1.—13.

deliberate on this point: whether that statement, as it stands, if substantiated by records and . evidence, will constitute political corruption or not ? Mr. Driver: The Committee cannot do that. The Chairman : Let us proceed with the proof you have to offer. Mr. Dargaville : I will prove it from tlie-e¥idefi«e-ei the Actuary of the Life Insurance Department, and from Mr. Forster Goring, kefe-G=ewHH»e»t-9ffieiate; Clerk of the Executive Council, and others, as well as from official documents. It would, of course, have been unbecoming on my part to have gone to these gentlemen personally and told them that I waated required them to give evidence eft-Hjy-bekaW! in this matter ; and I therefore ¥efa»e request you, as Chairman of this Committee, and by virtue of the powers vested in you by the House, to sefaeafc procure the attendance of these gentlemen. Mr. Driver: They cannot be got to-day. Mr. Dargaville : They can ; Mr. Knight, the Actuary, was on the Public Accounts Committee only half an hour ago. The Chairman: Have you any other charge that you could go on with without waiting for witnesses ? Mr. Dargaville : I am not going to make any charge on my own unsupported assertion. The Chairman : Have you any charge for which witnesses can be got more easily than these ? I have sent for the witnesses you have named, but I think it might expedite business if you had any other charge that could be gone on with in the meantime. Mr. J. E. Brown: I think the sense of the Committee should be taken as to the charge. It does not, I think, arise out of the order of reference. Mr. Dargaville: It does. I referred over and over again to the intimate relations existing between the present Government and the Bank of New Zealand; and if that does not arise out of the order of reference I do not know what does. Mr. J. G. Wilson: Of course you were aware, at the time you made your speech in the House, that this sum of money was placed to the credit of the trust funds of the Bank. Mr. Dargaville : Of course. The Chairman : Do you know whether this money was lodged with the Bank of New Zealand here or in Auckland ? Mr. Dargaville : I presume, Sir, that is immaterial. The Chairman: But my object is to expedite business; and when I asked the question I had in view the facility of procuring the necessary witnesses. Mr. Dargaville : You need not help me much in that direction; I will undertake to do my part of the business. You have put upon me the necessity of proving these things, and my witnesses will prove everything. Ido not want anything to be taken on my own bare, unsupported assertion. The Chairman : If the Committee wishes to deliberate'— Mr. J. il. Brown: Certainly ; I wish the Committee to deliberate on the question I have raised before we proceed any further. Mr. Dargaville : Is it desired, then, that I should withdraw while you are deliberating ? The Chairman : Everybody, of course. Mr. Dargaville : There is one submission I wish to make to the Committee before I withdraw, and I think it will be admitted that it is a reasonable one. It is this : I think it would, in fairness to me, be held to be questionable —I put it respectfully, and on general grounds— whether any member or members of this Committee who are pecuniarily interested in the affairs of the Bank of New Zealand should sit and vote on the question now before the Committee —on No. 1 charge. I submit that to you for your consideration as men of honour. Mr. Driver: This charge appears to be made directly against the Treasurer. Hon. Mr. Whitaker : If the Committee will permit me for a minute or two, I should like to say a few words. I presume that, in the ordinary mode of adjudicating upon matters of this kind, I should have been at liberty to be present throughout the investigation, and to take part in the proceedings. I was perfectly content to leave the whole matter in the hands of the Committee. I have not interfered in the matter in any way whatever so far ; but if I can afford the Committee information of any description whatever, or if the Committee desire to examine me, I am quite ready to waive the right of an accused person not to be examined, and am prepared to state anything I know in connection with these charges. I shall bo very glad to attend and be examined by Mr. Dargaville, if he pleases, or any of the members of the Committee, or subject myself to any cross-exami-nation, or anything that may be desired. I desire that the Committee should receive the fullest possible information I can give them on the subject; and, with regard to the Treasurer, lam authorized to say the same thing on his part. Having said that, Ido not know that I shall return to the Committee, unless something happens which seems to require my attendance. lam desirous that the whole thing should be sifted to the bottom, and I am prepared, with the Treasurer, to afford all .possible information. I presume I have a right to be present and take part in the proceedings if I desire. The Chairman: Undoubtedly. Hon. Mr. Whitaker : So far I have not thought it desirable to do so. The Chairman : I might perhaps ask you to tell the Treasurer of the charges, and he can attend the Committee if he likes. The present charge is directly a charge against him. Hon. Mr. Whitaker : Yes,; it is a matter which I myself know nothing about. I would simply remark, with regard to the charge, however, that it does not mention any date. The Chairman:- True ; but that will come out in evidence. Hon. Mr. Whitaker : But perhaps Mr. Dargaville will give us the date. Mr. Dargaville : The witnesses and records will give all that. Hon. Mr, Whitaker: Yes, but if you would tell me about what time this took place—within a year.

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