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always agreed to, a little more, perhaps, being given. The deed was drawn there and then—the conveyance was drawn there and then, and signed by the principal men present. Very often there would be from thirty to forty—l have known as many as a hundred Natives at the old Survey Office, and the deeds were generally—as you will find by reference to a feAV of the old deeds in Wellington—signed by only a feAA'—in some cases by only two Natives. 431. _ By the representative men of the hapu ?■ —Yes. 432. Mr. Mackay.] There was a book by Mr. Turton on this subject?—Yes; there is one called " An Appendix on Native Deeds," two volumes, by Mr. Turton. 433. Mr. Bees.] Down here?—Yes, I saw them yesterday. 434. Mr. Mackay.] It is a very scarce work, and is always kept in the safes ?—Mr. Pollen had it in charge. 435. Mr. Bees.] Was that the invariable method of dealing—l do not mean merely coming to the office, and so on —but was that public dealing, carried into due effect by the representatives of the hapu, the invariable practice ?—lt was. 436. The signatures of the principal men were enough, and not those of every man, woman, and child interested?—They were. I can tell you a remarkable instance of it. About 1847 or 1848 there Avas a very serious dispute at Whaingaroa (Raglan) between Te Wherowhero's Natives, the Ngatimahuta, or the Ngatimaniapoto, and the tribe at Raglan, whose chief then Avas named Ngera— William Naylor. As hostilities threatened between them, both parties being armed to the teeth, Mr. Ligar Avent there three times, and, assisted by the present Rev. Mr. Wallace and the late Rev. Mr. Whiteley, Avho were present, managed to pacify the Natives and to keep them from hostilities. The upshot was that, as to the small piece of land called Horea —about 100 acres only—over which the dispute had arisen as a matter of honour, old Te Wherowhero agreed to take £50 for his tribal claims ; and the £50 was paid through my hands up in the Auckland Domain, in the house that used to be called Te W"herowhero's house. I had the Avritten deed in my pocket, to which Te WheroAvhero, afterwards knoAvn as King Potatau, put his moku. If I remember aright, the deed was witnessed by a celebrated man amongst the Maoris called Tamati Nopera. This settled the dispute. Nothing more was heard of it. There was frequently opposition to the sales through the hapus or the tribes disputing the ownership of the land for sale. In such cases they were always left to korero, and settle their own disputes. There was no interference on our part. These disputes were as to ownership, not as to boundaries. 437. Mr. Mackay.] They Avere settled in the runangas ? —Yes. After they had hung about here for a week, talking it over at Mechanics' Bay, they always settled it themselves. We never interfered. I have seen them in the most excited state over these disputes; but, being always left to themselves, they ended by coming to terms. They then sold the land, and I have seen them sometimes dividing the proceeds amongst themselves. 438. Mr. Bees.] These disputes that you mention were not disputes as between the bulk of the people of a tribe against their chiefs, but with people preferring distinct claims ?—Distinct claims between hapus and tribes as to ownership. 439. Mr. Mackay.] And, in fact, they arrived at a conclusion to the dispute by compromise amongst themselves ?—Yes, always amongst themselves ; and as soon as the settlement was arrived at the deed was signed. 440. Mr. Bees.] By the representative chiefs ?—Yes; and possession was taken, and a surveyor sent to do something or other. 441. In relation to these four hundred private dealings under the pre-emption rights, have you ever since that time known of any case of a claim made by the Natives to this land ? —One only. That was the case of what we called Chisholm's claim, at Slippery Creek, Drury. The area in question was about 3,000 acres. The land reA'erted to the Crown, and I believe that Chisholm got compensation ; Ido not remember. As soon as the chief (Isaac —he was afterwards a prisoner) heard of the CroAvn's claim he came to the office, and laid a claim that his tribe were imperfectly paid. He had not received the amount agreed upon, and the Government gave him an extra sum to satisfy him. The compensation paid to Isaac Avas simply £100 or £150. That is the only instance I can remember. 442. And you say that that Avas solely on the ground of inadequacy of consideration? —Yes. 443. Not on account of any claim the people behind Isaac had? The claim was by Isaac himself ? —Yes. His people Avere the relict of the old inhabitants, the Ngatitai—which means " thrown up by the tide." There was not a single claim against private individuals. That suggests a circumstance connected Avith Mr. Newman which I would like to mention. It Avas a case in Avhich the Natives, so far from repudiating their contracts, watched over the interests of the Europeans with whom they dealt. The matter cropped up in Major Matson's Court while Mr. Newman Avas away in England. 444. In relation to the Government purchases betAveen 1847 and 1854, have you known since that time any repudiation of those purchases by the Natives? —There were several. I only remember one of importance ; but there were several. 445. Did they bear a large proportion to the number of purchases or to the area of the land purchased?—No. These disputes with the Government were not as to remuneration generally, but as to the boundaries of the blocks which had been purchased. They walked over to the block so purchased, and told us quietly we hadmistaKen the boundaries—that instead of its being this creek it was that creek, or instead of its being this side of the range it was on the other side; but nothing that affected the tribal ownership. 446. Nothing was raised that affected the ownership ?—I think not. I cannot remember any instance of that kind. 447. Only as to the actual boundaries of the land included in the purchase?—l think so. There Avas one serious dispute. That was at Pukekoho, after a purchase from this same Native