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of the individual member in killing these two persons whom he found on the land. According to Maori custom that was taken to denote that possession of the land was resumed by the tribe to which the slayer of these men belonged. I instance that to show that the act of the individual was the act of the tribe, and that the two persons killed were the representatives of another tribe, whose rights to the land were thereby annulled. 1850. You were speaking just now of the spread of modern ideas among the Maoris. Do you think it an advisable thing, in the case of men of some little education—half-castes or intelligent Natives—to encourage them to get enough land cut off to farm for themselves, where they are fitted to manage them ?—Whether these better men should be encouraged to take individual titles, so far as they were concerned, by arrangement with the rest ? 1857. Yes?—l am inclined to think they should be allowed to do so, in most cases. There is no doubt about it that there is a great difference amongst the men. Some of them have come out of the jungle of old Maoridoin, and have taken to civilisation, while some of them have not. 1858. These are not the people I mention ? —I took it that the question was, whether, in the discretion of the Judge in the district, this distinction should be made. 1859. No doubt the Judge in the district would advise ?—Yes ; in all suitable cases he should have power to recommend and report. 1860. There should be authority vested in the Judge of the district, or in the central Board ?— And the Judge of the district should be able to report. 1861. In such cases the person might be permitted to arrange with the hapu or the tribe to take out a certain portion for his own occupation and use—that is, if, in the opinion of the Government officer or the Board, he is capable of managing properly for himself ?—Yes. How 7 would that affect the selling of the land ? 1862. Restrictions, no doubt, might be placed on them. I suppose you would say that, especially where there was the family to be considered ?—My opinion is that undue restrictions are sometimes placed against the alienation of the land, and it costs so much to remove them that it lessens considerably the value of the land when the man wants to sell it. I remember some years ago that I was acting as Trust Commissioner with regard to a small piece of land. I found that it had been sold by the Native to a European for £1 10s. an acre, and I found that the market-value of the land was £3 an acre. But I also ascertained that it had cost the purchaser the difference between the £1 10s. and the £3 an acre to get his title, owing to the complexity of the law and the restrictions placed around it. The administrators of the law, in the effort to protect this man's interest, had just lessened its value to him by one-half. Eeverting to the question of these wills, I think, if it be possible, some such safeguard as this should be adopted: Any document purporting to be a will should be signed either before a Justice of the Peace or some respectable European. I think, too, that in some instances the provision should be made that the parties interested should not be the wituesses to or drawers of the will. Something ought to be done, because there is otherwise a great temptation to fraud. 1863. Do you think it advisable to encourage the Natives to set aside substantial endowments for industrial schools, where the Maori children may bo taught practical farming, carpentering, bootand shoe-making, blacksmithiiig, and so on ? They would be, of course, boarding-schools, the land for the purpose being set apart by the Native owners. These farms could bs made self-supporting. Do you think, if this could be arranged with the people, it would be wise ? —Yes, I think it would be wise, but I do not think they could be induced to take it up as enthusiastically as it deserves. 1864. If they were induced to do so, do you think it would be a wise proceeding?—Yes. There is something more important than that. I mean, to teach them habits of industry—compelling them to be industrious. I was thinking of some of the Native boys who attend the schools. They are clever, they dress w 7ell; speak and read English well; they can play billiards well; they can sing a comic song well, and yet they are no good for w 7ork. They are not comfortable in their pas ; they are out of their element. They will not work, and the result is that they do nothing. Ido not know one of them who has worked at a trade for any time. They are still Maoris, but with the veneer of civilisation. There must be another generation before you can get them out of that condition. They have the savage mind still, and that is why I think they cannot settle down to any work. The young fellows are too ready to pick up the vices of the Europeans and not their better qualities. That is, speaking generally. So with the girls. There was a college at Wanganui started for the purpose of educating Maori girls, but it has stopped, and, lam inclined to think, without any real harm. The girls were brought from the pas to be educated, and they really improved wonderfully. They had a polish put on them. But after their education was over they used to go back to Maori habits again, or else they did w rorse. They did not meet with educated Maoris who would marry with them. Their home-surroundings w 7ere not suitable to them ; they were out of the sphere they had been in. The views I have expressed on this subject are simply ideas of my own. 1865. You think that the schools should be mainly industrial schools, where they would bo taught to w rork, to read, to sew—to do farming work, to carpenter, to make boots and shoes, and to acquire a knowledge of blacksinithing ?—-Yes ; where they would be taught mechanics. There would be more real good in that. But a mere book-education, and then turning them adrift, does them no substantial good, because they will not settle down to work and become good colonists or farmers. Some very few of them do, but they are really the exception. 1866. Is there any other point which you think would be worth bringing under our notice ?— Yes; I think that the practice of administering the oath in the Native Land Court might be dispensed with, the Natives, however, being given to understand that if they are found out telling lies they will be summarily punished by the Court. I think that would be a more sensible way of dealing with them. If you give the Judges power to punish it w 7ould have a salutary effect. It is, of course, a great pow 7er, and therefore let it be exercised with discretion. In fact, if they knew that the Judge had this power it would deter them from making false statements. What is the