bord safety-lamps were being used. Ido not know whether there was gas or not in that bord, but assuming there was gas there, do you think it was right for the men outside that bord to be working with naked lights ?—That would depend upon the condition of Brislane's bord, and the reason that the lamps were there. . 1023. I am not talking about reasons—assuming the gas was there ? — No. If there was an accumulation of gas in Brislane's bord, and you were working with safety-lamps on account of that, it would certainly be wrong to work with naked lights in that district (always assuming there was an accumulation of gas). 1024. Do you think it would be safe to be working where the falls were with naked lights ?— Certainly not, and, what is more, there is no underground manager or fireman who would allow such a thing. It goes without saying that neither Roberts nor Morris would permit anything of the kind, and, what is more, the men would not do it themselves. The thing could not occur in practice. 1025. Mr. Hayes has had an experience of a man smoking his pipe when they were working the mine with safetys ?—Men are mad enough for anything, but I do not believe you would get men to work below this fall with naked lights if there was an accumulation of gas there. 1026. But the fact remains that they do it ?—Such a thing would not occur with us. I would discharge every man about the neighbourhood guilty of doing such a thing. 1027. Are you in favour of using mixed lights in mines? —No ; if it is necessary to use safetylamps in one bord, it it necessary to use them in all the districts. 1028. Miners have a great objection to working with safety-lamps, have they not ?—Yes ; it is very natural. It is a very poor light, and, in my mind, the risk is very great from falls in the sides and roofs. 12—C. 6.