I.—2a,

10

Arama KaraTca. Aug. 2, 1880.

fixing the price for the timber, then I would have been clear about it, and would have recognized the money. 218. Had that anything to do with this lodgment for "Wi Apo's children?—No; that is separate money altogether. It had nothing to do with the trust money for "Wi Apo. 219. Did you sign that lodgment-paper? —No. 220. Do you say that is for £300 ?—All I knew was £400. 221. But do you not see that the lodgment receipt is for £300 ? —I only know of £400, because Ido not know anything about what was written at the bank. I know what was written when the money was divided. 222. Did you sign that paper without reading the figures ?—I did not sign any paper in the bank. "What I signed was a paper immediately after the money was divided between Wi Apo and Hori te More. We brought the money to the bank. I did not approach the counter. It was Mr. Nelson who was alongside the counter. 223. How did you sign that then?—l did not know about my having signed this. I know about signing the document when the money was divided out. 224. Did you sign any paper at all at the bank ?—No. 225. Did you sign that paper when you got the money?— The only paper I can remember is the one I signed when the money was paid to Wi Apo. Any one could imitate my handwriting. 226. Then look at this, and see if it is your handwriting ?—This has already been looked into before I came here. Mr. G-ittos knows everything about it. All I know is that I signed no paper at the bank. 227. Mr. Bowen.~] Examine the signature now, and see whether you believe it to be yours or not? —This signature is just like the signature I signed when the money was received. There are other papers I have signed. I imagine that this has been copied from my signature by some person or other. 228. Mr. Tomoana.~\ Did you give up the receipt quietly to Mr. Sheehan, or how was it that it came into his possession ?—Mr. Sheehan came into the bank, and asked Mr. Nelson who had the receipt. Mr. Nelson said, "Arama Karaka has got it." Then he turned round to me, and asked me to give it to him. Mr. Sheehan looked at it, and put it into his pocket. I said, " No; leave it with me." He said, "No ; it is better with me." Nelson said, "It is just as well it is so, because you are both trustees for the children." 229. Was that the paper that you said you signed ? —-No; that is not the paper I signed. The paper I signed was the one that was presented when the money was divided. The man in the bank, after he had done some writing on a slip of paper, did not call out to me, but handed it to Mr. Nelson, and Nelson handed the paper to me. He said, "Now everything is right." It was at this time Mr. Sheehan appeared on the scene, got possession of the paper, and took it with him. 230. Major Te Wheoro.~\ When the money was divided between Wi Apo and Hori te More, Wi Apo got £450. Who got the £50?— In speaking over this matter I remarked to them, " Why do not you ask the children to pay for the survey instead of getting me to pay for it ? I have paid £100 for the survey." They said, " Your £100 will be refunded." They gave me the £50 on account of the survey. 231. When it was decided that the £400 should be paid on behalf of the children, did you sign any document there ? —I signed at the time. When the money was divided out I signed the paper. 232. Was it a paper something like this that you signed [deposit receipt produced] ? —No ; it was an ordinary paper that I signed. I did not sign a document like that. 233. Did you not sign any other piece of paper like this after the money had been divided out ?— No ; I did not sign any other paper after the money had been divided. The paper which was given by the bank was a white one, not a red one. 234. Were the contents of the paper that you signed made clear to you —I mean the paper you signed at the time the money was divided? —All that was done was this : They said, " Come here and sign your name." I went and signed my name. Then the other person was called, and he did so in like manner. Te Hemara was the witness. He was a disinterested party. 235. Mr. Bowen.~\ I understand you, to say that £450 was the share of the children, and £50 was paid to you for survey, and that you understand that £400 was put into the bank, while the bank slip shows £300. When did you first find out that it was £300 and not £400 ? —I had nothing to do with the money after it was paid into the bank at that time, and I was always under the impression that it was £400. I first knew about the time that those cheques were drawn, when Mr. dittos and I went to the bank. He can explain that much more clearly than I can.

Tuesday, Sed August, 1880. Aeaha Kaeaka re-examined. 236. Mr. Sheehm.} "What was the name of the block of land in respect to which these moneys were paid ?—Pakiri. 237. Do you remember when the land went through the Court?—l cannot remember, but I know it passed through the Court. 238. "Who surveyed the land ?—Te Kiri and other Natives. 239. Did he know that the land was about to be put through the Court? —Yes. 240. Do you remember the persons in whose favour the decision was given ? —Tes. I remember the land going through the Court. Te Kiri arranged with you (Mr. Sheehan) to act as a lawyer in the case in such a way as to keep me out. 241. "Who told you that ?—I knew from the fact of your appearing as a lawyer. 242. Did I appear in this case at all in Court ?—I knew that you were acting as a lawyer for the purpose of getting me out of the block, and "Wi Apo into it, and that the whole thing was worked by Te Kiri and not by you.

Aroma Karaka. Aug. 3, 1880.