&.— 2

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1334. Have you any reason to suppose that the system pursued has led to any other cases, within the West Coast confiscated land, of similar irregularities?—No. 1335. We find, amongst the charges against the Waimate Plains, an amount paid to Mr. Macka3 r of £300, and to Mr. Blake, £50. That appears to be for interviews with Te Whiti when they went to Parihaka. Do you remember the facts ? —I remember the facts. Mr. Mackay was gazetted to the office of Special Commissioner for the settlement of the disputes then existing. This payment was for services rendered and expenses incurred prior to his appointment being gazetted. 1336. Did he receive anything more than that?—The following are the sums paid to Mr. Mackay. Charged to Waimate Plains: May, 1879: Por services and expenses re settlement of claims to lands between Waingongoro and New Plymouth, £300. July, 1879 : Por services re settlement of claims to lands between Waingongoro and New Plymouth, £100. —Charged to Native Contingencies Vote: Salary, July and August, 1879, as Special Commissioner for West Coast Land Inquiry, at £650, £108 6s. 8d. —Charged to Vote for Land Purchases, Taranaki District: Salary from Ist September as Special Commissioner, £130. —Total, £638 6s. Bd. 1337. That was in your department ? —His whole salary was charged to the Native Land Purchase Department. He had a regular salary, and outside expenses besides. If there is any further information in the Native Office on the matter I will have no difficulty in obtaining it. 1338. The Civil Commissioner has informed us that money paid to Titokowaru was not allowed to appear on the vouchers in his own name: why was that ? —lf I remember right, Major Brown or Mr. Parris made a present to Titokowaru of a saddle. The voucher was made out for Titokowaru, with his name as usual; but the Controller-General drew the attention of the Native Minister to the fact that money was being spent improperly, in making presents to a man who he said, I think, had a reward offered for his head. I may, perhaps, not be quite accurate as to this, but I know the Controller drew attention to the fact that the saddle was ordered for Titokow raru. 1339. Was it not the case that, when the instructions of Sir Donald McLean of January, 1872, were being first carried out, your department proceeded on the system of requiring regular deeds of cession for the land acquired within the confiscated territory, whenever it was intended to bring land so acquired within the votes under the Public Works Act ? —Yes. 1340. At what time was it that the change took place in that system, by substituting payments under takoha for deeds of cession ? —My attention was first called to it in August, 1876. 1341. And did you take any step on the subject in your department ?•—I asked Major Brown the reason why, in the case of two blocks of land, the Okahutiria and Opaku, of which he considered the purchase completed, no deeds of' cession had been forwarded as theretofore; and I got this reply from him by telegram : " The Okahutiria and Opaku Blocks are confiscated land, and I am instructed by Sir Donald McLean not to purchase such lands or take conveyances. What is given is compensation for former rights previous to its becoming Crown land through confiscation.—C. Brown, CO." 1342. And was it in accordance with the new instructions, so understood by the Civil Commissioner, that since then the payments made for land within confiscated territory on the West Coast have been charged as takoha, and without your requiring deeds of cession ?—Yes.

At Wellington, Thursday, 3bd June, 1880. Mr. B. J. Gill further examined. 1343. The Commissioners.] In your evidence on the 12th May, you undertook to obtain any further information regarding the vouchers then before us: have you done so ?—I have. [For the vouchers referred to in this evidence, see Appendix B.] 1344. At that time, your examination had been confined to the vouchers which had already been produced for the £1,000 supposed to have been paid to Teira. What other vouchers are there of a similar kind? —I produce a voucher for £100 paid to Tuanini, and one for £100 to Eangipokau and others. " Eangipokau "is one other of Titokowaru's names. 1345. Is it the case in this instance too, that the money for which the voucher is signed never reached the hands of the Natives ? —I produce a statement showing the particulars of the expenditure of this £200, giving the names of the persons to whom the money was actually paid. 1346. It seems by that statement, that £50 was paid to Patohi, £30 to Hone Pihama, £30 to Mete Kingi, £20 to Wi Ari, £1 to Teira, £3 to Hore, and £6 to Paranihi; aud the rest of the money, according to the sub-vouchers produced, was paid to Europeans. Is that not so ?—Yes, as shown in the statement. 1347. What other vouchers of the same kind are there?—There are also vouchers for £200 paid to Ngahina, £200 to Tamanui, and £100 to Eaukura; amounting altogether to £500. 1348. Have you a similar list of that expenditure, showing the names of the persons to whom the £500 was actually paid ? —I produce it. 1349. Does it not appear by that statement that £17 was paid to Titokowaru, but that the other sums were paid to Europeans ? —lt is so according to the statement, but I may say that I have not a receipt for the payment to Titokowaru. 1350. We observe that out of the £500, a sum of £339 lis. was paid for what seem to be unusual items, such as ladies' side-saddles, habits, velvets, silks, French merino, shawls, lockets, and ribbons. Is it usual, in the accounts of the Land Purchase Department dealing with payments made to Natives, that items of this class should be charged to the acquisition of land ? —Certainly not. 1351. Are there any more vouchers of a like kind? —I have another voucher respecting £100 paid to Kerepu. I produce a list of the sub-vouchers to this voucher. 1352. In one of these vouchers we observe that there is an expenditure for fancy biscuits, cocoa, salmon, sardines, jam, port wine, brandy, old torn, oysters, mullet, and tins of fruit: is that kind of expenditure usual to be charged to the acquisition of land ? —No. 1353. Is that the last of this sort of vouchers ? —No: there are two others in respect of the payment of £100 to Mawhiti, and £100 to Karira. I produce a list of these also.